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Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 10:03 am
by yep
Hi,
I have been reading "the Work" by Byron Katie and I am wondering if it is something anybody is using? Today I also took a quick glimpse at the Sedona Method, however I have a hard time understanding what this method is about, can anybody recommend it?

Lately I have been feeling that I am scared that all these gurus are just in it for the money. Looking at the website of the sedona method this seems probable, but even people like Byron Katie and Adyashanti. I believe this is because I so badly want peace (i struggle with OCD-intrusive thoughts) and do not want to be mislead. However I feel that this makes me have a hard time commiting to the different inquiries.

Anybody with the same experience or any suggestions?

Thanks /
Yep

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 12:20 pm
by highlife66
yep wrote:all these gurus are just in it for the money.
1. Is it true?

2. Can you absolutely know it's true?

3. How do you react, what happens, when you believe the thought "all these gurus are just in it for the money"?

4. Who would you be without the thought "all these gurus are just in it for the money"?



All the answers to your questions are within. You don't ever need to give Katie a cent.

Warmly,
Jeff

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 6:00 pm
by mistral
I love Jeff's answer, and may I say, I have never gone to any of the gurus or teachers mentioned ...I tried to sit at a' satsang' once....I had to leave almost with the first few minutes...something just did not suit my way ....I listen to my intuition and it has always always been right...mostly I know this, because when I do not, I am always always wrong...
(and I love Eckhart's book, he is a God send, I am sure)

I do know of one other honest man (and I am sure there are many out there, but my studies are limited to some old style teachers) his work is very similar to Eckhart's he is a wonderful combination of Eastern philosophy ans Western mind....He taught back in the 1960's to early 90's...he has passed away, so he is not going to take your money or put himself up as the 'big guru man' (he never did that, though back then, some tried to do it to him, he would retreat from that kind of veneration)

Also, I have many who study "A Course In Miracles" who love William Sameul's work...he is so gentle and honest and truthful...just go see and Do follow your Own Heart on this, you will know if he is right for you.

He has a lot of free essays on his website...but the one little book that is free there is titled "2+2=Reality" you can download it....and I think it will be something very much like the angels have lead you to, for help and guidence.

scroll down the
Books page and at the bottom of page you will see a bright red book with fish on it....that is a free download. It is not a book for everyone, it is written in some old fashion style, it is not 'non-duality' in the way it is taught today...however, it is all about The One Presence that is Being All That YOU ARE and All That is....in those days this study was called "Metaphysical Absolute' or Metaphysical Science"...anyway...I hope you find some Peace in this mans words...I know he and his work has been the thing that helped me to arrive Here Within My Own Heart, Finding Myself lifted up by Grace and Love through all things.

http://www.williamsamuel.com/booktitles.html

Merry Angel-Mistral

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:40 am
by highlife66
It is interesting to note that there was a time long ago when discovering the information to awaken or enlighten was very difficult. It was a sometimes dangerous quest and many times included much sacrifice. Now all you have to do is go to your local library... :wink:

Warmly,
Jeff

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:06 am
by randomguy
I have been reading "the Work" by Byron Katie and I am wondering if it is something anybody is using?
Yes, and I think it's great. Like Jeff said, it's free and the questions and worksheets are available on her website.

I also found the free videos on Katie's site helpful for examples. I didn't find doing the questions myself as easy as it looked when watching the videos and observing others going through the 4 questions. Mind can have some real blind spots. Listening to (or reading) "Loving What Is" offers excellent guidance for the questions.

Jeff, I like your adaptation of Katie's quote, "What would you be without your story?"

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:53 am
by yep
thanks everybody for all the good answers! I can really see that these doubts can as easily be questioned with the work! However I have a hard time using the work. In all byron katies videos everybody answers no to the question if they can know its true, however I dont get how you cant know if you dont have cancer or not. Can the objective be just to show everybody you cant know anything? I can see that this step might just brainwash some people into denial which is surely not the purpose.

Thanks anyways!
Yep

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:24 am
by highlife66
yep wrote:thanks everybody for all the good answers! I can really see that these doubts can as easily be questioned with the work! However I have a hard time using the work. In all byron katies videos everybody answers no to the question if they can know its true, however I dont get how you cant know if you dont have cancer or not.
Hi yep,
There is no right or wrong answer. You can still answer "yes" to the first two questions. Whether or not you know or don't know if you have cancer may not be the focus. It may be the thought that "I shouldn't have cancer" or "I am afraid of cancer" that can be inquired about.

