Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

This is the place to post whatever questions you have related to the teachings of Eckhart Tolle. The rest of us will do whatever we can to help you achieve a better understanding :)
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dannydawiz
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dannydawiz » Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:23 pm

Maire wrote:Dannydawiz, if you don't mind me saying, your ego is leading you down the garden path and won't be bringing you to that Meadow anytime soon. Sorry but the more I read, the more I empathize with your uncle.

Do you want spirituality or religion soup? If you're not keen on Christians why do you keep quoting the bible? It always amazes me how the bible is used to back up just about anything from racism to wife-battering. Everyone is so fond of quoting the bible aren't they, whether they believe in it or not. Having said that, Sandyjoy, your post really spoke to me, I have reread it a few times. Your bible quotes are in a helpful spiritual context and not bandied about for no good reason.

Danny, this advice is good

Sandyjoy said
If you want a sense of balance and stability in your life, then I suggest you look for the Child within you. You can return to this Place, the Meadow right here in the midst of this 'rough edged world'. listen and search your Heart, the Child stirs to tell us It lives.
Danny, what you are doing is not spiritual awakening but intellectual gymnastics. Your mind is leading you around in circles. Wrong, right, objective, subjective, absolute. They're all words and judgements.
If someone stabbed me in the heart I would die. This is an ABSOLUTE TRUTH.
No, it isn't. This shows, then, that you are missing the whole point. What about eternal life? What about the infinite Being and oneness of the universe? Why is that all gone out the window when someone stabs you?
Do you not see the cognitive dissonance displayed in my words?
Well, yes.

If you are interested in an intellectual exploration of life and death, good versus evil, I recommend "The Book of Secrets" by Deepak Chopra.

I'd like to leave you with a quote from an important saint

"And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree
there will be an answer" - John


......... Paul, George and Ringo
I may not be keen on Christians Maire but I speak of the bible because I feel that it is a very important book to have read in this century.
I have noticed that ever since that easter conversation with my uncle my mind has been incredibly noisy lately.

Maire before all of this I believed the same thing. I believed that labels don't exist. Words like ugly, good, bad, slow, fast were all simply mental interpretations. I would look at an apple and be pleased to know that it wasn't really an apple. The apple was just the word that we decided to name it. It didn't exist because it was only a judgement.

I TRULY believed this and as a result I discovered who I was. If someone called me stupid then that wouldn't matter because that was simply a judgement that didn't exist. I could not being anything other than what I was. I am who I am.

I think that part of what is causing my cognitive dissonance has nothing to do with christianity.
I think the cause has to do with this. I am starting to believe that judgements and labels are real.

Even though that apple isn't REALLY an apple the word points to something that is definitely real. Even if the world ugly is subjective in meaning the word points to something that is definitely real. Even if the word nasty is just a label it points to an experience that is REAL.

Once THIS thought came into my head everything began to fall apart. All of a sudden "I am who I am" became a lot harder for me to believe. I have lived for 16 years does that not make me 16 years old? My parents are both Mexican does that not make me Mexican? Even if words are subjective they point to things that are objectively real. I am 16 years old and I am Mexican. Those both point to things that describe who I am.

As far as eternal life goes I cannot deny that life is eternal. Matter cannot be created and neither can it be destroyed. I will continue to live on regardless if I am stabbed or not just not in the same form as I am in now.

I was only using the stabbing in the heart as an example. If someone shoots me in the head based off of the system of language our society has developed I would DIE. Maybe not in an eternal sense but the word DIE points to an experience that is absolutely real.

I will read the book of secrets and truly hope that I find something that will help me.

Thank you Maire.

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treasuretheday
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by treasuretheday » Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:48 pm

Wow, Danny, I forgot that you were 16! Wow, you are one smart fella. And no wonder there is some confusion. You are 16! Give yourself some time, and pat yourself on the back now for all your curiosity and interest.

Btw...why aren't you in school? Have you done your homework? :)
Life itself is the proper binge.
-Julia Child

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dannydawiz
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dannydawiz » Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:09 pm

treasuretheday wrote:Wow, Danny, I forgot that you were 16! Wow, you are one smart fella. And no wonder there is some confusion. You are 16! Give yourself some time, and pat yourself on the back now for all your curiosity and interest.

Btw...why aren't you in school? Have you done your homework? :)
Yes treasure sadly these questions came to me from a young age. I am being homeschooled for this last semester and then I am going back next year which Is why I am not in school right now.

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dijmart
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dijmart » Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:10 pm

dannydawiz wrote:I'm not concerned with relative truth... What I want to understand is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH.
I had originally thought that when you can be present without any mental interpretation that THIS was absolute truth.

I'm so confused... I have no right or wrong to define my actions and I feel that everything I've learned in the past half a year is suddenly falling apart...
When looking from the absolute perspective there is no right or wrong, the whole world is Maya or illusion. However, have you heard the saying: The world is illusion, Brahman (or God) alone is real, the world IS Brahman. So, to look only from the absolute view is not the full picture, as well as looking from the relative view only is not the full picture.

dannydawiz said-
I think that part of what is causing my cognitive dissonance has nothing to do with christianity.
I think the cause has to do with this. I am starting to believe that judgements and labels are real.
Now you're perspective is from the relative view. People/humans do judge and are judged, label and define, on and on... That is part of the world we live in, having this body/mind, which is only relatively real.

So, the question now is, how do you live in the world, but not be of the world?
Take what you like and leave the rest.

