Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

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Tony-S-Ma
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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Fri May 15, 2009 11:29 pm

Some scientists have claimed that a human being is using only 10% of its brain capacity. This can be interpreted in two ways in the awareness business: 1) the usual scientific way, or 1) 90% of a human brain is under the directing of Awareness (or only 10% of a human brain is egoic).

One theory is:

All manifestations are contents of Awareness. Living organisms are self-aware contents. This self-awareness is evolutionary. This reflects that Awareness Is Self-evolutionary. A brain is just following its evolutionary path charted by Awareness with some relative independence.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by OneLove » Sat May 16, 2009 2:09 am

karmarider wrote:Ramana Mahirishi in a nutshell:
1. There’s no need to change or avoid changing anything you’re currently
doing.
2. The only problem there is, is a false belief about what you are.
3. The only solution that will work, is to see the truth of what you are.
4. There’s no need to understand what you falsely believe yourself to be,
nor is it possible to do so.
5. This false belief is entirely unconscious and cannot be seen.
6. There’s nothing you can do that can rid you of this false belief, other
than directly seeing for yourself the truth of what you are.
7. All that you can know for sure about yourself is that you are here. All
the rest is story and conjecture.
8. Self-inquiry is therefore nothing other than turning your attention to
your simple and certain “here-ness, ” and seeing it directly for yourself.
9. Consistently practiced, self-inquiry acts like a medicine that gradually
dissolves the false belief that’s causing your problems, and gradually
replaces your concerned control with peaceful ease and trust.
Ramana Maharshi in an actual nutshell: Who Am I?

It's the only tool a seeker needs. It's applicable to everyone, it is the simplest, most direct, easiest and fastest way to enlightenment. It's really the only thing any seeker needs and it was tuly his only teaching. Regardless of what he would say, he would always refer back to inquiry. It's strange that Eckhart and Adya don't see how indispensable this is in the journey.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Sighclone » Sat May 16, 2009 7:52 am

Adya references "Who Am I?" repeatedly in "Emptiness Dancing." See pp. 12, 22, 68 and elsewhere.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

OneLove
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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by OneLove » Sat May 16, 2009 10:10 pm

I mean they don't stress it enough. It really should be the only thing they talk about.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Glycine » Sat May 16, 2009 11:47 pm

"Who am I" doesn't necessarily work for everybody. Some people spent many years in meditation with this question, and nothing happened - which may be a good thing.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sat May 16, 2009 11:56 pm

Some others suggest to use "What am I"; however, that may not work for everybody either. The only cure all for me is humbly ask for God's help. Or "Pray always." I must confess that I am unable to pray always like Jesus. He is the best manifestation of God in human form so far in the entire human existence.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by kiki » Sun May 17, 2009 3:55 am

It really should be the only thing they talk about.
That seems to be your preference, but does that necessarily make it a "should"? Are they not free to teach in their unique way without bending to someone else's preference? Perhaps they've found that everyone doesn't respond to such a direct way of pointing out truth or just aren't currently ready to go straight to self-inquiry.

Why not put aside your "shoulds" and allow teachers to accommodate listeners/readers/students as they see fit, as it unfolds for them given the current circumstances when they are addressing people.
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by OneLove » Sun May 17, 2009 5:49 pm

Ha, of course they're allowed to teach however they want, but there is really no way of getting around the whole inquiry. It's all about self annihilation, and the only way of doing that is to question every belief we have. It's not that it doesn't work for everyone, people won't LET it work. How could be a good fir for everybody? This is universal truth not pant sizes! Ego hates the inquiry and that's natural. It's painful, invasive, and scary, but hey, it works.

I am wrong when I say it SHOULD be mainstream practice, but if I was a spiritual fascist, the inquiry would be defacto!

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by kiki » Sun May 17, 2009 7:20 pm

It's not that it doesn't work for everyone, people won't LET it work. How could be a good fir for everybody? This is universal truth not pant sizes! Ego hates the inquiry and that's natural. It's painful, invasive, and scary, but hey, it works.
I didn't say it wouldn't work for everyone. Reread my quote:
Perhaps they've found that everyone doesn't respond to such a direct way of pointing out truth or just aren't currently ready to go straight to self-inquiry.
Let me clarify for you what I mean: some may not be at a point yet where they are able to apply (it's too threatening or scary) or stick to the method of self inquiry. Some people may need to figuratively "walk around the block a few times" before they see the efficacy of using self-enquiry. Nobody can make another get it, especially when, as you say, "people won't LET it work". For those who won't let it work, less direct paths are at hand (the walk around the block). They can come back to it later, or the teacher can sort of talk around the fringes of it, making it less threatening/frightening for students. After all, is everyone ready to hear, "You don't exist as a separate entity" right from the get-go?

