Worldly Life is Mysticism

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rideforever
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by rideforever » Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:48 am

You don't have a spirit of discussion.

If you want some more answers, just scroll up and re-read.
I was proud, and I demanded the finest teacher
.. .. and when he appeared
.. .. .. .. I was so small

the key master
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by the key master » Tue Jul 24, 2012 4:07 pm

rideforever wrote:You don't have a spirit of discussion.

If you want some more answers, just scroll up and re-read.
:roll:

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:24 pm

Yikes! What happened here---it looks like something exploded into multi-complexity.

I have discovered a lot of beautiful and tender things along my journey through Life--and among them, I have learned that the Truth is Simple. The Truth is Sweet and Gentle and Simple and Real.

The more complex we think it is, the further are from It.

Tying complex intellectual knots may be cleaver, and you might have fun doing it--- but it is clearly not Love, nor will it bring Peace :roll:

I think I'll skip the sideshow :lol: And stick with the my own way.

When I was a little girl there was a sweet song I used to love to sing and dance to ---and the premise of the song was that Simplicity Is The Gift. That when you find the Truth you find Simplicity, Freedom, Love and Delight.

I have returned to that child who had it right all along.

You know, somewhere it was said in some old Buddhist story that in order for God to prevent the Truth from being found by those who might use or abuse it, He wisely decided that the best way to keep it safe would be to make it simple and hide it in the Heart. 8)
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

the key master
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by the key master » Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:24 pm

SandyJoy wrote:Yikes! What happened here---it looks like something exploded into multi-complexity.

I have discovered a lot of beautiful and tender things along my journey through Life--and among them, I have learned that the Truth is Simple. The Truth is Sweet and Gentle and Simple and Real.
How can Truth have qualities like sweet and gentle. It sounds like you're projecting your own self image into your idea of what truth is. I absolutely concur that truth couldn't be more simple, which is why I don't waste time defining it and deceiving people. Tell the 3 year old homeless gypsy sleeping in the street covered in flies how gentle the truth is. She might beg to differ.

The more complex we think it is, the further are from It.

Tying complex intellectual knots may be cleaver, and you might have fun doing it--- but it is clearly not Love, nor will it bring Peace :roll:
My focus is on untying knots over here, and its not surprising when the mind identification gets threatened by this.
He wisely decided that the best way to keep it safe would be to make it simple and hide it in the Heart. 8)
Finally something I can rez with. 8)

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:53 pm

The thread was started by Rideforever, and it began with such a lovely premise.

Rideforever had seen how Mystical Life Is, just as It is. I think that is really wonderful; Seeing that this world experience is Mysticism Itself.

The Mystic and the Child are the same. Only the Mystic now knows what he has found. In other words, the child does not know he knows, but he is living It. However, the Mystic has made the whole trip through 'adulthood being the old man' and by Grace he returns to the child's knowing, he finds the child again and the child's knowing ---the pristine, unadulterated, pure, unbound self---- and now he knows he knows.

Now we see and feel Life again like a child sees and feels, but we know what have this time around. It is Mystical. We are living in and as the Wonder Itself. All of us have known It. Now we return and are directly feeling all the sensations we once knew as a child, we alive with the vitality and Wonder of Life again.

Rideforever was saying that the Illumined state of being is seeing the world as the Living Mystery Itself.

Well, those are my words, but I think that he had a good point.
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

the key master
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by the key master » Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:03 pm

SandyJoy wrote:The thread was started by Rideforever, and it began with such a lovely premise.

Rideforever had seen how Mystical Life Is, just as It is. I think that is really wonderful; Seeing that this world experience is Mysticism Itself.

The Mystic and the Child are the same. Only the Mystic now knows what he has found. In other words, the child does NOT know he knows, but the Mystic has made the whole trip through 'adulthood being the old man' and by Grace he returns to the child's knowing, the child again---the pristine, unadulterated, pure, unbound self and now Knowing He Knows.
So there's a child and a mystic and they're the same, but one knows he knows and the other does NOT know he knows. I'm not sure if I've come across a more illogical statement my entire time posting on this forum. But, I suppose your truth excludes logic like it excludes the homeless gypsy.
Rideforever was saying that the Illumined state of being is seeing the world as the Living Mystery Itself.

Well, those are my words, but I think that he had a good point.
He was actually saying that whenever thought appears, you are identified with your mind. Did you miss that part, or is mind identification apparent every time someone opens their mouth? That would make Eckhart and yes your beloved William Samuel deluded. Does that sit well with you? IT didn't with me, so I addressed it, and was ignored. I'm just pointing out the knots. Peeps gotta untie em themselves, and i have no stake in whether that happens or not. Don't shoot the shoe salesman 8)

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:09 am

I think I have to bow out with you---you are always on a totally different 'wave length' than I am. But, I did engage you here, so I shall write this from where I am and just assume it will not be received well:

Yes, the child just knows, just lives it, does not know he is living anything 'special'. He skips and sings and plays, he imagines and wonders and feels all the sensations of Life; immersed, drenched, soaking in sights and sounds and fragrances and smells and textures, feeling Life ---the child is just pure unadultered Being fully aware and unconditioned.

