Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Post links to sites, web pages, videos, etc.
Forum rules
No links to copyrighted materials.

Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby runstrails » Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:35 am

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/ ... -neutrinos

So now it appears that these particles called Neutrino's may be able to travel faster than light. Yet again, turning scientific notions about how our universe operates on their heads! :D
runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2123
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby unbornawakened » Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:18 am

Fascinating ! Thank you for the informative post.
unbornawakened
 
Posts: 338
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:09 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby Ziendus » Fri Sep 23, 2011 11:31 am

Zenx, ya Old Runner of Trails !

No causality....
---ooOoo---
User avatar
Ziendus
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sun Nov 28, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby arel » Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:17 pm

This is funny if you look at it from a certain perspective. These article just seems silly. They are looking everywhere except where it's at. What is all this science. Just observation of human perception. Never mentioned. Nothing else. How limited. Of course shit changes as you observe and measure it with a perspective that has never been looked through before. You find it because you are looking. "We are waiting for others to confirm it" haha Silly. I thought as they dig deeper they will come to a point where they will stop and look at the observer. But it's not any kind of certain result that will do that I think now. It's going to be the inconsistency of anything. Newtonian physics, Einsteins, Quantum, all contradicting and shattering each other. Different perspectives that the same thing plays with. That inconsistency will be it. Unified theory is the the unified field for all the observations and is not a theory at all but an obvious reality that is not changing and just seeing the inconsistent always changing perspective. I think at some point we will all stop turn and look at each through our big geeky glasses scratching our heads and... laugh. haha That will be the end of that. :)
What I say is only my viewpoint.
arel
 
Posts: 581
Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby ashley72 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 11:42 pm

Thanks for the link.

This story made me reflect on physicist David Bohm's caution to the prevailing view among main stream physicists.

..... "the world is assumed to be constituted of a set of separately existent, indivisible and unchangeable 'elementary particles', which are the fundamental 'building blocks' of the entire universe … there seems to be an unshakable faith among physicists that either such particles, or some other kind yet to be discovered, will eventually make possible a complete and coherent explanation of everything" (Bohm 1980, p. 173).
User avatar
ashley72
 
Posts: 2533
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 3:24 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby Natalie » Wed Sep 28, 2011 12:20 am

Trails,

The attached article is related to what you posted here. Half of it goes over my head, but I know you and others here will probably enjoy it.

If the experiment's results are accurate and they overthrow the distinction between cause and effect, what does this really mean?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/victor-st ... _ref=false

Natalie
User avatar
Natalie
 
Posts: 559
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 9:44 am
Location: Florida, USA

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby Ziendus » Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:26 am

Nat:
> will probably enjoy it.

Si !
---ooOoo---
User avatar
Ziendus
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sun Nov 28, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby snowheight » Sat Oct 22, 2011 7:40 pm

Material traveling faster than the speed of light would play havoc with causality but even if the experiment is proven wrong the concept of locality, which is related to causality, has already been exploded by a guy named Bell many decades ago. Locality means simply that in order for something or someone separated from me at a distance to apply a force to me physically (and thereby allow communication with me) the delivery of that force has to travel the intervening distance.

When the fact of quantum entanglement was proven by experiment, physicists were quick to point out that faster-than-light signals were still precluded by the balancing factor that the measured result from dis-entanglement is random, unpredictable. When I read this, I was puzzled ... what about modulation of the process itself?

I've been vaguely aware of the efforts of some that seemingly challenge this notion of the preclusion of entanglement to form the basis of instantaneous communication.

I've got to tip my shamrock hat to Ash for having posted links to theories in other threads that are either likely to supplant or serve as the forerunners for what will eventually supplant Quantum Mechanics as they not only allow non-locality but actually banish locality as an assumption -- that is a rather profound point to contemplate.

A great book with no math that explains the whole topic is "The God Effect" by Clegg.
Stop talking. Hear every sound as background. Look straight ahead and focus. Take one deep breath. This is you. This is Now.
snowheight
 
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:56 pm

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby ashley72 » Sun Oct 23, 2011 12:21 pm

Bill,

Thanks for sharing. Sounds like a book I should add to my reading list. :D

A couple of quotes I found on the subject...

Bohm believed the reason subatomic particles are able to remain in contact with one another regardless of the distance separating them (quantum entanglement) is not because they are sending some sort of mysterious signal back and forth, but because their separateness is an illusion. Bohm suggested that at some deeper level of reality such particles are not individual entities, but are actually extensions of the same fundamental something!

We are beginning to see the entire universe as a holographically interlinked network of energy and information, organically whole. As Einstein said, "Raffiniert ist der Herrgott, aber boshaft ist er nicht!" or "The Lord is subtle, but he is not malicious!" And as the mystic Rumi wrote around 800 years ago, "If you could get rid of yourself just once, the secret of secrets would open to you. The face of the unknown, hidden beyond the universe would appear on the mirror of your perception!"

A new website reference - Quantrek - A bunch of scientists pushing the wholistic view. Group includes astronaut Edgar Mitchell six man to walk on the moon.

http://www.quantrek.com/quantum_hologram/quantum_hologram.htm
User avatar
ashley72
 
Posts: 2533
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 3:24 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby runstrails » Fri Nov 18, 2011 4:38 pm

So it looks like it might actually be true--that neutrino's can go faster than light! Scientists have repeated the experiment with the similar results as before.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-15791236

This is really groundbreaking stuff, if true. It has tremendous implications for our notions of cause and effect--because if you go faster than light then technically you may be going backwards in time! Another explanation being put forward is that the neutrino's simply go through a fifth dimension which was not accounted for previously. Would love to hear your thoughts.
runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2123
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby goldieflower » Fri Nov 18, 2011 4:47 pm

runstrails wrote:So it looks like it might actually be true--



Time to order a delorean?
goldieflower
 
Posts: 304
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2010 9:09 pm

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby runstrails » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:34 pm

:lol:
runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2123
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby randomguy » Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:58 pm

Another explanation being put forward is that the neutrino's simply go through a fifth dimension which was not accounted for previously. Would love to hear your thoughts.

I do some of my best thinking in the 5th dimension, alas there is no adequate translation to the 3rd.
I think the discoveries will continue provided we have the resources to continue the discoveries.
Do the yellow-rose petals
tremble and fall
at the rapid's roar?
- Basho
randomguy
 
Posts: 923
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 1:00 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby magicbutterfly » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:52 am

I know a physicist who can prove mathematically that there are 9 dimensions. Don't ask me how though. :shock:
"As soon as you honor the present moment, all unhappiness and struggle dissolve, and life begins to flow with joy and ease." Ekhart Tolle, The Power of Now
magicbutterfly
 
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:32 am

Re: Space/time-- Speed of light and Neutrino's!

Postby snowheight » Sat Nov 19, 2011 8:31 am

Contemplating this brings to mind ET's distinction between "clock time" and "psychological time", because if one time can communicate with another, even as Einstein's speed limit is called into question, his vision of all time actually existing is reinforced.
Stop talking. Hear every sound as background. Look straight ahead and focus. Take one deep breath. This is you. This is Now.
snowheight
 
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:56 pm

Next

Return to Recommended Links

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest