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completeinthenow
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Post by completeinthenow » Sun Feb 18, 2007 12:43 pm

Wow, my mind is buzzing with variables and ego based concepts of how best to post on this thread in a manner that is both dazzling and inspiring.

(* is it understood in this forum that our ego's are naturally more predisposed to writing our post then the Spirit within? If not I appoligize now for being such a verbose message poster... *)

For Now I am relaxing into accepting this present moment including all of the noise the little me idea within is making over it's "advance" along the road of enlightenment.

Someone above mentioned the slow disintegration of self after one has begun the inquiry into it's relative and questionable "reality".

This is how it has been happening for me. My body is slowing down, I do not move in as many of the frantic jagged motions that normally show as an expression of my internal restlessness. I'm listening better, I experience fear much less and most of all, right now in this moment my predominant assessment of the Now is one that is centered in the Flow of Peace through my Being.

It has been a cascading effect this dawning of Now consciousness. I am finding myself having an ease in Being free of ego identification.

In the measurement of "clock-time", I spend more time awake then asleep, and I more quickly become spontaneously aware of my egoic focus on reality.

I have this sense that this ego based focus within my mind is steadily fading from the forefront of my consciousness' investment in it as a viable or desirable way of perceiving reality.

I can feel this house of cards tumbling down before the Being Within.

On the subject of effort and doing nothing to aid in this process, I see it as a dual behaving modality. I am more often accepting the now then I have in the past of my ego's understanding. Sometimes I view this as an effort at other times it seems the most natural thing to do.

When it seems an effort, I can feel myself holding onto ego identification because I fear that without it "I" will die. But this is what must happen, "I" must let my "self" die, to fade away into the presence of Bieng, leaving only Being to exist where it always Is... Now.

A Course in Miracles gets pretty detailed about this process. That we are the decision maker and that we must, will and do choose between an acceptance of Spirit as our right mind and the reliance on the ego for our mind in error.

But really there is no choice at all because once Spirit is chosen once and for all, and there is no more vascilation between the Now and the illusions of past and future, we realize that Being/Spirit/God is all there ever Is and that to have chosen for the ego was not to have made a choice at all as we were only choosing a nothing wrapped in an illusion of "something".

A Course in Miracles has already brilliantly layed out the intricacies of the dynamic structure of ego identification and it's ultimate dissolution in the realm of time. I highly recommend reading the Course Text at least once in a person's life. Though it is rather wordy, and intellectually demanding I feel the benefit of having read the whole Text with the intent to learn something new and inspiring, far outweighs the natural resistance the ego has to having all of its tricks laid out bare for you to see in the Light.

If you really can't stomach the Text portion of the Course, then I recommend the book:

"Path of Light: Stepping into peace with A Course in Miracles"

All this talk and my inner alarm clock set to go off after I've been ego identified for a bit is sounding off. :D

Amazing how I can be speaking of being awake and yet be deep in sleep even while speaking the truth as is understood when at one with the Now.

Remember, we can be awake to Being right Now, there is nowhere to go, nothing more to read, no material goal to come first, no-thing to be done or accomplished before this simple choice is made. If we completely let go of our fear of death of "self" we can enter the realm of our One True Self, the Spirit Within, which unites all Reality in this eternal present moment.

So I bid you all goodnight, and hold it in my heart that we are One with the Being of Spirit and each other right Now.

~Peace Is With Us~


Resheph
"Only what is loving is true." A Course in Miracles

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Post by phil » Sun Feb 18, 2007 12:54 pm

Hey Din,
din wrote:I see someone who is more interested in a good discussion than in learning something. (or letting go of something)
Letting go of the need to improve my friend.

I enjoy a good discussion, it's true. That's my now what is. Why fix it?

I do see a need to manage. Sometimes my enjoyment of a good discussion slides off the highway in to a pure ego rampage, and then it's time to back the car out of the ditch, go find some nature, take a rest, etc. Being a paradigm poker can evolve in to being a jerk sometimes, so that's something to keep an eye on.

I do learn. People like yourself are a good influence. If I'm going to be a typoholic blowhard on some subject, this is a good one. I read every word of the threads I'm in, and just being here regularly keeps now and silence as part of my life, and that's good enough.

By "learning something" perhaps you mean, converting to your point of view. Yes Din, you have a point of view. :-)

You express your point of view well, as does Kiki, and many others. I see no need to duplicate your efforts, and try instead to add something that isn't already here.

This inevitably involves walking out to the border of the group consensus, looking out over the fence, and wondering aloud what's out there beyond our little town.

It's pointless really, but it's fun.

I've been reflecting on age a bit lately. I'll be 55 in a week. I'll be here maybe another 20 years, and it's going to go by in what will seem like 3 months. There's something wonderful about aging. I'm not going to be in the world of form all that much longer, why sweat it?

It's different for younger people, I get that. If a reader is 25, then it's entirely appropriate that they should set out to conquer the world, or themselves, and enjoy the illusion that they are going to make a lot of changes.

So Din, you devil. You've tricked me in writing a big "me and my situation" post. I'll be lying in wait for you, plotting my revenge. :-)

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Post by din » Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:29 pm

Hey Phil,

Thanks for the great reply.

I guess what I was really wondering about is how your pain body can be so benign.

That's the impression I was getting, mine was kicking my ass, but you seem to have settled into a quiet life of cohabitation with it.

Anyhow, I really don't know what I'm talking about here, so don't take of this seriously.

Just one thing.

You say kiki and I have a point of view and that is somewhat true, more true is that words flow thru us. I know this sounds highfallootin' and bullshitting, but that's ok, that's the way it is.

That's why it's called the translucent revolution.
:)

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Post by din » Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:37 pm

din wrote:
Also, the recognition occurs that trying to “see” this, is itself the “problem,” since that becomes the very creation of the me.
There's the crux of the matter.

This post comes from the "little me".

I just want to tell you that I will never get this.

Because I realize I'm incapable of "getting this".

Because I'm the contraction, and the contraction can't be the expansiveness.

"Getting this" means my death.

At least it means the death of my belief in myself as a separate entity that needs to get something.

There's no hope for me in this thread.
So really.... there's nothing to get!

That's why I will never get this.

"Getting this" was just more story.

Instead, there is a spontaneous dropping of needing to get anything.

The situation resolves itself, of it's own volition.

Nobody is doing anything here.

It's simply happening.

I like Nisargadatta's pointer.

Where he says that all you need do is stand back and just watch as the play of form unfolds.

You're not really a "doer", you're just a "witness".

But don't take these words too literally, because they're all bullshit.

Because all there really is, is "this".
:)

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Post by phil » Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:49 pm

din wrote:I guess what I was really wondering about is how your pain body can be so benign.
Luck. Luck in love, luck in money, luck in where and when I was born, and who I was born to. Luck to be 55, instead of 25! :-)
That's the impression I was getting, mine was kicking my ass
Well, how old are you? Mine was kicking my ass 30 years ago too.
Anyhow, I really don't know what I'm talking about here, so don't take of this seriously.
Ok then! :-)
You say kiki and I have a point of view and that is somewhat true, more true is that words flow thru us.
Yes, it's just semantics. I prefer the more down to earth version, you prefer the more celestial version, in either case, just semantics and personal preferences. We speak the words, the words speak through us, to each their own.

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Post by din » Sun Feb 18, 2007 8:09 pm

din wrote:
I guess what I was really wondering about is how your pain body can be so benign.


Luck. Luck in love, luck in money, luck in where and when I was born, and who I was born to. Luck to be 55, instead of 25!
ET said in one his talks that those with a heavy painbody have a better chance at transformation.

He went on to say that those of you whose painbody is not as strong, there's still hope for you... at which point the whole audience starts laughing.



Quote:
That's the impression I was getting, mine was kicking my ass


Well, how old are you? Mine was kicking my ass 30 years ago too.
Mine has been problematic all my life, but more so starting on Jan 19th, 1988. That's the day my best friend died.

I grieved for 14 years.

I noticed that it wasn't just grieving though, when "the flow" started, it felt like all the pain in my entire life was involved, was moving, was dissolving.

I'll be 56 next month.

The painbody is just a pussycat now though. :lol:

Quote:
Anyhow, I really don't know what I'm talking about here, so don't take of this seriously.


Ok then!
I don't know a damn thing.

And that's very liberating.

Quote:
You say kiki and I have a point of view and that is somewhat true, more true is that words flow thru us.

Yes, it's just semantics. I prefer the more down to earth version, you prefer the more celestial version, in either case, just semantics and personal preferences. We speak the words, the words speak through us, to each their own
.

I think I like what Tony Parsons says, he says there's a slight shift, you see things somewhat differently, not so seriously.
_________________
:)

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Post by phil » Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:46 pm

din wrote:I'll be 56 next month.
Oh crap, you're ahead of me, I'm gonna have to peddle harder to catch up!

No wait, I'll just change my tune. Darn Din, too bad you're not young like me. Young is better you know. :-)
din wrote:I don't know a damn thing.
Ha, Din my friend, I _so_ don't believe you when you say stuff like this. One pile of knowing, replaced with another pile.

You know so much, and are sharing it with us many times a day. Just like me.

All of us, this board is overflowing with the grandest kinds of imaginary knowing possible. We are knowing champs!

Wow, look at all the knowing this poor guy has jammed his head with. He's got it even worse than us! :-)

Image

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Post by din » Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:45 am

din wrote:
I don't know a damn thing.


Ha, Din my friend, I _so_ don't believe you when you say stuff like this. One pile of knowing, replaced with another pile.
You're absolutely right.

But you're also completely wrong.
:)

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Post by kiki » Mon Feb 19, 2007 7:13 pm

phil wrote:Let's address a room full of people off the street who are suffering from thought overload, and tell them there is nothing they need to do to solve their problem.

How many listeners will find this non-technique approach to be simple, or effective?
First - I would never do that, but it seems that this is something you might do, and then you'd have to deal with it. They in all likelihood would think you're crazy to even suggest such a thing; they are too heavily invested in living their lives in the mind, not recognizing or even wishing to recognize that that's what they're doing.

