How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

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Cielo_Azul
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How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by Cielo_Azul » Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:14 am

How do we reconcile awakening and human life in the physical world? Moreover, how do we utilize awakening to improve our human experience in the physical world? Of course by using the word "reconcile" I am implying conflict of interest, but I believe this is justifiable. How can a person be both conscious and take part in life? I think being invested in life - relationships, career, hobbies, interests, accomplishments - may help evolve consciousness. And on the other hand, being more conscious will allow us to experience these things more deeply, and to see through egoic reactions and thoughts while doing so. What would you say about this? My primary reason for asking is that so far I have found it incredibly difficult to experience moments of presence anywhere except alone, in my room and doing nothing. Thanks.

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Webwanderer
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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by Webwanderer » Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:35 am

Cielo_Azul wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:14 am
How do we reconcile awakening and human life in the physical world?
Consider, you were awake before you came to this world. At least more than you are at the moment. If you take that as a truth then you must know that you knew you were going into a relative dream state that is the human experience. If that is indeed true, then there was a higher purpose in the decision to do so than just struggling through this life, at least known by some element of your higher nature.

All that being said, then there is more to being human than simply awakening from it. So what ever you do in your daily life, look at as an exploration in service to a higher purpose of your being in that there is something to gain from it even though you may not readily recognize what it is.

Moreover, how do we utilize awakening to improve our human experience in the physical world?
As we face the challenges of life, and we experience the frequent pain of poor decisions and perspectives, we will find, if we will look to our true inner nature, that peace and joy will come from that inner guidance and greatly improve our decision making and perspectives on life. That is a key element in awakening. Therefore it is through this awakening process that we improve our life experience in this physical world.

Of course this world is only temporary, but the experience gained while here in the choices we make and the perspectives we developed is forever. So engage the stuff of this physical life. It is the grist for the mill of conscious evolution and being.

Cielo_Azul wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:14 am
What would you say about this? My primary reason for asking is that so far I have found it incredibly difficult to experience moments of presence anywhere except alone, in my room and doing nothing. Thanks.
If that is the only time you can experience presence then that is far better than not at all. With time and patience and practice, you may find moments during the day when you can step away and reconnect with presence. Look for them. They are there. Make a practice of looking for opportunities during the day where you have a couple of minutes alone to take a deep breath and reconnect with the clear presence that have already found. Remember, part of the exploration is to get a little lost in the adventure. It is the work you came to do.

WW

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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by Cielo_Azul » Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:16 am

Thanks for your response, I have enjoyed reading your replies and have reflected on what you've said.
Webwanderer wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:35 am
All that being said, then there is more to being human than simply awakening from it. So what ever you do in your daily life, look at as an exploration in service to a higher purpose of your being in that there is something to gain from it even though you may not readily recognize what it is.
I have some trouble with this. I am very caught up in ideas of meaning and importance. Partly this is a fear of feeling insignificant and ignored due to past trauma (bullying and exclusion), something that gets relieved slightly if I imagine it had a purpose. I am aware this thinking is egoic and not focused in the now and reality of life.
If what we are fundamentally is pure awareness/consciousness, I don't know how I can be mindful of this in my waking life, despite those brief moments I have experienced during meditation (which were wonderful). I find it hard to appreciate and engage with form without being or becoming attached to it.
There is this idea that our human experience, regardless of its content, is contributing to the evolution of consciousness. I can get behind this idea - I think that intelligence is fundamental, and is the foundation for what we perceive as the physical world. But if the Source, that is the pure conscious awareness, is already whole and complete, how can it evolve? Or am I as an expression of it supposed to evolve, and "return home" as it were? If so, I can't reconcile that with there being more to human life than awakening from it, which I find troubling.

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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by Webwanderer » Thu Oct 22, 2020 3:53 am

Cielo_Azul wrote: But if the Source, that is the pure conscious awareness, is already whole and complete, how can it evolve? Or am I as an expression of it supposed to evolve, and "return home" as it were? If so, I can't reconcile that with there being more to human life than awakening from it, which I find troubling.
I'm not so much offering answers here as I am offering some things to consider. For me, reconciliation came through the consideration of 'infinite'. If Consciousness, Source, is infinite, then it is without end. It is eternal and is limitless in potential. Evolution of consciousness and being is the growth into this infinite potential experience yet to be manifest. So while our Source Being is whole it may not be accurate to see it as complete. Who can say? That's way above my pay grade in this human expression. But it makes the most sense to me at present.