Then we move along and grow up---the child seems to leave us. We are being told we must grow up or we are wanting very much to grow up, we want to be an adult ---the joyful spirit becomes clouded, veiled, fogged by the beliefs we have taken on as we become more and more caught up in the adulthood, the old man, the one who is duped by the system, the game, but does not know he has bought into lies.

We get covered over in lies, in beliefs, in systems, in concepts. We live with a shell over our heart and soul and being. We struggle, we worry, we feel responsible. We believe that adventure, sports, money, success, fame, a tangible human love will make us happy---but the cover over our True Identity just gets more complex and cloudy and confusing and none of those things can take the mist off our soul.

The fearless pure child we were has long ago been put aside and forgotten.

But, somewhere along the line, if we are lucky or if by some rare meeting with Grace --- we find the Child again. Somewhere along the line we are stripped down, bare and vulnerable, and at that point, blessed be, the Child returns.

Now, upon this re-discovery, we know the Beauty and Peace of what we have found. Peace, sweet peace. There is nothing like it, it is Real, it is deep and abides despite the circumstances or situations. This is It, we know It.

Now we are the child again, but now we know the treasure of what we have because we know what it was like when we lost Its presence in our life. The world does not call those who know and know they know "the child" they call them the Mystic. We do not call Eckhart a Child, we call him a mystic---but he has certainly returned to being very vulnerable and unbound childlike. That's all I was saying-- Because Rideforever was talking about Mysticism.

As for excluding logic---maybe, I have found that the Truth is not logical. I certainly can find no words for It are logical and I wouldn't even try. The Truth is Unbound and Illimitable and therefore does not stay in line with the logical view. Light, Life, Truth, Mind, Awareness includes logic, but I don't think you could ever explain Reality/God with logic. It takes the Heart to know It---though I think it is wonderful to try to share what we understand with words---but there are many other ways to make it plain to others.

Intellect is not thrown out, but it does not rule the roost.

I have never known a homeless gypsy, I have never seen one---However, if I imagine that meeting, I hope that I would be the sweet gentle love that could somehow find the words that might sooth her weary soul. Although, words might not help, but they also might---I could give her something, perhaps to help, a coat, some food, some money----I don't know, but I would do what I could---there is a spirit behind the words if they come from Love and depending on how that person was accepting or not--- Maybe my words would do some good---one never knows what living miracles Love can or will manifest as---Who knows what would transpire---but Love has its way---ways I cannot predict, but ways that are always, inevitably, without doubt unfolding toward nothing but Good.
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by HermitLoon » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:32 am

Yes SandyJoy!
The great beauty and peace and joy of the language-less universe(nature, infants,etc.) is that "right" and "wrong" do not exist.
Peace

the key master
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by the key master » Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:42 am

sandy said,
I think I have to bow out with you-
I hope we can still be friends :)

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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by smiileyjen101 » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:02 am

The great beauty and peace and joy of the language-less universe(nature, infants,etc.) is that "right" and "wrong" do not exist.
As ever HermitLoon the quiet whisper of truth rings loud illuminating the fears that would separate one perspective from another.

Love is capable of shining light even on the mischief or mis-take of throwing punches at the shadows of fears while espousing 'someone hit me first', without making it personal, without making a 'wrong' of it, but by illuminating the fear into the no thing that it is.

This too is the experience of the growing child.

If the child resists this, makes enemy, obstacle, means to an end of this quiet truth they turn inward seeing only the shadows grow stronger and creating the bigger/denser story to ward off the lightness of being.

Light seen outside of this cave of fear are felt both as enticing and threatening.

If there is no fear then the 'good point' can be seen in anything by shifting perspective. If there is resistance/fear then no good point will be seen in anything as the position will be considered as solid.

Truth knows no adjectives that define it or confine it, only perspectives do.
Truth is all things illuminated without shadows, moving freely across perspectives of experience.

Within free illumination there is no mystery - all thing are brought into the light.

SandyJoy read Keymaster's posts in the 'voice', the love, of your best friend, and you'll see that he was there all along.
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:55 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:SandyJoy read Keymaster's posts in the 'voice', the love, of your best friend, and you'll see that he was there all along.
Oh, jen, I know that :D i just do not understand anything he writes one little iota---so it is foolish to enter a conversation. But, as they say, its me---not him--- I am the goofball, not him--- I just have to let it go.

I need things to be said very straight and simple---Key Master is way over my head---

I'll just keep reading Hall Mark cards--- :lol:
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by smiileyjen101 » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:35 am

SandyJoy, don't underestimate yourself, you are absolutely up to this, one thing at a time.
SandyJoy said: I need things to be said very straight and simple
Let's break it down then...

SandyJoy said: Rideforever was saying that the Illumined state of being is seeing the world as the Living Mystery Itself.

Well, those are my words, but I think that he had a good point.
So that was your interpretation of what another was saying, okay, here's another perspective of what was being said.
Keymaster said: He was actually saying that whenever thought appears, you are identified with your mind. Did you miss that part, or is mind identification apparent every time someone opens their mouth?

