Karmic Decision

A place for anything that doesn't fit into the existing forums
Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sun May 10, 2009 7:08 am

Each individual seems to have a unique attitude towards life. Many assume or believe that everybody was born with the same attitude towards life and that attitude is eventually altered by life experiences. It does not seem to make any difference if we assume or believe that everybody was born with a unique attitude towards life.

From my observation of myself and of others, it seems that one's attitude towards life overwhelmingly determines one's subjective life experiences. For example, if I perceive I am a victim of life situations, I am more likely to see myself being victimized in my subjective experiences. Changing attitude is more difficult than changing habits. My current attitude towards life is learning: every situation may teach me something. I am not looking for happiness, peace, love and etc. To me learning is everything. I may learn from boredom, depression, love, happiness, anxiety, death, fear...

When I was an infant, I learned unconsciously. And now I learn consciously as well as unconsciously :wink:

Juniper22
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:58 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Juniper22 » Sun May 10, 2009 1:53 pm

Tony-S-Ma wrote: From my observation of myself and of others, it seems that one's attitude towards life overwhelmingly determines one's subjective life experiences.
How can you observe yourself? You`re implying there are two separate entities - "my" and "self." Is there a self that you are observing and if so, how can that be?
"Don`t think of goodness; don`t think of evil; at this instant, what is your original face?" Hui Neng

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sun May 10, 2009 2:05 pm

You have to go beyond your understanding of separation in order to observe yourself, or others objectively. Playing with logic and reason here is meaningless.

User avatar
Webwanderer
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6906
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 12:03 am

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Webwanderer » Sun May 10, 2009 4:18 pm

Tony-S-Ma wrote:Each individual seems to have a unique attitude towards life. Many
assume or believe that everybody was born with the same attitude
towards life and that attitude is eventually altered by life
experiences. It does not seem to make any difference if we assume or
believe that everybody was born with a unique attitude towards life.
It seems necessary, in order to gain some perspective into possible inherent differences, to consider whether some sense of self existed prior to birth. If physical world incarnation is indeed a genuine system within a greater reality, then it stands to reason there is some purpose to its existance. And if that purpose exists to facilitate growth of unique consciousnesses then there is certainly differences between those incarnating conscious perspectives - call them beings.

This physical world may well be a school of sorts where each one comes to develop certain qualities within self consciousness. It further stands that if this is true, then each of us is here to learn lessons unique to our own circumstances and conditions. Even if we have no direct knowledge of what those lessons might be, circumstances and inherent attitudes will draw us into conditions that will create exposure to learning opportunities.

Awakening to presence, over identity with thought, puts one on the fast track to the evolution of consciousness. If there is a "Golden Age" where mankind steps up to a new paradigm of living, it is through the shift to awakened living by ever increasing numbers over the masses historically living through separate me identities created in thought.

Ultimately we are the essence of the Source that created us - I Am That. But genuine recognition of that greatest of Self realizations may be an infinate journey into ever greater clarity of being. I sense that we are but comparitive youngsters in the overall scheme of life. But as the old truism goes "the path of a thousand miles begins with the first step". The Power of Now is to take that first step, and every step, consciously awake.

WW

User avatar
mistral
Posts: 330
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 4:58 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by mistral » Sun May 10, 2009 6:01 pm

Yes, we can observe our self. I know we always say there is only One Self, but that Self expresses in infinite ways, that Self is not limited to how many ‘senses of self’ It wants to express as. So, in that case, that we have two selves, sort of like a self that seems real and the Self that is Real and Eternal. We make the observation that we can make the observation of our self. Yes. So it goes something like this, we have the one who believes he is 'Joe Schmo' with a certain job and certain status, and a wife, and so many kids, and a history and all those labels that 'make up' Joe. This Joe thinks he is really Joe.

But then one day his life starts to fall apart and all those labels that Joe honesty believed in, they begin to fall off of him. He loses his job, his wife leaves him, the kids get messed up and Joe is now embarrassed by them and he finds out his dad was not really his dad.

Well, now poor Joe is falling apart. He is falling apart because that self he believed himself to be is not a very substantial self, he feels he is losing himself. But it turns out to be a very dear and special self, a serving-its-purpose-self, because it is this ‘less than forever’ Joe that leads Joe to find his Eternal and Infinite Real Identity.

All that was 'not Joe' has caused him to go on a spiritual search, yes, a learning search, a search that wants nothing else but to know what is real, who he is, and what the world is all about.

That part of Joe is not the Real Joe, but it is the path, the life line, the very special love he is graced with, an ego-self-Joe. It is that ‘old man’ self that takes Joe up the Mountain to find the Hand of God and that ‘lowly-unhappy-miserable’ self is actually the gift that leads Joe to an inkling, a glimmer of his True Identity.

