The Ego Is My Friend

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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Tue May 12, 2015 4:27 pm

Without doubt the most profound post I've read in my time on this forum. I've not heard an account of awareness beyond body that is so clear and precise. It helps clarify what enlightenment may be and why a focus on our individual experience within the present is the key to that awakening.

I found the part about the old man watching the people he loved die and knowing his own death was coming incredibly moving. I didnt know it was possible to be that graceful. I'm in awe.

Thank you very much for this Fore. I look forward to hearing more.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Fore » Wed May 13, 2015 12:17 am

I appreciate the kind words guys.
I hope that the point of experience being bodily(five senses) and not out of body(no five senses) is a little clearer. I do understand what most consider out of body experiences to be in a conventional sense, but I disagree with these as they are experiences that incorporate the sense doors.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Enlightened2B » Wed May 13, 2015 1:52 am

Fore wrote:I do understand what most consider out of body experiences to be in a conventional sense, but I disagree with these as they are experiences that incorporate the sense doors.


From what I've come to see, Out of Body experiences are not black and white. Meaning, what you experienced yourself, if it was out of body (I don't know what it was, but it was definitely profound for sure), was likely a more subtle, higher realm/dimension where you connected directly with your higher self which is Pure Awareness, than those people who are just leaving their bodies. Definitely some clairvoyance there as well for you.

The majority of out of body experiences though, are happening at the very, very low dense levels, which are quite close to the physical levels in density, which is why there is still an association of sorts, with a body for some. Like William Bulhman talks about putting his hand through a wall. He had an 'apparent' hand because he literally just rolled out of his body into the first realm outside of the physical. Therefore, there's still a body association at that low level, but no actual physical body, but that just proves that physical sensory, while a product of the brain, is a product of mind and mind is active in the non physical realms. Because, in the non physical realms, mind instantaneously manifests based on belief. Dr. Lani Leary had an intensely profound NDE, while she did not have any physical body, she did hear angelic music in her return to the light. These people were clearly out of their bodies. They witnessed their bodies from above. So, ultimately, every experience is different and it depends on what frequency level we go to. All is Awareness. This is why I said that reality is likely far far more complex than most of us understand with likely hundreds and hundreds of dimensions and frequency levels, and because of the complexity of the planes and frequency levels, many experiences differ from each other. Enlightenment, if it does it exist, i would say is merely the understanding of who we truly are at the most basic level. But, likely, every single one of us, no matter how enlightened we think we are, will have to navigate the greater reality once we leave these bodies for good.

Anyway, if you're interested, in gaining a better understanding of out of body experiences, do check out the William Buhlman's link I posted in the other post. This guy is not about 'craving' of experiences. His teachings are all about meditation and going within ourselves, to understand our true nature, and understanding how our thoughts manifest, but in the process, understanding the greater reality as well.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Enlightened2B » Wed May 13, 2015 2:27 am

Fore, I was really touched by your post about your experience with meditation. I wanted to ask your opinion on something and Jack too.

I've been meditating for almost 10 years on and off....used to do more of a formal sitting one twice a day. But, now it's less rigid. Anyway, as I mentioned, I have anxiety of late and honestly.....some of the worst I've ever had in my life. I sit here laughing because it's almost comical. I've never ever ever had anxiety like this before. It started over the last two months and it started when I started doing a connected breathing meditation practice. I noticed that I've become SUPER sensitive to stuff now as stuff is coming up in my life that likely has been suppressed for eons and the anxiety is always a result of me, not wanting those emotions to be there and resisting.

So, back to meditation. My experience with meditation is that....when I focus on the emotion or sensation in the body, (and Fore, you were dead accurate as the sensation of anxiety, is right at the top of my abdomen, lower chest area and like a pit), the sensation often breaks up. However....it's the thought which energizes the emotion. There's one issue in my life right now that's causing me a lot of anxiety which has been triggered off by an external cause, but is related to control issues with me and uncertainty in my own life, and it's the thought itself of the external issue (which is just a trigger for something that needed to become conscious anyway), that keeps re-energizing the feeling and I'm simply watching watching and watching it and embracing it with utter love. I'm wondering though....how is it, that I can learn from an experience of anxiety or gain what I need to gain for my own evolution, if I don't inquire further in the root cause? What do you guys suggest? Do you think observation of thought/sensation is enough for you?