Can the objective be just to show everybody you cant know anything? I can see that this step might just brainwash some people into denial which is surely not the purpose.
Adyashanti said in 'The End Of Your World', "the one thing I know is that I don't know anything", and BK has said very similar things.
The reality may be "my body has cancer", the illusions are the reactions/judgments of that statement.


Warmly,
Jeff

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2009 8:27 am
by great2be
There is an amazing resource of free mp3's that Katie has sanctioned the free usage of - you will find it here
http://everypathis.org/

If you only download 1 I heartily recommend this
http://everypathis.org/ByronKatie/MP3/0 ... 0Katie.mp3
A very repressed woman has an amazing breakthrough in just 30 mins.

I hope you find some benefit in these :D

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:24 pm
by Abigail
Hey there,

I do not know much about the Sedona Method, as I have never investigated it. However, a few years ago I read something about Lester Levenson on the web, so I Googled him.
One of the first things I came across was his life story. Parts of his story seemed authentic and really resonated with me. At that time I also located some quotes and excerpts of his writing. Some of these really spoke to me and seemed relevant to the spiritual growth issues I had at the time.

I did not keep any of the information I found back then, so when I read your entry I did a new web search. Most of the versions of his life story, that I had previously read on the web, seem to have now disappeared. They appear to have been replaced by severely cut and edited version versions, at least compared to those in my memory. These new ones are much shorter but seemed to be missing most of what I remembered from before. Many things I found to be so appealing when I read his story those years ago seem to have been chopped.
I finally found two sites which seemed to have more lengthy versions.

Lester's Story
the first is a pdf. It is clean and straight forward just a version of some of the story
http://www.releasetechnique.com/pdf/Les ... nStory.pdf

the other location seems to be a slightly more detailed and less edited version. It is spread over 3 pages and interspersed with advertisements and other non Lester information so you will have to hopscotch along the pages to read it
http://www.wholejoy.com/wholeness/news99l.html
http://www.wholejoy.com/wholeness/news99m.html
http://www.wholejoy.com/wholeness/news99n.html


Quotes and Excerpts

Thus far I have not found all the locations I remember having quotes and excerpts, but my search has not been exhaustive.
I did find the following site which has a short video featuring a few brief quotes
http://www.zings.us/videos-SOuXgz3_rng- ... uotes.html

I also discovered a lengthy pdf of Lester's writings, one which I had not seen a few years back. This one is definitely worth a look
http://www.stillnessspeaks.com/sitehtml ... timate.pdf


Videos, Other Books and Miscellaneous
Other new finds include bit torrents for videos of Lester and other things. I have not checked these out but will put up some links in case you wish to investigate further

This web site seems to have a free download of another Lester eBook if you do a free registration on their site
http://www.scribd.com/doc/375675/The-Power-of-Love

torrents and other downloads I have not tried
http://www.torrentreactor.net/find/Lester
http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/1056220/775222/
http://www.torrentreactor.net/torrents/ ... r-Levenson
http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4158126 ... and_Beyond
http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4158140 ... _Awakening
http://www.ask.com/bar?q=lester+levenso ... cf4b7b793e
http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/1 ... es=&page=1
http://btjunkie.org/torrent/Sedona-Meth ... cf4b7b793e
http://download-shack.com/search/lester%20levenson.html


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One quote from Lester's life story you may find relevant is "He never charged any fee for his work, nor would he accept any money when people offered it. He knew he had everything he needed as he needed it, he'd proven that more than once, and his real estate ventures continued to be profitable. He had no need for anything."
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With Love
Abigail

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:00 am
by NoordZee
I am also familiar with Byron Katies writings and videos. To the best of my understanding, she uses the question: Who would you be without that thought? to prove that thoughts do not represent reality. However, like Eckhart Tolle's teachings and others, I somehow cannot successfully apply these questions and concepts to myself, no matter how much I understand the meaning behind these questions. So, are you absolutely sure that what you are fearing will come to pass? No, I cannot be absolutely sure but still cannot shake this type of thinking which triggers depression and negative thinking. In other words, I cannot stop thinking negative thoughts.