Personally, I prefer the approach of self-enquiry over everything else because it goes directly to the root of delusion, but I have found some people just can't start there or stay with it and seem to need to come at it from a different angle. Many who teach look to see where the student is and work from there, and that may necessitate a less direct approach. Even Ramana did that. His primary teaching was self-enquiry, but he didn't limit himself to that alone. He could see who was ready and who wasn't.

But you are correct in saying that it always come back to this idea of investigating self/ego - you can't get around it. When that point is ripe for each person is entirely dependent upon that person.
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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Sun May 17, 2009 9:48 pm

Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Teresa achieved similar Self-realization without self-inquiry. There is no short-cut to Awareness. Direct path is just another path like any others. The qualification word "direct" may mislead some seekers.

When the inner urge is experienced, one sooner or later will experience Awareness consciously. Or the inner urge puts one on the path; or perhaps the inner urge itself is a conscious experience of Awareness.

Many teachers teach this idea that all paths eventually come to the point of ego/self investigation. Jesus does not. I am sorry I sound preachy again here even though I have no intention to preach.

The Zen master Huineng who I admire much also went through the path of self-inquiry, so are many many many those who practiced Zen.

Gautama went through self-inquiry.

Zoroaster did not.

Krishna did not.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Sighclone » Mon May 18, 2009 8:34 pm

Tony -

Can you post a reference to Mother Teresa's self-realization?

Thanks,

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Mon May 18, 2009 11:04 pm

Dear Andy,

Perhaps, I misrepresented myself. On the scale of consciousness, Mother Teresa achieved a similar level as that of Ramana Maharshi without self-inquiry. She did go through dark night of the soul experience when she sincerely questioned her personal faith. This may be an equivalent to self-inquiry in the non-duality path for people on the path of faith; however, dark night of the soul experience seems to be a lot harder to endure. Please watch the videos of Mother Teresa on the internet and those of Ramana Maharshi. Pay close attention to Mother Teresa and Ramana Maharshi. You may find that they both emit a very similar energy. Maybe, this can be an awareness exercise. People at the similar level of consciousness actually emit (or absorb) a very similar energy.

On the other hand, we can interpret what Ramana Maharshi went through at age of 16 as dark night of the soul. After that he taught self-inquiry. Mother Teresa before and after her experience of dark night taught faith in God. Just two different paths.

Perhaps, without the dark night of the soul, one can not achieve the level of consciousness of Ramana Maharshi and Mother Teresa. Understanding all these theories is entirely different from experiencing the experience. When and how a person will experience the dark night is not up to the person. A little head-up understanding may make the experience less of a surprise when it comes.

Tony

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by karmarider » Tue May 19, 2009 4:44 am

OneLove wrote:
Ramana Maharshi in an actual nutshell: Who Am I?

It's the only tool a seeker needs. It's applicable to everyone, it is the simplest, most direct, easiest and fastest way to enlightenment. It's really the only thing any seeker needs and it was tuly his only teaching. Regardless of what he would say, he would always refer back to inquiry. It's strange that Eckhart and Adya don't see how indispensable this is in the journey.
Who am I is a great tool, but I can't agree that it's the only one or that it works for everyone. One problem is in translation; in English it sounds like an investigative question, which it isn't. Ramana (and Nisgardatta) suggest to rest on the sense of I AM, which is what this question always leads to. However, it isn't easy for everyone to find the sense of I AM. The sense of I AM can be vague, it can float around, and it can also be a thought, and so for people who have a strong intellect, or think they do, it can be a trap.

I don't see any difference in being present, being aware, effortless meditation, or the sense of I AM.

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by OneLove » Tue May 19, 2009 6:08 am

Tony-S-Ma wrote:suggest to rest on the sense of I AM, which is what this question always leads to. However, it isn't easy for everyone to find the sense of I AM.
This sense "I AM" is misleading, I wish that Ramana would never have said such a thing. It seems to suggest that there is an answer to inquiry, which there isn't. There is no end to the questions. Whenever ego arises, the seeker inquires what is that?
It's like skeetshooting until you see an empty sky. There is no sense that you should be searching for, your just "shooting down" anything that blocks your view.

As for this not being the only way to enlightenment, what other ways are there?

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Re: Ramana Mahrishi in a nutshell

Post by Tony-S-Ma » Tue May 19, 2009 11:09 am

As for this not being the only way to enlightenment, what other ways are there?
There are at least four general ways to awakening:

1. Faith: Unwavering belief in something (God, a master, a practice ,or whatever)

2. Love: Serving selflessly.

3. Hope: Consistently being optimistic (or positive).

4. Conscience: Sincere gratitude towards all those (not just people) responsible for one's existence. The most immediate gratitude is to one's mother.

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