Unbiased observer

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Unbiased observer
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Unbiased observer

Post by Unbiased observer » Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:25 am

Seems that how one goes about sprouting the Observer is a mystery. An even greater mystery, seems to be, the inability, by those who’ve transcended, to pass that epistemological insight on.
A mystery that the Buddha himself could not solve (flowers notwithstanding), the countless adherence of Zen Buddhism that set for many years never having achieved a shift In consciousness.
Eckhart Tolle (to whom I owe my essence) Jiddu Krishnamurti, Ramana Maharshi or Amoda Maa, I dare say, were and are unable to solve this puzzle, but bless them for ceaselessly trying, as did the Buddha.
Krishnamurti famously said “experience is not transferable” so how are the Observer seeds to be planted?
One thing I think I can say with almost certainty, is that meditation will not lead to the creation of the Witness.
The Buddha attained Wakefulness when he ceased extreme meditative techniques and found the middle way, best I can tell Tolle, Maa, Krishnamurti or Maharshi were not serious meditators, if at all, at the time they experienced their epiphanies.
Meditation is much sweeter once the Observer is in bloom and the roots have begun to penetrate the cortex. I believe that in some instances meditation can be detrimental to the uninitiated “Monkey mind” resulting in emotional instability.
I think it’s critical, nothing more important, than for us to discover how the Observer is created. Our very existence as the human race may depend on that discovery.
Clearly with more and more people awakening, we know that this shift in consciousness is not a myth.
I believe the answer to Observer creation is scientific.
I believe neuroscience will be able to solve the conundrum. (neuroplasticity being the key)

There is also a psychological component to Observer creation. What did the Buddha, Maharshi, Krishnamurti, Tolle or Maa all have in common just prior their Awakening? ( “self-annihilation” or at least the initiation of annihilation)

Without the Observer nothing “spiritual” is possible.

My apologies to those mentioned above for the things I got wrong.

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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by kiki » Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:27 pm

Welcome to the community, Unbiased observer.

The Observer isn't "created", it is always present as one's true and fundamental essence. Enlightenment/awakening/Observer are one in the same and are revealed as that true and fundamental essence when that which obscures its presence has dropped away. In the absence of all manner of obscuration what remains is the simple, unadorned, silent, still, peaceful knowingness of consciousness itself. That knowingness/consciousness is an impersonal observer that has no particular viewpoint that is narrowly confined as "mine". In other words, there is just observing going on with nothing attaching itself onto it - no "me" that lays claim to observing anything. Enlightenment, therefore, is the realization of what's already here right now in its fullness.

You don't "owe" your essence to Tolle or any other teacher. At best, teachers can be effective pointers to that essence and help you redirect where attention has been habituated to go. Then you may feel you owe your appreciation to them for their assistance in your awakening. They can challenge you to question long-held assumptions about who/what you really are so that you can see for yourself what is true and what isn't, and point out those things which are still getting in the way of clarity. Correct, they can't give you experience or enlightenment. It isn't possible to "give" someone enlightenment, something they fundamentally already have, only point out that it's already present and "here's why you aren't seeing it..." and "here's something to point you in the right direction in order to realize it for yourself...". In the final analysis, waking up simply happens on its own, but skillful looking/investigation by you aides in that. But, they can see where problems arise and reorient you in such a way as to allow reality to be seen more easily.

"Seeds" aren't planted that will later blossom into the "Observer" since the observer is always present (unless, of course, you are referring to seeds as "pointers"). If it wasn't already present nothing could possibly be known because "knowingness" comes only from consciousness. Even in the unawakened state "knowing" is fully functional, it's just that ego/me/mind has laid claim to that knowing, and that is the source of all manner of confusion.

Rather, all that which diverts attention away from the ever-present Observer are gradually seen through as illusory, and when that happens they tend to drop away. The primary obscuring agent to reality is the conditioned mental process that gives the illusion of a separate entity, commonly referred to as "me"/ego, and its attachments that help hold it together. An honest and direct investigation into the nature of the ego/me will gradually undermine it and its grip begins to loosen more and more. As that takes hold there is growing abidance in/as the consciousness that is always present. The formerly "personal viewpoint" of a separate ego/mind is replaced by the impersonal viewpoint of consciousness/Observer.

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I try to make an effort to not leave a reader with dualistic ideas/thinking from my explanations, so the bottom line here is your critique and mine may very well be a difference in terminology and how we phrase things. With that in mind, you may want to investigate how dualistic ideas remain after explaining what is ultimately nondualism. That creates confusion in others because right now I am seeing confusion in what you have concluded, and that confusion can be passed onto others, thus delaying their awakening. My apologies if I've misread you.

However, all explanations of nondualism are dualistic by nature and rather confusing since they rely on concepts, and what is beyond concept can't be adequately explained. I think Tolle, Krishnaumurti, Buddha, Ramana Marharshi many other notable teachers all knew/know this as evidenced by their teachings. "This" is hard to convey, but once it is seen their teachings become even more clear. Even controversial teachers like OSHO come across as brilliant once you see for yourself what they are saying and how they are pointing to it.

kiki
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Sighclone » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:45 am

Welcome Unbiased observer -

May I requote Jean Klein, from "In Touch" by John Prendergast:

"Do not fornicate with the witness."

