Does You Know What Love Is?

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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby dijmart » Sat May 31, 2014 12:42 am

Phil2 wrote:Nothing personal of course ...

8)


Phil, I was speaking "relatively", of course, sorry if you take that as an insult or putting you in a box. You are a guy (Phil) and you said you speak French. So, the conclusion is "a french guy". Of course, you really are pure awareness/the Self appearing as a human being. Phil, you DO have a relative existence or you wouldn't be typing. So, relatively speaking, which I was...I'm a Caucasian, 43 yr old, english speaking female from the U.S. So, I'm an American, relatively speaking, of course and would take no offense to being called an American. And if you didn't take it personally, it sure seems as if you did. If you don't see yourself as relatively existing, then your answer to my question would have been...I'm pure awareness, not where "you" live or what "your" native tongue is. So, what's the problem?
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Clouded » Sat May 31, 2014 2:07 am

Phil is a hypocrite. So I've been sending him PMs about that girl from the gossip forum and at one point, he asked me for my real name, which I was hesitant to give, who cares what name my parents gave me? Then after I read that he speaks French, I told him that I also speak fluently in French and that he could write back in French if he wishes and then he proceeded by asking me where I live and where did I learn to speak French. Like I said, when I see bullshit, I call bullshit. Practice what you preach dude!! You can't just lecture people that they shouldn't be curious or whatever and then do the exact same thing you condemn to another.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby dijmart » Sat May 31, 2014 2:16 am

Clouded wrote: when I see bullshit, I call bullshit. Practice what you preach dude!! You can't just lecture people that they shouldn't be curious or whatever and then do the exact same thing you condemn to another.


Thanks Clouded, Phil has had an issue with me for awhile, don't know why exactly, but I've got his number. If I didn't, I sure do after this...
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 10:06 am

dijmart wrote:
Phil2 wrote:Nothing personal of course ...

8)


Phil, I was speaking "relatively", of course, sorry if you take that as an insult or putting you in a box. You are a guy (Phil) and you said you speak French. So, the conclusion is "a french guy". Of course, you really are pure awareness/the Self appearing as a human being. Phil, you DO have a relative existence or you wouldn't be typing. So, relatively speaking, which I was...I'm a Caucasian, 43 yr old, english speaking female from the U.S. So, I'm an American, relatively speaking, of course and would take no offense to being called an American. And if you didn't take it personally, it sure seems as if you did. If you don't see yourself as relatively existing, then your answer to my question would have been...I'm pure awareness, not where "you" live or what "your" native tongue is. So, what's the problem?


No DJ, there is no problem, you just misunderstood what I said ...

What I say is rather simple and not personal: when you qualify someone - anybody - saying "You are this or that" you are immediately imprisoning a person in a box, identifying him with a limited form ... and when we do this, we kind of 'take control' of the other person ... which is a basic need of ego ie. control ...

Well now if you want to make all this 'personal' or 'emotional', go for it ...

8)
Last edited by Phil2 on Sat May 31, 2014 10:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 10:10 am

Clouded wrote:Phil is a hypocrite.


lol ... here's another 'box' from Clouded ...

Personally I think it is a problem for correct dialogue in forums when people start to throw 'names' at each other ...

Clouded would you mind to remember the First Agreement "Be impeccable with your word" ? ... This is not a 'gossip forum' ...

Maybe the mods could give their opinion on this one ...

:?:
Last edited by Phil2 on Sat May 31, 2014 11:24 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 10:22 am

Clouded wrote:Phil is a hypocrite. So I've been sending him PMs about that girl from the gossip forum and at one point, he asked me for my real name, which I was hesitant to give, who cares what name my parents gave me? Then after I read that he speaks French, I told him that I also speak fluently in French and that he could write back in French if he wishes and then he proceeded by asking me where I live and where did I learn to speak French. Like I said, when I see bullshit, I call bullshit. Practice what you preach dude!! You can't just lecture people that they shouldn't be curious or whatever and then do the exact same thing you condemn to another.


BTW There are rules in this forum, one of those rules is:

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2051


6. Keep Private Messages Private
Please do not post messages that are not related to the topic of the thread, and are of no interest to the general public. Private messages should be sent privately.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby dijmart » Sat May 31, 2014 2:49 pm

Phil2 wrote:No DJ, there is no problem, you just misunderstood what I said ...

What I say is rather simple and not personal: when you qualify someone - anybody - saying "You are this or that" you are immediately imprisoning a person in a box, identifying him with a limited form ... and when we do this, we kind of 'take control' of the other person ... which is a basic need of ego ie. control ...

Well now if you want to make all this 'personal' or 'emotional', go for it ...

8)


I think Onceler said it best when he said you were spiritually passive/aggressive, but in your case you start with being aggressive, then turn around and act passive. ie: you just misunderstood, what I say is not personal, I'm trying to teach you about your ego, blah, blah, blah. Your "game" is getting old indeed and boring.

Like I said, "I got your number". :wink:

See RT said-

runstrails wrote:I'm picturing you with a Hercule Poirot accent :wink:.


I don't see you lecturing her about putting you in a box, what her ego is doing, ect... why?... Oh, wait, probably because she's a mod and could delete you from this forum with a push of a button!
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby dijmart » Sat May 31, 2014 3:04 pm

Phil2 wrote:
Clouded wrote:Phil is a hypocrite.


lol ... here's another 'box' from Clouded ...