Would love your opinions. Thanks.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Fore » Wed May 13, 2015 12:25 pm

Enlightened2B wrote:
I've been meditating for almost 10 years on and off....used to do more of a formal sitting one twice a day. But, now it's less rigid. Anyway, as I mentioned, I have anxiety of late and honestly.....some of the worst I've ever had in my life. I sit here laughing because it's almost comical. I've never ever ever had anxiety like this before. It started over the last two months and it started when I started doing a connected breathing meditation practice. I noticed that I've become SUPER sensitive to stuff now as stuff is coming up in my life that likely has been suppressed for eons and the anxiety is always a result of me, not wanting those emotions to be there and resisting.

So, back to meditation. My experience with meditation is that....when I focus on the emotion or sensation in the body, (and Fore, you were dead accurate as the sensation of anxiety, is right at the top of my abdomen, lower chest area and like a pit), the sensation often breaks up. However....it's the thought which energizes the emotion. There's one issue in my life right now that's causing me a lot of anxiety which has been triggered off by an external cause, but is related to control issues with me and uncertainty in my own life, and it's the thought itself of the external issue (which is just a trigger for something that needed to become conscious anyway), that keeps re-energizing the feeling and I'm simply watching watching and watching it and embracing it with utter love. I'm wondering though....how is it, that I can learn from an experience of anxiety or gain what I need to gain for my own evolution, if I don't inquire further in the root cause? What do you guys suggest? Do you think observation of thought/sensation is enough for you?

Would love your opinions. Thanks.


Fore wrote:Understand that I am a student not a teacher, and I am not trying to guide and teach you through this experience, if you are interested I can provide you with an appropriate facility for this, but only if you are interested.


I am dead serious about this, I cannot guide you through these experiences, also it takes a controlled environment to be guided into the body and this takes some time, it takes some time for the mind to settle down before insight practices can begin, then it takes some time for the teachings to be presented as one is experiencing a depth of insight. Also it is important to have access to a teacher as these past traumas come to the surface, sometime many come at once and people get confused and end up going in a different direction. A qualified teacher knows what to look for and can help one back to observing these traumas in a beneficial way.

I assure you there is no dogmas attached to this place, just truths as you can experience them within the framework of your own body, it is also free to participate, all your accommodations and food, is taken care of by the old students within this centre. Only once you fully complete a course are you given the opportunity to donate, and this is not mandatory. These centres are all over the world, I will gladly pm you the information to look at if you are interested.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Enlightened2B » Wed May 13, 2015 3:44 pm

Thanks Fore. Totally understand you're not a teacher. Just asking for practical meditation advice. I'm very familiar with silent treats for vipassana and other practices as my ex gf used to attend them and she lived at an ashram also for a bit. I'm not really interested in them to be honest, but you can send me the info if you'd like so I can take a look at it.

Basically, I don't really believe in the concept of a guru or teacher as a long term tool. I think there can be people to guide you. But, unfortunately, none of them can know your own direct experience. The advice I was asking for is basically.....what has worked for you guys in your own experiences, to see if I can relate it to my own experience. Anyway, thanks again and feel free to shoot me a pm with the info.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed May 13, 2015 4:50 pm

Enlightened2B wrote:Thanks Fore. Totally understand you're not a teacher. Just asking for practical meditation advice. I'm very familiar with silent treats for vipassana and other practices as my ex gf used to attend them and she lived at an ashram also for a bit. I'm not really interested in them to be honest, but you can send me the info if you'd like so I can take a look at it.

Basically, I don't really believe in the concept of a guru or teacher as a long term tool. I think there can be people to guide you. But, unfortunately, none of them can know your own direct experience. The advice I was asking for is basically.....what has worked for you guys in your own experiences, to see if I can relate it to my own experience. Anyway, thanks again and feel free to shoot me a pm with the info.


In a way I don't want to answer, as too many opinions can be counter-productive. But I'll write a little about what I've found helpful and you can do with it what you like.

