Hi again Kiki,
You describe what you're pointing to well.
And I guess you are responding to what I'm trying to point to by saying...
kiki wrote:the watching of how ego makes attempts at "accepting".
Yes, accepting ourselves now, before awakening, could be said to be an incomplete acceptance. Well, at least I can report it is in my case. But you know, the nature of this approach is to accept our limitations, so an incomplete acceptance isn't necessarily a big problem within this approach.
It seems everyone I've ever met within spiritual communities, maybe all these folks, are making attempts at awakening.
Incomplete acceptance, incomplete awakening.
Seems like most of us are in pretty much the same boat, whatever our priorities.
I see awakened folks, well I've heard of them anyway, and I have personally met many people who seem to have accepted themselves, as they are, without knowledge of these techniques.
Honestly, I don't see how either approach has a lock on bringing folks to a place where they no longer have anything to work on. Which brings me to...
kiki wrote:Then the simplicity of awakening becomes apparent.
I know what you're saying, and I don't disagree. I see the point that the actual experience of being awakened is not some mystery state, but is rather so close to us, that we miss it in it's ordinariness.
But honestly, I had a spontaneous giggle when I read that awakening is simple.
You've been working on this since when, the 1970's? Same here.
Thanks to those years, I do understand your post, but if we field tested it on 1000 folks randomly selected off the street I doubt we'd find many who'd be anything but completely puzzled by what you are referring to.
If awakening was simple, there'd be no need for Tolle and other teachers.
It seems to me that an approach of accepting oneself, as we are now, including our imperfections and limitations, is a much simpler, and more immediate, path.
Not saying it's easy either, but surely simpler to understand, and a more accessible experience.
And, for what it's worth, it seems more "be here now" to me than projecting a vision of something that is in theory wonderful in to the future and then reaching for it.
Lisa said we have different priorities. That's a good way to put it. I don't see incomplete acceptance now, and a process of growth to be incompatible. I guess it's just a matter of what each of us want to focus on.
But the idea of priorities implies that we can't have it all at once.
Good discussion amongst a bunch of former Catholics! Thank you all for sharing your time.