Personally I think it is a problem for correct dialogue in forums when people start to throw 'names' at each other ...

Clouded would you mind to remember the First Agreement "Be impeccable with your word" ? ... This is not a 'gossip forum' ...

Maybe the mods could give their opinion on this one ...

:?:


First of all, why would the mods care if she called you a hypocrite? Here is the definition: a person who claims or pretends to have certain beliefs about what is right but who behaves in a way that disagrees with those beliefs. She didn't call you a swear word!

Also, these agreements having nothing to do with this forum, but you throw them around like they are law and no one here has to abide by them, because YOU say so. That is your ego.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 3:06 pm

dijmart wrote:Oh, wait, probably because she's a mod and could delete you from this forum with a push of a button!


Are you making assumptions here DJ ? Breaking the Third Agreement ?

...

You already broke the Second one by taking things so personally ... bad track DJ ... too bad ... really ...

:wink:
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby dijmart » Sat May 31, 2014 3:20 pm

Phil2 wrote:
dijmart wrote:Oh, wait, probably because she's a mod and could delete you from this forum with a push of a button!


Are you making assumptions here DJ ? Breaking the Third Agreement ?

...

You already broke the Second one by taking things so personally ... bad track DJ ... too bad ... really ...

:wink:


Must I repeat what I already wrote? Apparently so, these agreements having nothing to do with this forum, but you throw them around like they are law and no one here has to abide by them, because YOU say so. That is your ego.

I got your number, Phil :wink:

Again, this is getting old and boring. :roll:
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 3:44 pm

dijmart wrote:Also, these agreements having nothing to do with this forum ...


Well it would be interesting to see how those agreements correlate with Eckhart teachings ...

Let us see:

1) Be impeccable with your word ...


It means do not use words neither against others nor against yourself ... didn't ET stress the importance of not feeding negative thoughts, and not gossiping on others ?

2) Don't take things personally ...


Well, as we are not forms but formless, why would we take anything personally ? Moreover also ET showed that what people say result from their 'conditioning' (education, personal story, culture etc ...) hence that what they do is NOT personal, but the result of this conditioning ... so nothing is personal finally ...

As Carl Jung said:

"We are not of today or of yesterday; we are of an immense age."
... and he also coined the "collective unconscious" ...

3) Do not make assumptions ...

Assumptions are thought creations, right ? What other people are is never what we think they are ... better stick to facts ... and not make movies about all things ...

Seeing no contradiction with ET's teachings here ...

4) Always do your best ...

Well, doing your best means stay in the awareness of now, what else ?

Eckhart Tolle's teaching 'plain vanilla' I'd say ... :)

So finally DJ, the Four Agreements are totally in line with this forum scope from what I see ... don't you ?

:?:
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Onceler » Sat May 31, 2014 4:07 pm

Perhaps we should start another thread on The Four Agreements, under spiritual teachers, as they figure prominately into another thread, 'this I know', and seem to be causing 'disagreement' over there as well.....

Here is my take on The book, which I read, and the larger context. I was a big Carlos Castaneda fan in my early adult years.....that tradition was also termed 'Toltec'. To me, T4A is a watered down version of the many books of Castaneda, which were much more complex, but also shrouded in mystery and argued over as to their authenticity.

To add more context, I visited Teotihuacan, the pyramids of the sun north of Mexico City and a truly amazing place. Tourism was slow at this time, due the drug violence in Mexico. There were many guides and locals selling art etc. and although they were beautiful and humble people, there was an air of a sort of desperate hustle to the whole thing. Our guide claimed to be a local and descendant of the toltecs and also related to Don Miguel Ruiz, he was his uncle, I believe. He was more than happy to take me to his home and introduce me to the clan and local tradition. Problem is that the city of Teotihauacan was known for being a mixture of many cultures, not just Toltec, and, although it's demise was a mystery, it's believed the Aztecs came through and killed everyone (or aliens came through and beamed everyone up, depending on the narrative).

This is all to say, T4A may be a good case study in how spiritual narratives get promulgated and polished over time. A highly articulated philosophy similar, yet slightly different to many others, origins murky, and with great individual appeal to its readers who gain their own meaning from the text.

Hmmmmm. Sound familiar?
Last edited by Onceler on Sat May 31, 2014 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Sat May 31, 2014 4:12 pm

As I watch this thread devolve I look at the title and see a wonderful lesson waiting to be learned,

Love,

Jack
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 31, 2014 4:17 pm

EnterZenFromThere wrote:As I watch this thread devolve I look at the title and see a wonderful lesson waiting to be learned,

Love,

Jack


Right Jack, when things are taken personally, there can be no love ... because love can only flower when the 'me' (as personal ego/self) is absent ...
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Re: Does You Know What Love Is?

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Sat May 31, 2014 4:35 pm

Whatever lesson is here to be learned is personal IMO. From our unique perspective we all see the lesson differently. What you say is yours, to another is theirs. You speak with certainty, but I see only certainty being spoken from one perspective in time, to that perspective in time. It may overlap with others but not with certainty. But then who am I to look at your words and speak my mind to you as though I am right and you are wrong? Can there be a thing such as right and wrong? I don't have words to say what love is, but I know what I feel shining through me and I know how to find it. It calls to me and hand in hand I walk toward home. Right here and now I don't need words, just this...

Musing love,

Jack
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