Klein makes the point that becoming attached to an identity as a separate witness is a trap common to long-time meditators who can sit in observation of their thoughts. Prendergast goes on to say (p. 95) "Even as witnessing happens, there is no separate witness."
When the witness and "that which is witnessed" merge in luminous stillness there is progress. The witness is a checkpoint, not the finish line. And there is no finish line either...just continuing unfoldment.

It is embodying awareness, which becomes spontaneous, that is true lila.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Dcdc » Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:18 pm

kiki wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:27 pm
However, all explanations of nondualism are dualistic by nature and rather confusing since they rely on concepts, and what is beyond concept can't be adequately explained. I think Tolle, Krishnaumurti, Buddha, Ramana Marharshi many other notable teachers all knew/know this as evidenced by their teachings. "This" is hard to convey, but once it is seen their teachings become even more clear.
This is absolutely true.

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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Webwanderer » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:05 pm

kiki wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:27 pm
The Observer isn't "created", it is always present as one's true and fundamental essence.
I agree with kiki's clear statement here as it is self evident. That said, I see the Observer role as a bit more dynamic than static as specifically an uninvolved witness. My take is that life is about experience, and that experience requires a quality of interaction with the apparent conditions in which the Observing consciousness finds itself. Certainly at this human level of observation.

As an Observer in this human context, the nature of observation may be honed to a preferred point of view. Of course there is a natural development that takes place throughout our early environment, albeit largely unguided, as the ego is a result of the varied conditioning we are all subject to creating the filters and biases we adopt early on.

Why would Consciousness have an interest in allowing (or even choosing) such ego creating filters? Again it's about exploring experience. Nothing in the illusion of human life is permanent. Experience however, is not illusion. Experience is a quality of reality - even if it's only the experience of the illusion. The feelings and insights gained are real and lasting.

When one reaches the point of introspection in life, as members of this board and most seekers of consciousness understanding have, perspective may change from perspective by happenstance to something more specifically chosen. That choice matters greatly in the quality of experience that subsequently unfolds.

So, for one seeking a more advanced understanding of life, understanding the Observer becomes highly significant. Recognizing that the Observer in not created (at least not in the human context) is a primary starting point to greater clarity and understanding of all else in life. I would suggest however, that there are important qualities to consider once recognition of the observer has occurred.

Consider the following qualities in honing the the nature of observation. (I would also suggest that they are likely present as a natural course of observation but often unrecognized.) The point of this is to enrich the experience that is fundamental to the evolution of Consciousness and Being.

Curiosity/interest + Indifference + Appreciation.

As stated earlier (and often), life is much to do about experience as experience is the nourishment of Consciousness growth. So, to get the most out of experience, even though it may be born of the foibles of ego, a basic curiosity and interest from an observer perspective is fundamental. Then there is the quality of indifference. Perceiving through indifference, while yet curious and interested, allows a degree of engagement with experience while yet not becoming entrapped in it. It's simply a ride on the roller coaster - terrifying/challenging, enjoyable and interesting all at the same time.

And finally the quality of appreciation. Appreciation is our human form of unconditional love. With a deep underlying indifference to events (born of the knowledge that events and circumstances are the temporary illusions for the purpose of exploring experience), along with a genuine curiosity and interest in such experience, appreciation adds a quality/sense of approval - free of any requirements in behavior or outcome.

I invite you to explore these qualities within the context of the Observer. The richness of experience, for this observer, is far preferable to basic, disconnected observation. Life experience is a whole lot more fun perceiving through this perspective. Full disclosure: I wish I could say I live here. I don't. But I frequently visit in my clearer moments and it frees me from the ego's entrapment. Frequent visits to observer perspective creates familiarity which creates easier access to this life enhancing perspective.

Enjoy,
WW

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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Enlightened2B » Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:18 pm

Sighclone wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:45 am
May I requote Jean Klein, from "In Touch" by John Prendergast:
I'm actually reading this book now based on the recommendation of someone. Thus far, really like it.

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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Sighclone » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:41 am

I know John from several SAND conferences - splendid fellow, candid and modest...powerful book.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

Unbiased observer
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Re: Unbiased observer

Post by Unbiased observer » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:47 am

Hi everyone,

Just a take, , surely no two people awaken in the same manner, each having totally different sets of experiences and memories I.e. ego, so for instance I don’t see the Buddha, Krishnamurti or Tolle being anything alike post awakening, they don’t look or sound like clones, but the thing they do have in common seems to me is the “Observer”

Once the observer is “created”, l believe this is done in the same Way one forms “muscle memory” (Of course muscles don’t have memories) or neurological configuration such as the case when we learn to ride a bike, swim or juggle balls.

All other other philosophical notions such as “the observer becomes the observed” the role of compassion or universal consciousness, all become clear once the Observer takes permanent residence.

It is impossible to transcend the ego without the Observer.

Once the Observer begins to get a foothold everything begins to fall into place without any effort. Seems logical to assume that this happens as a direct result of “ego-erasure”. As the ego illusion is observed it begins to fade.
Clarity is inversely proportional to the ego, the less ego (that is unobserved self manufactured thoughts based on experience/memory , identity, tribalism and so on) the greater the clarity.

I still think the Observer is a-process a neuroplastic phenomenon but just how that shift in “consciousness” happened to me
I don’t know. I was reading the Power of Now at the moment the epiphany came about, but clearly millions who’ve read the did not experience that transformation so there is an unknown variable.
I think we are animals on an evolutionary journey “consciousness” whatever that is if it exist at all is very new in evolutionary terms, at least human consciousness.
I’m with Tolle I think the Observer is the next stage in our evolution.

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