It sounds like you might be over thinking things and getting a bit too intellectual about it. This is certainly something I have done (and continue to do). Sometimes I think people get hooked on reading lots of books about spiritual principles and get a bit lost in the swarm of all those different opinions informed by all those different experiences. I'm not saying it's bad to be inquisitive or informed, just that it can be detrimental if we start creating a bunch of assumptions based on second hand experience. I've been doing a tonne of that lately - jumping to conclusions about life and experience and my relationship to these. When things get confused like that, the best thing I can think of is to go back to basics. What is happening right now?

It doesn't need to be any more complex than that. It doesn't matter how or why different levels or states of being are or are not. What is happening right now?

When I rest in that place I don't feel so concerned about how and why reality is as it is, or is not as it is not. I realise I've been straining to perceive reality how I think it should be perceived, rather than allowing myself to rest within the perception that I actually have right now. When I'm resting like that, I can allow anxiety to come and go without trying to suppress it or get attached to it. I can allow pleasant experiences to come and go without getting attached to them or trying to suppress them. Right now, for me, that feels far more favourable a way of being than struggling with the details of reality - no matter how right or appealing they may seem, or how wrong or unappealing they may seem.

Allowing right now without trying to make it be something else. Even allowing the part of me that DOES want it to be something else. Not trying to force my present moment experience to be or not be anything - accepting whatever it is, no matter how simple and ordinary or grand and extraordinary.

This post feels more like me writing advice to myself than to you. If it is helpful to you that's great. But, like Fore, I'm no teacher. I understand the pain of anxiety so I hope you can be present with it and allow it to express itself to you and pass through you. I'm in a similar boat and am slowing allowing myself to express, experience and pass through my anxieties. It takes patience, relaxed awareness and gentle activity - but it is getting there, step by step. Some days I feel so stricken with anxiety I can barely go into a shop. Other days I feel so open and free I effortlessly interact without fear of how I might be or be interpreted as being. Not suppressing the bad and not clinging to the good through relaxed awareness of my momentary experience is what is working best for me right now.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Enlightened2B » Wed May 13, 2015 6:52 pm

Thanks Jack for your response. I think you and Fore basically are pointing to the same thing (presence) and it's what my own experience is pointing to as well. It seems that my own experience itself is calling me back to myself as well in a strange way. Intuitively, I know that all external triggers of anxiety and fear, are just signposts for me to simply stop resisting my experience and go within and embrace them in allowance, yet the hard part, sometimes is just that and not getting too caught up in the actual 'thought' itself, which triggers the anxiety.

You're right about spiritual concepts and ideas and they could most certainly be a distraction when grasped as second hand knowledge and I can attest to this that I do get too caught up in ideas at times (as evidenced by my obnoxious posts) especially pertaining to the study of the nature of reality, I totally agree. This is a prime example. It's irrelevant to my own experience and can often be a big distraction as it complicates things from the very simplicity of 'what is'. Like you said, it's not a matter of it being bad to study it, but I do tend (astutely noticed by you) to get too caught up in concepts at times that resonate with me.

That aside, I don't believe any of them are necessarily triggering off my anxiety per say, although they do just compound the confusion at times. If anything, I am trying to explore first hand now, through direct experience some of the ideas and techniques as I'm tired of relying on second hand knowledge and I find enjoyment with it as well, which I find most important. I don't think out of body exploration is in contrast to a practice of presence. I only think it becomes a problem when we rely too much, conceptually in believing something through the mind alone, that we don't have any experience with. I think it can be a wonderful complement though actually, if it goes beyond concepts, as I believe it goes hand in hand with meditation. Going out of body, teaches you to let go and allow. I know first hand, the experience of leaving the body because I've experienced it since I was a kid and never realized what it was until recently. I realized that I have a ton of fear that has been reflected back to me during the times when I come close to leaving my body and when I lucid dream. I find the exploration itself a form of teacher and a mirror for myself. When I'm stuck with sleep paralysis and vibrational buzzing through my body, during the early stages of leaving my body, this is an opportunity for me, to simply allow and instead, I do the opposite and tend to resist and resist and resist due to crippling fear in the early stages of the experience and as a result, I can't let go. I would not have known this if not for the experience itself of leaving my body (which now happens on its own to me during the early morning hours when I'm half awake and I have no control over it), as this was a sign of all of the fear I have in my life right now that is also appearing as anxiety and being triggered as well by physical sources.

Therefore, I believe the notion of allowing and not resisting is evident in every aspect of our experience. Yet, I agree that it could be overwhelming, when strictly conceptually grasped on to and that's where I need to take a step back at times and simply get back to the basics of 'Being' more often. My mind has always been very analytical, which can be good at times in interacting in the world, but can also be a form of a huge detriment spiritually speaking and I try to analyze my experience to much as well.

That aside, I don't take either of you as a teacher, but I value both of your insights, because both of you have deeply, deeply shared your experiences on this forum at one point or another, and as I see it, part of looking at someone or something as a guide, is being able to relate (if possible) their similar experiences to my very own experience.

Anyway, it's pretty obvious that all of my fear and anxiety is caused by resistance. Even when I think I'm embracing the anxiety, the fact that I still feel so painful and so emotional, is likely a product of still unconscious resistance and fear.

Thanks guys for your insight. I appreciate both of you. Much love to both of you.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Fore » Fri May 15, 2015 12:51 am

Enlightened2B wrote:Basically, I don't really believe in the concept of a guru or teacher as a long term tool.

I'm not talking about gurus, just someone who has taken a few more steps that can help guide you into the body and help navigate in the beginning. Once one learns to practice, then they are encouraged to work in a more independent fashion.



Enlightened2B wrote:I think there can be people to guide you. But, unfortunately, none of them can know your own direct experience.

Individual experience can be different, but the path has certain waypoints one can reach, an experienced teacher can recognise these and help students to not get stuck at certain points.

Enlightened2B wrote:The advice I was asking for is basically.....what has worked for you guys in your own experiences, to see if I can relate it to my own experience. Anyway, thanks again and feel free to shoot me a pm with the info.

It would be extremely difficult for me to help guide you by describing my practice to you, my practice has certain elements that are unique to this tradition, also where I am spiritually may be different to you or others. The way I worked observing the body is much different now than when I first began to practice, as the body opens up or is experiencing tension, we work in different ways observing this changing flow of energy.

The practice is vipassana as taught by S.N. Goenka you can Google this is you are interested. I find this very much in line with Mr. Tolles teachings.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Enlightened2B » Fri May 15, 2015 5:35 am

Thanks Fore.....I had a feeling it was Vipassana. I actually have the pamphlet still that my ex gave me. Will take a look again though. Thanks again for sharing.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby DavidB » Fri May 15, 2015 12:25 pm

Fore wrote:
DavidB wrote:Ego is my friend, indeed, of course it is, it was created by consciousness.


Yes, ego should be looked at as a friend, this is where the practice of insight lies, developing in compassion to all suffering beings. But this is not the case, the habit pattern of mind is to cling to that we find pleasant and push away that we find unpleasant. In essence creating more self more misery. This is why everything is misery, everything(energetic entity) in existence requires to be seen with compassion, to be allowed the freedom, the space, to rise up and come out of misery(liberation). We are to let go of this past selves and stop generating new selves.


Misery is the mistaken belief that at some point in the future, when all of the right conditions have been met, we will become fulfilled, awakened, enlightened, transcendent.

Liberation is the realization that there is no self, nothing to do, nothing to achieve, no awakening, no enlightenment, no transcendence, the end of suffering.

The ego loves the spiritual path, it is a self identification so subtle that we hardly realize we have it. :wink:
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby Mystic » Thu May 21, 2015 11:10 am

I reckon the ego is similar to a veil or a fog of darkness that obscures the inner light. It has a relative existence and is dependent on the light, like the way a movie projection on a screen is dependent on the light within the movie projector. It reminds me of Plato's allegory of the cave. The shadows on the wall of the cave would not exist without the light. The ego was created by our mind. The ego identifies with form, it identifies with a body but we are not just a body. It is more like the body exists inside the mind, the mind does not exist inside the body. The brain is more like a radio receiver for consciousness. The body is like a classroom and we can learn valuable lessons of life. The ego seeks conflict, the spirit cooperation.

