Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

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unbornawakened
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by unbornawakened » Sun Oct 30, 2011 2:22 am

Midnight,

Check this out
http://jedmckenna.wordpress.com/non-dua ... mentalism/

I am just beginning to listen to "Spiritual Enlightenment - The Damndest thing" by Jed McKenna ... just the right stuff to cut through all the BS .... thanks to Euroville for providing that. If interested ask him...

GiveUpTheGhost
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by GiveUpTheGhost » Sun Oct 30, 2011 2:52 am

I feel exactly the same way right now, it isn't because of spirituality though, I've been like this almost every day since my early teens (I'm 23 now). If anything, applying TPoN has given me some relief, it hasn't lasted though. Sometimes I go to a very dark place when I think about how numb I am, what's the point? I rarely feel the aliveness that Eckhart talks about, it's like my consciousness is a dull flourescent light that only illuminates how little I feel. I try and focus on my body but it feels dead, sometimes when I stop thinking there is relief but it's not always there, I'm applying the techniques as best I can but most of the time it doesn't work :(
Gather up the lost and their souls...

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Webwanderer
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by Webwanderer » Sun Oct 30, 2011 3:41 am

GiveUpTheGhost wrote: I rarely feel the aliveness that Eckhart talks about, it's like my consciousness is a dull flourescent light that only illuminates how little I feel. I try and focus on my body but it feels dead, sometimes when I stop thinking there is relief but it's not always there, I'm applying the techniques as best I can but most of the time it doesn't work :(
Try thinking about happier stuff. Stuff that you appreciate in life. Dwell in that appreciation and you may well draw more to appreciate. I'm not suggesting that you identify with anything, just appreciate the good and valuable of what's in every experience. When you feel a sense of appreciation it is expansive to consciousness, and that feeling of expansion is what makes life enjoyable. If you truly want to get out of the numb dead zone of ego depletion, appreciation in life is a key factor. You are not the ego, but what you actually are is real and is capable of great joy. Make the effort to discover it and your life will become an exciting and fun adventure. Denial will only postpone the inevitable and make your immediate experience far less than it could be.

WW

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Midnight
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by Midnight » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:44 pm

ZenDrumming wrote:Midnight,

There are some great pointers in this thread. I'd just like to post a couple questions that come to mind that may be worth looking into.

Are the teachings that "did this to you" bringing you closer to truth? If so, do you wish to be ignorantly blissful instead of aware of Truth?

If the answer to the first question is "no", then can you unlearn the teachings? If they are simply exercises in futility that have been absorbed into your worldview, what's keeping you from discarding them?

I agree with xkatex that looking at ego death from the perspective of ego is a pretty bleak experience. The best advice I can give is to just let go of all of these ideas of numbness, emptiness, disconnectedness, etc. When you feel those things, try not to label it. You can't control your feelings, but you can choose to either fight or accept them, and labeling them seems to be the first step in turning them into concepts that stick. Trust in the fact that you aren't a mistake, and that it's always darkest before the dawn.

Also, and I'm surely not one to judge, but things like alcohol can certainly make it harder to stay out of those mind loops.

I hope you can feel that aliveness again. Best wishes.

Hi

I don't know if these are a worldview per say - i'm now in such a weird mental state i dont often ponder spirituality or read books on it anymore.

The weird feeling came from following this dudes advice in his video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wntj0juznqw

I was in emotional turmoil really at the time for one reason or another, the inquiry blanked out the feelings.

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SandyJoy
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by SandyJoy » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:16 pm

Midnight, Your thread reminds me of that old joke which was something like;

"Doctor, my arm hurts when I wave like this"

and Doc says "Well, don't wave your arm like that" :lol:

I mean really, if some guru's message seems to be telling you to do a practice that takes you down into depression, tightness, smallness and into pain and into numbness and nothingness and without a mind of your own.... then why would you do that practice? :?

Follow your own heart young man, 8) Follow your own inner promptings, don't let someone else ruin your life. Why would you do that?

Follow what is already with you, follow your true self, the child you first arrived here as, the real self, be free.

This Life journey is about finding life again. The practice should help you return to your real self.

Do you remember what you were like as little boy? The 'grown up' world has covered up that real self you are...we are here to rediscover our real self.

If we are to get rid of anything, it is the belief in the 'grown up' mistaken precepts of 'who we are'.

That original self you were as child, he (you) knows the 'grown up world' has got it all wrong.

There is found a great joy when you rediscover your original uncontaminated, unconditioned Child Self.

We are learning to brake out of the myth of a human mistaken belief, the 'grown up' rules and molds and limited framework. The "man' and his 'schooling in grown-up-ness' has put the clamps on the real self you are.