Consider, in this universe alone, by the most recent estimate, there are upwards of two trillion galaxies, containing hundreds of billions of stars each. And there is speculation that there may well be as many universes as yet unseen. That's a lot of ground to cover. And that's just physical universes. Non physical numbers could be just as vast. Head spinning yet?

As far as evolving here and returning home, I would suggest that our lives here are an element of evolution (and not an insignificant one). Like so many things in the natural world of physics and quantum theory, there is an element of 'as above so below'. Electrons and protons spin around a nucleus. Planets spin around a star. Solar systems spin around a central galactic core. Galactic clusters spin around in groups and who knows how high that goes.

As an expression of an infinite consciousness, holographic in nature, you have the same infinite consciousness potential withing you, as you. Remember time/space is a physical construct. Beyond this context of existence it does not have the same relevance. Many of our traditions say we have lived countless lives on many worlds. Much like the many dreams you have lived while in this world, they are all of the same originating consciousness and fundamentally all you. Not the you that frets over the temporary stuff of being human, but the you that asks the questions that you ask in the depths of your awareness and express on this forum.

It is wisely said that the questions we ask are more valuable than the answers we get. One is expansive, the other is a plateau. Both have their place.

WW

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turiya
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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by turiya » Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:56 am

Cielo_Azul wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:16 am
Or am I as an expression of it supposed to evolve, and "return home" as it were? If so, I can't reconcile that with there being more to human life than awakening from it, which I find troubling.
It may help to look at it this way: we don't awaken from our human lives, we awaken to them. That is, we stop thinking that this life is something it's not (which inevitably creates suffering), and we start seeing it for what it really is (which inevitably opens our eyes to deep peace and joy).

A deeply enjoyable Alan Watts video (imo):

"What Is It To See?"

https://youtu.be/hCOJnIysQ1A
:D
“We ourselves are not an illusory part of Reality; rather are we Reality itself illusorily conceived.” - Wei Wu Wei

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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by Cielo_Azul » Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:31 am

Webwanderer wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 3:53 am
I'm not so much offering answers here as I am offering some things to consider. For me, reconciliation came through the consideration of 'infinite'. If Consciousness, Source, is infinite, then it is without end. It is eternal and is limitless in potential. Evolution of consciousness and being is the growth into this infinite potential experience yet to be manifest. So while our Source Being is whole it may not be accurate to see it as complete. Who can say? That's way above my pay grade in this human expression. But it makes the most sense to me at present.

Consider, in this universe alone, by the most recent estimate, there are upwards of two trillion galaxies, containing hundreds of billions of stars each. And there is speculation that there may well be as many universes as yet unseen. That's a lot of ground to cover. And that's just physical universes. Non physical numbers could be just as vast. Head spinning yet?

As far as evolving here and returning home, I would suggest that our lives here are an element of evolution (and not an insignificant one). Like so many things in the natural world of physics and quantum theory, there is an element of 'as above so below'. Electrons and protons spin around a nucleus. Planets spin around a star. Solar systems spin around a central galactic core. Galactic clusters spin around in groups and who knows how high that goes.
This is a very interesting perspective and something to consider. I suppose that I am simply seeking some form of "reassurance" that human life is not insignificant or aimless, and this is an ingrained thinking pattern in me, based on fear and discomfort. But perhaps prescribing any ultimate meaning would put a limit on this infinite thing that "is".
turiya wrote:
Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:56 am
It may help to look at it this way: we don't awaken from our human lives, we awaken to them. That is, we stop thinking that this life is something it's not (which inevitably creates suffering), and we start seeing it for what it really is (which inevitably opens our eyes to deep peace and joy).

A deeply enjoyable Alan Watts video (imo):

"What Is It To See?"

https://youtu.be/hCOJnIysQ1A
:D
Thanks turiya, I do enjoy Alan Watts. I think he was the first person to introduce me to the possibility of a different way of thinking.
When you say we awaken "to" our lives, do you mean when we begin to see the true nature of everything, largely free of projected thoughts and ideas?

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Re: How do we reconcile inner and outer purpose?

Post by turiya » Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:48 pm

Cielo_Azul wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:31 am
When you say we awaken "to" our lives, do you mean when we begin to see the true nature of everything, largely free of projected thoughts and ideas?
Yes, exactly. :D
“We ourselves are not an illusory part of Reality; rather are we Reality itself illusorily conceived.” - Wei Wu Wei

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