That would make Eckhart and yes your beloved William Samuel deluded.

Does that sit well with you? IT didn't with me, so I addressed it, and was ignored.
.

Does that interpretation sit well with you?

Is it at odds with what you've interpreted from ET and WS?

Keymaster said: My focus is on untying knots over here.
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:56 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:Keymaster said: He was actually saying that whenever thought appears, you are identified with your mind. Did you miss that part, or is mind identification apparent every time someone opens their mouth?

That would make Eckhart and yes your beloved William Samuel deluded.

Does that sit well with you? IT didn't with me, so I addressed it, and was ignored.

Ah Ha! Thanks Jen--- i think I found the problem for me---

I do not know what "mind identification' is :roll:

what is that?

Do you mean identifying as 'my thoughts'? Is that what that means?

If so, then no it does not sit well with me :lol:
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by smiileyjen101 » Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:16 am

See SandyJoy, you are more than up to it!!

Gees as far as 'knots' go this one is pretty tangled - here's an admission, it's far easier for me to play 'umpire' than it is for me to join in the game because I had no idea even from what rideforever said. :?

In fairness, here's what rideforever said that Keymaster responded to... (untangle, untangle, oops slipped on a knot.... :wink: )
rideforever wrote:
Thoughts function in time clinging to the past or future.
If you are wondering or thinking you are not in the Now. Because you are identified with your mind.
And now, for me because I may even be getting a grasp of this myself with thanks to you SJoy, here's Key Master's response - spaced for my 'attention-absorption capacity in any moment of 'now' ' :wink:
Key Master said: I'm not really sure how a thought could cling to the past or future.
This I can resonate with too if a thought arises into form it is 'now' that form has arisen in.
Key Master said: But anyhoo, maybe we could say,

the appearance of thought creates the illusion of time and space, which in turn provides context to the ideas of then and now.
Okay, I'm still 'here' so far. Still on track SandyJoy? How about you rideforever?
Key Master said:
You say that if you are thinking you are not in the now because you are identified with your mind.

According to that logic, its not possible to think and not be mind identified, which would actually implicate that anyone relaying such a teaching is firmly embedded in their own delusion.
...unravel, unravel... because that would mean they had to 'think' or be in thought to manifest the thoughts that manifested,... okay...
Key Master said:
Another assumption implicit in the statement is that its actually possible to "not be in the Now".
Wherever I am, there I am, okay the strings rolling right out now.
Key Master said:
What's even meant by this?

Who is there to not be in the Now?

If the appearance of thought makes one "not in the now", does this not imply that one actually is thought or the thinker?

And is that not the core delusion we claim to be uprooting?
Those questions and answers were kind where we came (back) in SJoy.

See, we can play with the 'big boys' :lol:
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

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SandyJoy
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Re: Worldly Life is Mysticism

Post by SandyJoy » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:50 am

Oh Dear, Jen, now that got me confused again--- I think you can play withe big boys---I am going to let this go, as I say, I have no idea what all this was about---I think I might not have understood at all---So I take it all back.

But, I would like to say that I have discovered that there really is only one Awareness and that It is the functioning of Divine Mind. This Awareness right here, this knowing, this self Identity I am, right now is all and only ever God alone going on---there is no other. There appears to many, but those are the fractal images in the mirror of God's Mind---We are the Identity of God's Self knowing. Made in His image and Likeness. Mind is God and God is Mind and there is only one. Mind and Its functioning as This Awareness.

No matter what we think or how much we think or if we think or not---we can never be separate or outside of God's Awareness. Now that I know for sure.

We cannot ever be something other than God's Awareness. Here and Now is the same as Awareness. Awareness is Identity. No matter what I might think, I cannot ever really be something I am not. Its impossible. Everything is pure Light, Information, Isness Being and who we are is the Perfect Isness of God's Self Knowing.

Life, the Universe entire is God's Self-knowing and there is no 'outside' of God's Infinite Totality.

I have no fear or concern about thinking---nor do i think we should try to stop thinking. I think thinking is wonderful. I think it is the whole reason for Mind---Mind would not be Mind if it was not thinking, knowing, functioning information---Nor do I believe thinking can cause any one to be "out side' of Mind or be less than the Light of Truth You Are.

Anyway, Holographic Universe and all that --- I am just the Living Light of Life and Life's Self Being which is Perfect, Complete, and Whole---and the joy of thinking and wondering, being Me and being you---It is all the wonder of a living mystical marvel to realize. Thoughts and ideas, and things and concepts and all the stuff and things and time are the images of God. There is just simply no problem.

There is only God and God's functioning. This tangible world experience is the functioning Awareness of Mind/God.

We are Self Knowing Awareness, our Identity is Life Itself. Thinking is good--- Self is good---All that is is God--- its all Self.

There is only one Self.

It is best not be so concerned with thoughts or give them power or authority over the Awareness being them ---all thoughts belong to Divine Mind, and there is no other someone they can belong to. There is only one Awareness; this one, right here, right now.

Well, it's late here, I have spent too much time with this thread---and really I have to just let it be--- I cannot explain any more.
Last edited by SandyJoy on Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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