The waking up comes when we find out we have been duped to think we are this limited 'human' view of our self ...we let go that false 'grown up' mistaken controlling, ridged, confined, boxed in, educated into the belief system that has no reality to it at all... we thought we were to accept the false self as 'reality'...we bought the scam and put away our real self.

You will be familiar with your true self, he is that little boy you left behind, you will recognize him when he begins to return. He is still there, right there with you, right now, go get him, go find him and watch and see the joy and delight and wonder and good things that happen for you when you do.

If you want to follow some guru, then why not try following your own inner light, the original you, the child you always are and always will be. He is your best friend and he will lead aright, watch and see.

As the world trip goes, it seems we are to spend some time with 'the old man' in control of us through a bunch of false constructs and beliefs.... But, as it is destined to be... then one day we brake the mold when we see 'old man thinking' has limited us and kept us conforming to standard of false human belief system (telling you who you are)...And that belief system is causing great pain and suffering all over the place.

You see, the child you were when you were a little boy, he was the one who got smothered and put aside as the false self bought the 'bill of goods' and old man's ego ran the show. We believed the game "you have to do it this way, you have to be this or that, you have to be what society says is real and tells you who you are'...that is the hypnotizing preachment we need to see is false.

Who you are is not false or unreal. The identity you have allowed your self to become by the controlling belief system "grown up views-societies' false and mistaken concepts about 'who you are' is where the problem is. We brake out of the mold we mistakenly bought and climbed into.

There is a real Who You Are and you do not want to get rid of that. You cannot get rid of that. No wonder you are sad and numb, who would not be when they are trying to get rid of the very Light and Life and Truth of the Real Identity You were born as.

Sorry, but you, like most of us, you got caught in the very subtle web of the idea that we must grow up and be the man..be the human 'grown up' who lives in a false mistaken, controlling, binding, limiting belief system' about who you are.

You still have a mind of your own, use It and no one killed your Heart, yet.

Rediscover the child you were is still under all that confusion and complication of the intellect and the old man's false control of the your child self, the one you came here to be.

Be brave, it takes guts to Live like you did as a kid, but you can do it.

Return to that little boy you remember, wasn't he precious! Yes! yes!

The child is the one who can Live wide open, fearless, interested, curious, funny, joyful, bright, unhindered, unafraid and not bowing down to 'old men' who want to bridle you from you Living and Loving Life.

This time he knows the 'grown up route' and knows how he does not want to go that way, this time, reborn to Live Free.

You are right, it is a waste of your time to be part of "the man'...it is very depressing.

You still have time to be your True self, you are still here, alive and well....be your self, open up to your true selfhood, expanded self and fully live again.

Well, any of us can reject our self this time around, not live at all, waste our days here in suffering and sadness and hide, and back down from the Truth and from Life and close our self to Life... that is a choice.

But, the Light you came here with is still within you, still a little flicker of a flame of your real self glows within you... get some air on that flame, lift the lid off and let the Life force pour in, be brave and fan the flames shine your light, grow into the grand self you were meant to be...find that unbound, fearless Child you came here to be.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth. :)

Love, Sandy Joy
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

walken
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by walken » Mon Oct 31, 2011 5:25 am

You guys crack me up. Everyone trying to give advice, but not one of you has experienced what he's going through. What this is is unimaginable. This is what happens when you realize that there isn't a me that is in control. The deconstruction of one's identity is not peaches and cream.

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SandyJoy
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by SandyJoy » Mon Oct 31, 2011 7:31 am

walken wrote:You guys crack me up. Everyone trying to give advice, but not one of you has experienced what he's going through. What this is is unimaginable. This is what happens when you realize that there isn't a me that is in control. The deconstruction of one's identity is not peaches and cream.
And you crack me up too... You think there is something he can deconstuct :lol: While at the same time saying "this is what happens to the 'not real' when it losses control :? Sorry, that makes no sense. And who is it that is doing the deconstructing if he just realized there is no self or "me"? and why deconstruct something that you say does not exist? :shock:

That is sort of like saying I realized I am not my shadow so now I am really sad and depressed.

My point is that you are not the shadow, how can that be depressing. You find the Source of the shadow once you realize you are not the shadow.

And even if you do not find the source of the shadow, at least you know there is a source of shadows; that knowing brings great joy and delight.

Once you find the Source, once you find the Tree or the Real Identity, you no longer try to do anything with or to the shadow, you just stick with the Source. Now you know your are the Source of the shadow and you also enjoy the shadows, you don't have to get rid of them or demolish them, or even call them 'not real'.

Now you know the beauty of the shadow is that is leads to the Tree!! Yipee for both shadow and tree, it all works perfectly!

Finding the Source, find Real Identity, finding Reality is pure Joy, pure freedom from fear, pure new adventures through life, like being born anew, to live again. It is not depressing in anyway at all, it is liberation.