Second - this "non-technique" is really quite demanding in the most profound sense. It requires constant attention to what's actually happening. It requires that there be a watchfulness to realize just what "doing" is so that it can drop away - and the most subtle doing is the doing which keeps ego in place. Not many are willing to do this because they'd rather try other things first.

Even those who are consciously searching for something, who have heard of awakening and are pursuing it, they might entertain this possibility, but not many of them are even likely to do this. The path that they choose will run its course and at some point if awakening is revealed they will see directly that "nothing" was required for it to happen. They will see that there is no longer any energy invested in keeping any sort of "doing" active, no more energy invested in keeping alive a "mental idea of me" who is in pursuit of something called "enlightenment".

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Post by din » Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:12 pm

Second - this "non-technique" is really quite demanding in the most profound sense. It requires constant attention to what's actually happening. It requires that there be a watchfulness to realize just what "doing" is so that it can drop away - and the most subtle doing is the doing which keeps ego in place.
Very well said keith,


This is true in the beginning, when there is still lots of identification with thought and not much space.

But eventually, when there is more space, the constant attention can relax somewhat.

Since it's recognized that even being lost in thought is "it" also.

The spaceousness encompasses all experiences really, so wanting one experience over another is simply more efforting by the ego.

As Nisargadatta said, "love all of it or none of it". (Stop having preferences.)
:)

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Post by kiki » Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:53 pm

din wrote:But eventually, when there is more space, the constant attention can relax somewhat.
Yes. There comes the total relaxation in what you are - no effort to do so is needed - being what you are takes no "doing". That space, being what you are, then readily recognizes the re-emerging ego/mind.

As you said, even the ego/mind becomes part of the isness of the moment. If one gets lost again it's ok because it's realized more clearly to be part of the moment and there isn't the resistance there once was. But the occurance of those episodes becomes less and less because one becomes more and more alert to these forays into form. The recognition/awareness of form spontaneously dissolves the form. Only the most superficial form of ego/mind is used in daily activity to take care of practical matters that form requires.

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Post by lucy » Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:39 am

" The recognition/awareness of form spontaneously dissolves the form. Only the most superficial form of ego/mind is used in daily activity to take care of practical matters that form requires"


Kiki when you say that awareness of form sopontaneously dissolves the form do you mean that there is a realization that there is no separte form and it is all One?

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Post by phil » Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:00 am

kiki wrote:Second - this "non-technique" is really quite demanding in the most profound sense.

It requires constant attention to what's actually happening. It requires that there be a watchfulness to realize just what "doing" is so that it can drop away - and the most subtle doing is the doing which keeps ego in place. Not many are willing to do this because they'd rather try other things first.

Even those who are consciously searching for something, who have heard of awakening and are pursuing it, they might entertain this possibility, but not many of them are even likely to do this.
Exactly, that's it.

You've just explained why this approach is not useful to 95% of those who will ever hear of it.

And most people will never hear of it, because the whole discussion is buried under a small mountain of exotic paradoxical glorious gibberish which turns non new age folks off at a glance.

We all know this from our own experience with friends, family, co-workers, etc. Are we interested in these people, the majority of humanity living beyond the new age culture?

I'm not denying the validity of what you're saying, only pointing out that it's practical value for the overwhelming majority of suffering human beings is extremely limited.

How do we serve the overwhelming majority of folks who will never get what you're talking about?

Can we draw a clear line between the experience of silence, and everything we say about it?

Experience here. Concepts here.

We might make now teachings accessible to many more people if we set aside the "everything we say about it" part, and looked for the very shortest path to the experience of silence itself.

In other words, be true to our own philosophy.

The experience itself is applicable to all human beings. That's the part that will travel to any group in any culture.

It's the "everything we say about it" part that is getting in the way of that happening.

Thanks for listening, I'm gonna go take one of those silence classes now.

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Post by din » Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:22 am

Kiki wrote:
Yes. There comes the total relaxation in what you are - no effort to do so is needed - being what you are takes no "doing".
What I'm noticing is this relaxation is happening as the sense of separation is disappearing.

And that sense of separation was also the sense of having or being a "problem".

It was also the sense of needing more than what is here right now.

And of course it was also the sense of being a separate person, a little "me".
:)

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Post by din » Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:32 am

So I'm aware these days that there is pure simple awareness and superimposed on that, or arising in that, is the sense of "me", of identity, of being a somebody.

But I'm aware also that this is just a feeling/thought/sense, that has been with me my whole life and I never questioned it before.

It was a totally unconscious belief!!!

So now, when it does arise, there is a "knowingness" that sees or says "ah, there it is again".

There is a recognition of this sense/thought/feeling when it arises and it's allowed to be, but in the allowing or seeing of this, it seems this sense/thought/feeling can't survive conscious scrutiny and it dissolves spontaneously, or it may continue for awhile and I just watch it, allow it to be.

I have to say I'm also experiencing a tremendous amount of peace these days.

The peace that surpasses all understanding.
:)

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