In the Gospel of Thomas, Jesus said: "Love your brother like your soul, guard him like the pupil of your eye."

The light of life is in all of creation and is pure awareness - the one life. We are all one.
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby DavidB » Fri May 22, 2015 7:08 am

If there is only light, then the ego must be a manifestation of that same light.

The ego doesn't actually exist though per se. Ego was a term invented by Sigmund Freud to refer to a particular aspect which he identified of the human psyche, not a separate and unique manifestation however.

People are using the term Ego these days in the same way that many years ago people might have used the term Satan or the Devil, and the manifestations of the Ego are used these days in the same way that people many years ago might have referred to as Sin or Iniquity.

The irony is that the Ego (if it existed, which it doesn't) would revel in the the fact that there has been invented this imaginary foe, further magnified and entertained by feelings of victim hood and accusation, who might be blamed for all human misery, and who if overcome, at some point in the future, when the right conditions have been met, might lead to enlightened transformation.

If that doesn't smell like a nasty manifestation of duality, then I don't know what else could be.

In my experience, the so called spiritual are often the most deluded, drunk with their ideas of enlightened transcendence, not content to be ordinary as a relatively uninteresting animal. Look at the religious for example and its self righteous, totalitarian dogmatism and delusions of grandeur. It is often forgotten by the same religious/spiritual seeker, that above all else the individual is sacred, becoming instead often deluded by the fantastically seductive urge for collectivism. Not for an instinct realizing that that their collectivist dogmatism is incompatible with unconditional love, which is the total acceptance of the unique individual, the very foundation stone of human existence. Not realizing therefore that loving your brother as yourself is in fact requesting that you first love yourself, and you then love your brother, as two unique, beautiful and worthy individuals. In the same way that I might accept the universe on it's terms, from one moment to the next moment, I might accept my brother, his family, his nation, his country, his way of life.

Free will, is the freedom to choose how I might live life and what I might believe or not believe, uninhibited by coercive persuasion, two fundamentally vital precepts of liberation.
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby rachMiel » Fri May 22, 2015 6:07 pm

DavidB wrote:In my experience, the so called spiritual are often the most deluded, drunk with their ideas of enlightened transcendence, not content to be ordinary as a relatively uninteresting animal.

Yes, the "spiritual" quest is often an aversion from what-is and concomitant grasping towards an imagined what-might-be.

And that's understandable. If your what-is is causing you to suffer (to some extent, perhaps quite subtly), of course you'd be motivated to grasp towards what-might-be.

There are some who look beyond what-is out of pure(ish) curiosity, the joy of agenda-less learning and expansion. But, most of time, I'd reckon that looking beyond = looking for something better. And therein lies the rub ... ja?
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...
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Re: The Ego Is My Friend

Postby DavidB » Sat May 23, 2015 4:22 am

There are some who look beyond what-is out of pure(ish) curiosity, the joy of agenda-less learning and expansion. But, most of time, I'd reckon that looking beyond = looking for something better. And therein lies the rub ... ja?



Yeah true. There is nothing wrong with doing more, learning more, being more, having more or adding to oneself, or anything we might be engaged in in this human form. They are to be enjoyed of course but they certainly won't make me happier or more whole.

I prefer to sit in a warm lounge chair sipping a hot cup of tea rather than sitting outside in the cold freezing to death. I'm motivated to achieve the first rather than the later. Nothing inherently wrong with either scenario except that one might be perceived as being desirable and the other undesirable. Both scenarios are simply scenarios though, life situations. While I prefer one over the other, I accept both as perfectly valid scenarios, potential life situations. If I can change that situation, then I change it, if I have no choice, then I accept it. The drama begins when there is a personal self in a situation and a me or an I emerges wanting to be warm and comfortable, or spiritually enlightened, or whatever it may be. Escaping ones life situation then becomes a personal task, a transcending ones self so speak, the cause of ones perceived misery. This is why I always recommend abandoning the spiritual path, as that path simply personifies the same pattern of victim hood as before but much more covertly. It's a further identification, further formalization of self, but now achieving spiritual transformation. The Ego has come in through the back door, and loves it.
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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