All I know is what I have found and I have found peace and joy and wonderment and Life. Why would any one dwell on 'what is not me' when once they find the Real Self, the Source that is who they are.

When we find the Source of the shadow, who in there right mind would go back to being a shadow?

Anyway, it is much easier to just say find the child you were those years ago and when you do, you will be knowing what I am talking about.

It's up to you, you have the options to choose whether you want to stand with Identity as the "whole tree self" or continue trying to dispose of the shadow that leads to the tree.

Eventually, you come to appreciate the gift of the shadow, or the 'ego me sense'... It serves a very loving purpose, it takes us home if we let it.

Much Love, Sandy Joy
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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Midnight
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by Midnight » Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:45 pm

I agree with what Walken said here, it's impossible to know unless you've experienced this - BUT, I do really really appreciate the replies.

What's the deal then SandyJoy? After finding no me I feel desolate and empty, everything's numb and pointless. Even though everything carries on as it used to there's no interest in many things I used to enjoy and my emotions feel cut off completely. This doesn't feel like a joyful realization. I actually quite liked 'me' at times. :?


Are you speculating through your description of liberation or is it a real thing for you? Don't be dishonest.

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SandyJoy
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by SandyJoy » Mon Oct 31, 2011 7:57 pm

Midnight wrote:I agree with what Walken said here, it's impossible to know unless you've experienced this - BUT, I do really really appreciate the replies.

What's the deal then SandyJoy? After finding no me I feel desolate and empty, everything's numb and pointless. Even though everything carries on as it used to there's no interest in many things I used to enjoy and my emotions feel cut off completely. This doesn't feel like a joyful realization. I actually quite liked 'me' at times. :?


Are you speculating through your description of liberation or is it a real thing for you? Don't be dishonest.
Hi Midnight,

I am not speculating.

I suspect that the "me' that you used to like is your real self, the one I call the Child. Return to that 'me' that you liked.

I am talking about that you can re-discover your identity and you will find yourself come alive again. and you will love Life again, fully and joyfully.

What I am saying is that there is a real you, there is a 'me' and it will not ever leave you or forsake you. It is your comforter and it is your Light and your Life.

It is individual and unique and very special when you find that little boy again.

This time you will know the treasure you are and you will know what you have been given.

This time you won't try to get rid of anything about you...you will love the all of you, the whole total wonder of you.

I am saying you can come back to the "me' you tried to demolish and you will see how beautiful and delightful and full of life and joy you are. Try to remember your self as a little boy, there is something marvelous there, a little boy who sits right next to God.

When you find your self it will feel so comfortable, so familiar to you, there will no doubt as to what you have found. You know this person, you and he are buds, and he will be your saving Grace, find Him.

I know that my words are not the norm around here...I know that no one likes the mention of God but God is the very Source of all that is... This is what I have found so I am sharing it with you.

Love you, SandyJoy
Last edited by SandyJoy on Mon Oct 31, 2011 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by Webwanderer » Mon Oct 31, 2011 8:11 pm

I heartily agree with SandyJoy. It is my experience that life as the 'source of shadow' is a joy. I have lived in depression so I know from experience that it can be released in favor of all that SandyJoy pointed out. Stop looking at that that causes you pain and look at that that brings you joy.

Appreciation for what is aligns our human consciousness with source. It is natural, and with a decided focus it flows from source of its own accord. It's like a fathomless well that you only need to prime to get it flowing. But source energy flows toward focus. If the focus is on nothing you get more nothing. Look to anything of value and appreciate it. Rest in the present awareness of appreciation. It you feel better for it, do it some more.

In a little time a trickle will grow to flow, and a flow with grow to a gusher. Whatever you focus on, you get more of. That's the second primary reason to watch thoughts and emotions. (The first is to realize they are not you.) Thoughts and emotions are the guide for life's energy to create experience.

WW

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Midnight
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by Midnight » Mon Oct 31, 2011 10:39 pm

SandyJoy wrote:
Midnight wrote:I agree with what Walken said here, it's impossible to know unless you've experienced this - BUT, I do really really appreciate the replies.

What's the deal then SandyJoy? After finding no me I feel desolate and empty, everything's numb and pointless. Even though everything carries on as it used to there's no interest in many things I used to enjoy and my emotions feel cut off completely. This doesn't feel like a joyful realization. I actually quite liked 'me' at times. :?


Are you speculating through your description of liberation or is it a real thing for you? Don't be dishonest.
Hi Midnight,

I am not speculating.

I suspect that the "me' that you used to like is your real self, the one I call the Child. Return to that 'me' that you liked.

I am talking about that you can re-discover your identity and you will find yourself come alive again. and you will love Life again, fully and joyfully.