Joe has found His Self and He can Stand Alone as Light of His True Self. Now Joe is very capable of being both Joe's the Higher Real Self that is free and unbound and yet Joe is still being pea brain Joe that is here in the body, wondering how to find a job. But now Joe is not afraid, not so worried, he can carry himself with Light and Joy and Passion through the good times and the bad.

Yes, Joe finds out he is Both; we are in the world of time-space-objective and we still have to pay taxes. And he uses both selves at once. This creates a sort of synergy that makes him a Third Joe, a combination of both. The Holy Trinity may be the One that Joe is found.

And Now being Three, Joe is now in this Marvelous Flow where Joe is full of passion and love and wonder and he even finds that he can sing, so he goes to little coffee house late one night and he sings his heart out and everyone loves him, and he sings songs of Beauty and Love that fills the audience with Grace and they go home and they are changed a bit for the better. Because his Light and Truth are shining full beam, Joe is doing a fine job. Joe has found the Divine Balance where in he is still 'old Joe' in so many ways; he is still here in his material world of time, the struggles do not subside much, but he is Happy, he is Passionate, he is Alive with The Grace of God. Joe has found the Truth of Who He Really Is, and so he lives Both at the same time, giving to his world his Love, and giving to God what is God's.

Joe is living in the Objective world and Knows The Subjective Truth and he is balanced between both, learning more and more everyday, ready willing and enthused to learn all he can about his Real Identity, and then, like Moses, bringing that Information back down the Mountain, singing his songs so that others might learn also.

Much Love, Mistral

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sun May 10, 2009 7:29 pm

Awakening to presence, over identity with thought, puts one on the fast track to the evolution of consciousness.
From incarnation perspective, time is an illusion. Awakening to presence only puts one an the fast track to learn the lessons for this life time. Have fun.

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sun May 10, 2009 7:36 pm

So, in that case, that we have two selves, sort of like a self that seems real and the Self that is Real and Eternal.
Why not there are infinite "selves", and the Collective of all of them?

If this is true manifestation of reality, each individual shall reflect it. One's various habits, tendencies, characteristics can be viewed as numerous "selves", the one observing them can be viewed as the Collective. This Collective is often labeled as "What you are".

Juniper22
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:58 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Juniper22 » Sun May 10, 2009 11:34 pm

Tony-S-Ma wrote:You have to go beyond your understanding of separation in order to observe yourself, or others objectively. Playing with logic and reason here is meaningless.
It`s a simple question - How can you observe yourself if you`re one?
"Don`t think of goodness; don`t think of evil; at this instant, what is your original face?" Hui Neng

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Mon May 11, 2009 12:22 am

It`s a simple question - How can you observe yourself if you`re one?
It is simple: "one is many and many are one" if you get it. Sticking to an axiom and applying logic will not get you there. How question requires a base understanding in order to be answered. And the the business of awakening, all base positions are taken as provisional.

It is like a "sticking the tail to the donkey game". It doesn't really matter where the players stick the tail, all have fun in the process.

Juniper22
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:58 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Juniper22 » Mon May 11, 2009 1:19 am

Tony-S-Ma wrote: From my observation of myself and of others, it seems that one's attitude towards life overwhelmingly determines one's subjective life experiences.
An awakened man would never have made the above statement Tony - You are yourself.
"Don`t think of goodness; don`t think of evil; at this instant, what is your original face?" Hui Neng

sevenworlds
Posts: 224
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:12 am

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by sevenworlds » Mon May 11, 2009 1:40 am

Yes, who is this one who has an attitude towards life?

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Mon May 11, 2009 11:53 am

sevenworlds wrote:Yes, who is this one who has an attitude towards life?
How does one know 1+1 =2 ? Or how do you know 1+1 =2?

Tony-S-Ma
Posts: 359
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:07 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Mon May 11, 2009 11:57 am

Tony - You are yourself.
Yes I am myself. I am sorry that I have disturbed your sweet dreams.

Juniper22
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:58 pm

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by Juniper22 » Mon May 11, 2009 6:49 pm

^ No need apologising for something you didn`t do Tony.
"Don`t think of goodness; don`t think of evil; at this instant, what is your original face?" Hui Neng

sevenworlds
Posts: 224
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:12 am

Re: Karmic Decision

Post by sevenworlds » Tue May 12, 2009 12:48 am

Tony-S-Ma wrote:How does one know 1+1 =2 ? Or how do you know 1+1 =2?
I don't. It is taken for granted. I have to accept the number 1 first or maths falls apart.

Post Reply