I seem to identify with my thoughts, no matter how many times I tell myself that I know that. I have perhaps taken the first step by becoming aware of these thoughts and what they do to me. However, the second step must be a very long distance away, as I have, metaphorically speaking, no space around me to take that second step and subsequent ones. Perhaps I am aware that I am aware although even that does not seem to help me.

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:58 pm
by Tara
I find Katie's work at times liberating. Before I read anything about her or her books I watched some of her videos on youtube and was immediately taken in. But I do "feel" what you have written also..questioning the thought and seeing how I don't know for sure it will come to pass..and then the negative thought still lingers in the background.

I do believe I need to go deeper, just sit with each question, not rush it and more will come. When I get to the turn around's, they can be aha moments because I can see other truths for these thoughts. So in that sense they sometimes just dissolve, or are not as prominent or it opens me up to see the thought as not real and fallible.
NoordZee wrote:I am also familiar with Byron Katie's writings and videos. To the best of my understanding, she uses the question: Who would you be without that thought? to prove that thoughts do not represent reality. However, like Eckhart Tolle's teachings and others, I somehow cannot successfully apply these questions and concepts to myself, no matter how much I understand the meaning behind these questions. So, are you absolutely sure that what you are fearing will come to pass? No, I cannot be absolutely sure but still cannot shake this type of thinking which triggers depression and negative thinking. In other words, I cannot stop thinking negative thoughts.

I seem to identify with my thoughts, no matter how many times I tell myself that I know that. I have perhaps taken the first step by becoming aware of these thoughts and what they do to me. However, the second step must be a very long distance away, as I have, metaphorically speaking, no space around me to take that second step and subsequent ones. Perhaps I am aware that I am aware although even that does not seem to help me.

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:50 pm
by gdvant
Tara wrote: like Eckhart Tolle's teachings and others, I somehow cannot successfully apply these questions and concepts to myself, no matter how much I understand the meaning behind these questions. So, are you absolutely sure that what you are fearing will come to pass? No, I cannot be absolutely sure but still cannot shake this type of thinking which triggers depression and negative thinking. In other words, I cannot stop thinking negative thoughts.

I seem to identify with my thoughts, no matter how many times I tell myself that I know that. I have perhaps taken the first step by becoming aware of these thoughts and what they do to me. However, the second step must be a very long distance away, as I have, metaphorically speaking, no space around me to take that second step and subsequent ones. Perhaps I am aware that I am aware although even that does not seem to help me.
[/quote]


The first step is to perceive the thinker as thought. What sees
the thinker as thought is not of thought. Do you follow? What is
of thought is of time, is always moving away from the now so to
speak. What is not of thought is timeless. There is no past or
future psychologically apart from thought. The first step is the
last step. That is, apart from thought there are no steps.

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:56 am
by NoordZee
Gdvant said:
The first step is to perceive the thinker as thought. What sees
the thinker as thought is not of thought. Do you follow? What is
of thought is of time, is always moving away from the now so to
speak. What is not of thought is timeless. There is no past or
future psychologically apart from thought. The first step is the
last step. That is, apart from thought there are no steps.
I guess what you say is that thoughts cannot exist other than in a environment, which is bound by time. On the other hand, when I observe myself as a thinker, my awareness is outside time. In other words: I would be in the Present. I have stated on various forums here before: it is one thing to know these things intellectually, but it is an entirely other thing to implement this knowledge in a practical and helpful way.

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:09 pm
by gdvant
Please ignore - duplication

Re: Byron Katie & Sedona Method

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:22 pm
by gdvant
gdvant wrote:
[I guess what you say is that thoughts cannot exist other than in a environment, which is bound by time. On the other hand, when I observe myself as a thinker, my awareness is outside time. In other words: I would be in the Present. I have stated on various forums here before: it is one thing to know these things intellectually, but it is an entirely other thing to implement this knowledge in a practical and helpful way./quote]

Yes. The reference is to the quality of observation in which
there is no division between the observer and the observed.
This assumes that there is energy to observe freely. Which
means the environment is seen at once as a totality. For
there to be energy to observe freely in any circumstance,
one must live with that energy/attention as much as is
possible. That is the integrating factor.