What I am saying is that there is a real you, there is a 'me' and it will not ever leave you or forsake you. It is your comforter and it is your Light and your Life.

It is individual and unique and very special when you find that little boy again.

This time you will know the treasure you are and you will know what you have been given.

This time you won't try to get rid of anything about you...you will love the all of you, the whole total wonder of you.

I am saying you can come back to the "me' you tried to demolish and you will see how beautiful and delightful and full of life and joy you are. Try to remember your self as a little boy, there is something marvelous there, a little boy who sits right next to God.

When you find your self it will feel so comfortable, so familiar to you, there will no doubt as to what you have found. You know this person, you and he are buds, and he will be your saving Grace, find Him.

I know that my words are not the norm around here...I know that no one likes the mention of God but God is the very Source of all that is... This is what I have found so I am sharing it with you.

Love you, SandyJoy
I'm sorry but I'm just finding it difficult to buy into any of this. I'm not a little boy. Why would I want to be my inner child? I don't even understand how you can apply advice like this. :?

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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by arel » Mon Oct 31, 2011 10:45 pm

Hey Midnight. What bad habits do you have? Be honest.
What I say is only my viewpoint.

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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by alex » Tue Nov 01, 2011 12:18 am

Hey bro,
I'm sorry you're going through such a shitty time.
I'm just curious, do you still dedicate time to self enquiry? To being aware of awareness? Do you think you have recognized your true self yet and do you spend any time resting there?
It sounds as though you are still very caught up in the story of me. The story can be so convincing sometimes but don't forget you can always come back to peaceful thought free awareness, if the outter world is so depressing and numb why not concentrate on finding your inner self?
Don't worry about finding the aliveness and joy, wanting something that is not there will just make you feel worse. Those things will come in their own good time, trust me. Maybe just dedicate your life to recognizing awareness itself and rest there over and over.
Peace

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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by far_eastofwest » Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:13 am

Hi ya midnight (its a lovely name and reminds me of a gorgeous horse stamping its hooves and wanting to be away)

Firstly, take into account alcohol use and why and what you expect from drinking it.

Midnight, the inner child stuff Robert Burney has quite a lot to say about this if you are interested in learning more.

I think you still got the spark, read a post about indian gurus and your response came through with your point of view and quite strongly. You is still there. The YOU may be just a bit submerged under all this nice/fluffy/be in the moment stuff. Wrapped in cotton wool... its safe but it gets very uncomforatable. Just needed some ones post to piss you off a bit to bring it out to the surface. Who knows? Oh... you will know.

Interestingly, someone commented about people being programmed with shoulds etc.
When you read or learn certain things and reason that "this is how life should be".... then you can have problems. An idea/comcept of what you Should feel like (an expectation) and if you cannot reach that point then your expectation isn't met and leads to depression.

You say you 'actually quite liked me'.... well you are still quite likable now going on the nice responses to you on this forum. Your likableness is there, its may be you who are judging yourself from a different angle?

And cause and effect.... you may think doing the ET thing is in some way a cause of your negative feelings/emptiness now (i'm not saying it has or hasn't cos i really have no idea), perhaps ask yourself... what prompted you to start looking for answers and picking up the book in the first place... the feelings, were they there all along but you've now become more aware of them?

Its good to ask other people questions, but its also good to ask yourself questions too.

to me, (just my whacky opinion) sounds like midnight needs to get out of the stable and have a good gallop on the open range, flick whatever is riding him off, and just go.
There is nothing harder to find than a black cat in a dark room
Especially when there is no cat....

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SandyJoy
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Re: Noone else just numb due to these teachings?

Post by SandyJoy » Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:42 am

Midnight wrote:I'm sorry but I'm just finding it difficult to buy into any of this. I'm not a little boy. Why would I want to be my inner child? I don't even understand how you can apply advice like this.
I am not talking about the wounded child or the inner child of psychology. No, this is much more like the soul of you, the heart of you, the real of you, the one you are right now, right here, before time and space and before the belief in birth and death. I am telling you there is a Real Self and it so close to you even now, it is Love and it is with you always and never leaves you.... but that is alright, you do not want to hear about it.

I am also saying that if you are numb and lifeless then you are still soaking in the beliefs, you have not opened your self to see who you are. You have glommed on to some dark and even sadder false mistaken belief about yourself.

But, perhaps that is alright, sometimes we need to bring ourselves into even the appearance of worse situations in order to wake up and Live again. Sometimes we need to drag our self through unreal thicker mud and we need to put more false hurdles along our road. But you will leap those hurdles and you will come out of mud and you will see none of it was ever real nor harmful....It's all good, it all has its reason and purpose...and you will find your self worthy of the simple things and you will find yourself alive, vulnerable, tender, raw, defenseless, childlike and unafraid.

Much Love, SandyJoy
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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