If we are all one consciousness then why...?

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pulgasari2012
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If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by pulgasari2012 » Tue Nov 13, 2012 10:03 am

Here is a question that I have often asked myself and have never been able to answer.

If we are all one consciousness then why are we not able to become aware of other peoples thoughts?

It seems the most reasonable explanation for consciousness is that the brain is a machine that generates an individuals consiousness.
Allowing the individual to be conscious of their own mind/thoughts but not the mind/thoughts of others.

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rideforever
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by rideforever » Tue Nov 13, 2012 10:34 am

If we are all one, then why am I writing to You ?

If we are all one, why is there anything ?

If we are all one, how is it possible to have sex with a beautiful girl ?
I was proud, and I demanded the finest teacher
.. .. and when he appeared
.. .. .. .. I was so small

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Marcel Franke
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by Marcel Franke » Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:56 am

Lucky bastar..uh..bastarelorelorelorio ...
---ooOoo---

the key master
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by the key master » Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:55 pm

pulgasari2012 wrote:Here is a question that I have often asked myself and have never been able to answer.

If we are all one consciousness then why are we not able to become aware of other peoples thoughts?

It seems the most reasonable explanation for consciousness is that the brain is a machine that generates an individuals consiousness.
Allowing the individual to be conscious of their own mind/thoughts but not the mind/thoughts of others.
I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness. Something perceived, the brain, isn't the source of the world of perception. Something appearing in consciousness isn't responsible for other things appearing in consciousness. If you can see that, the foundation of the question falls to pieces, along with the imaginary person who thinks its perceiving stuff.

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rideforever
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by rideforever » Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:36 pm

the key master wrote:I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness. Something perceived, the brain, isn't the source of the world of perception. Something appearing in consciousness isn't responsible for other things appearing in consciousness. If you can see that, the foundation of the question falls to pieces, along with the imaginary person who thinks its perceiving stuff.
Nice.

Is there an easy way to demonstrate this to a layperson ?
I was proud, and I demanded the finest teacher
.. .. and when he appeared
.. .. .. .. I was so small

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Marcel Franke
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by Marcel Franke » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:27 pm

pulgasari2012 wrote:Here is a question that I have often asked myself and have never been able to answer.

If we are all one consciousness then why are we not able to become aware of other peoples thoughts?

Are there other people with thought ?
---ooOoo---

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rachMiel
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by rachMiel » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:53 pm

the key master wrote:I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness.
This is a take, an interpretation. And a lovely interpretation it is. But there is nothing, save personal insight, to prove it with certainty. It might be true. It might be a beautiful fairy tale. One cannot, ultimately, know. And therein lies the rub. ;-)
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

the key master
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by the key master » Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:09 pm

rideforever wrote:
the key master wrote:I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness. Something perceived, the brain, isn't the source of the world of perception. Something appearing in consciousness isn't responsible for other things appearing in consciousness. If you can see that, the foundation of the question falls to pieces, along with the imaginary person who thinks its perceiving stuff.
Nice.

Is there an easy way to demonstrate this to a layperson ?
In your nightly dreams, when you go to sleep, the dreaming mind creates a dreamscape and populates it with people, plants, and places. The dreaming mind is not limited to the character its playing in the dream, as its actually creating everything else in the dream as well. Its not like the dragon you ride off to do battle with is anything other than your creation. Seeing that might lead one to putting their sword away, and then you and the dragon can go to Mickey D's and share a Big Mac as you contemplate how to capture that rascally unicorn. You aren't limited to 'you' in the dream, nor the dragon, nor the Big Mac. You're offset calling the shots from the outside.

Similarly, in waking life, all form is a creation of consciousness, and even that misses the mark. All form is consciousness, in the same way everything in your dream is being created by the mind and yet is the mind itself. Consciousness creates and perceives simultaneously, while all the while never becoming bound by anything in the dream. The dreamworld that most folks think they live in is incredibly flimsy and in need of constant patching and dry walling to even resemble something that contains any semblance of reality to it. Reality is outside the personal world, which was never anything more than a dream.

the key master
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by the key master » Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:20 pm

rachMiel wrote:
the key master wrote:I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness.
This is a take, an interpretation. And a lovely interpretation it is. But there is nothing, save personal insight, to prove it with certainty. It might be true. It might be a beautiful fairy tale. One cannot, ultimately, know. And therein lies the rub. ;-)
How can an appearance be the source of an appearance? How can something in the realm of form be the source of anything else in that realm? If you see those ideas aren't true, then you don't need some new idea to replace it. You're left with an absence, which mind can do nothing with.

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Marcel Franke
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by Marcel Franke » Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:55 pm

the key master wrote:
rachMiel wrote:
the key master wrote:I think the most common misconception in the human race is that the human brain is the source of consciousness. The brain, like all form, is an appearance in consciousness.
This is a take, an interpretation. And a lovely interpretation it is. But there is nothing, save personal insight, to prove it with certainty. It might be true. It might be a beautiful fairy tale. One cannot, ultimately, know. And therein lies the rub. ;-)
How can an appearance be the source of an appearance? How can something in the realm of form be the source of anything else in that realm? If you see those ideas aren't true, then you don't need some new idea to replace it. You're left with an absence, which mind can do nothing with.
Is what is called consciousness an appearance ?
If not, how can form appeare -in- it ? What is -out- of it ?
If it is an appearance, then there is only appearance.
How can there, in only appearance, be something -in- appearance ?
---ooOoo---

the key master
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by the key master » Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:16 pm

Marcel Franke wrote: Is what is called consciousness an appearance ?
If not, how can form appeare -in- it ? What is -out- of it ?
If it is an appearance, then there is only appearance.
How can there, in only appearance, be something -in- appearance ?
The initial assumption in the question is that the brain has an objective existence. It actually doesn't. The subject object split is an illusion. There are no separate appearances. Creation is perception. :mrgreen:

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Marcel Franke
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by Marcel Franke » Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:24 pm

the key master wrote: The subject object split is an illusion. There are no separate appearances.
But the illusionary splitting, does exist, or doesnt it ?
---ooOoo---

the key master
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by the key master » Tue Nov 13, 2012 8:11 pm

Marcel Franke wrote:
the key master wrote: The subject object split is an illusion. There are no separate appearances.
But the illusionary splitting, does exist, or doesnt it ?

Doesn't. More pointedly, the splitter doesn't exist. The split between subject object is a result of a movement appearing to the subject, and we conceptualize that moving entity as a mind so it can be 'noticed' that 'you' aren't that. There's nothing more to the experience of being a person than that movement, and you've never been anything more or less than the subject of that movement, which isn't a person, and actually isn't anything at all.

pulgasari2012
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by pulgasari2012 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:16 am

I understand your argument.
The mind/thoughts are simply forms that are appearing in consciousness
They are just forms that consciousness is aware of.

However if this consciousness is without boundries then why am I only aware of my own mind/thoughts?

The fact as far as I can tell is that there is a clear boundry as to where consciousness can go.
My consciousness can be aware of my thoughts but cannot be aware of my friends thoughts.
This is clearly a boundry.

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Marcel Franke
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Re: If we are all one consciousness then why...?

Post by Marcel Franke » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:12 am

Splitting.
But isnt that this lingual/logical capacity ?
The capacity to discriminate ?
Isnt that what we are doing here, communicating ?
Isnt that what language is about ?
Virtual splitting.
Even thought the experience of this splitting itself is direct.
(Therefore, it can never be the complete reality.)
But I think you cannot deny the the process of splitting.
It also reminds me of a Dutch guru who said:
Before you deny (de-know) something,
you must have known it.
Saying, this is, this is not...
---ooOoo---

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