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dannydawiz
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dannydawiz » Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:13 pm

dijmart wrote:

When looking from the absolute perspective there is no right or wrong, the whole world is Maya or illusion. However, have you heard the saying: The world is illusion, Brahman (or God) alone is real, the world IS Brahman. So, to look only from the absolute view is not the full picture, as well as looking from the relative view only is not the full picture.

dannydawiz said-
I think that part of what is causing my cognitive dissonance has nothing to do with christianity.
I think the cause has to do with this. I am starting to believe that judgements and labels are real.
Now you're perspective is from the relative view. People/humans do judge and are judged, label and define, on and on... That is part of the world we live in, having this body/mind, which is only relatively real.

So, the question now is, how do you live in the world, but not be of the world?
If you could answer that question in a way that makes sense I will drop everything that I am doing and believe in you.

In a sense you could say that I am back in the human world. A world that is filled with right and wrong, Labeling and defining the people we hang out with and the objects that we buy with money. Girls will compare themselves to other girls and derive their sense of self worth based off of how they look in comparison while boys will look at other boys and derive their self worth based off of how much more income they makes. If you don't have anything then you will be considered to be inferior to those around you while if you do have everything then you will be considered superior.

This isn't the world that I want to live in. I want to go back to that other world in which judgements, labels, and self images do not exist. I was there at one point but now I am back in the other. Not by choice but my inability to make sense of that other perspective right now.

I can only believe in things that make sense to me otherwise I am simply fooling myself.

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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by Maire » Sat Apr 26, 2014 1:19 am

I was only using the stabbing in the heart as an example. If someone shoots me in the head based off of the system of language our society has developed I would DIE. Maybe not in an eternal sense but the word DIE points to an experience that is absolutely real.
I knew this but basically I was just using your very own words to call you out on the idea of absolute truth. Every religion and ideology including atheism, materialism and science have their own version of the truth. Most people feel happier if they have a religion they can be attached to because, yes, it is a part of their identity and it makes them feel more secure. Religions give you a clear set of rules. It makes life easier. I don't think this is completely wrong because many people are not at the level of spiritual depth to move away from their rules. In a way, this is what the writings of Eckhart Tolle are all about - part of his spiritual purpose is to pave a way to enlightenment for the ordinary person through the portal of the present moment.

You have to live in the real world, whether it is real or not. You open your eyes and you find yourself here. That is your reality. You don't need to have all the answers to be spiritual. Eckharts "park bench" can work as a symbol of bringing spirituality to the most ordinary, everyday experience. Yesterday, I happened to be in a park for a walk and arriving at a bench, decided to give it a go. It was not a very busy day at the park because it was a little cloudy but there were a few joggers and dog-walkers. It is just to stay present and at peace as you sit and watch and listen, taking in sights and sounds without doing anything else. No particular mental commentary but if a thought comes, let it. Try it. A park will have sounds of birds chirping, the smell of grass and flowers, maybe a breeze on your face and also probably sounds of the city, I could hear the traffic on the road, kids playing. It is such a lovely sampler of everything that is. Perfect.
I have lived with several zen masters - all of them cats. - Eckhart Tolle

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dannydawiz
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dannydawiz » Sat Apr 26, 2014 1:50 am

Maire wrote:
I was only using the stabbing in the heart as an example. If someone shoots me in the head based off of the system of language our society has developed I would DIE. Maybe not in an eternal sense but the word DIE points to an experience that is absolutely real.
I knew this but basically I was just using your very own words to call you out on the idea of absolute truth. Every religion and ideology including atheism, materialism and science have their own version of the truth. Most people feel happier if they have a religion they can be attached to because, yes, it is a part of their identity and it makes them feel more secure. Religions give you a clear set of rules. It makes life easier. I don't think this is completely wrong because many people are not at the level of spiritual depth to move away from their rules. In a way, this is what the writings of Eckhart Tolle are all about - part of his spiritual purpose is to pave a way to enlightenment for the ordinary person through the portal of the present moment.

You have to live in the real world, whether it is real or not. You open your eyes and you find yourself here. That is your reality. You don't need to have all the answers to be spiritual. Eckharts "park bench" can work as a symbol of bringing spirituality to the most ordinary, everyday experience. Yesterday, I happened to be in a park for a walk and arriving at a bench, decided to give it a go. It was not a very busy day at the park because it was a little cloudy but there were a few joggers and dog-walkers. It is just to stay present and at peace as you sit and watch and listen, taking in sights and sounds without doing anything else. No particular mental commentary but if a thought comes, let it. Try it. A park will have sounds of birds chirping, the smell of grass and flowers, maybe a breeze on your face and also probably sounds of the city, I could hear the traffic on the road, kids playing. It is such a lovely sampler of everything that is. Perfect.
I agree that being present is a very wonderful experience. To forget the past and to forget the future. Regardless of what your religion is, being present almost always brings peace.

The problem comes when the present moment becomes filled with conflict. Some people would actually prefer to live in the past or go back to the way things used to be.

What does all of this have to do with absolute truth though? In what I consider to be reality you could say that the past and the future don't have an objective existence. We can never exist in any moment but the now.

I am aware of subjective morality. The fact that every religion contains a set of morals that are considered to be generally absolute. I cannot agree with neither of them...

Here's an example of absolute morality.

1+1 = 2. It will always equal 2. That is an absolute right.

Here's an example of relative morality.

Lying = sometimes right & sometimes wrong.

Lying to the nazis to hide the Jews vs lying to the Jews to lure them into concentration camps.

This is why I cannot understand right and wrong on an absolute level... It all comes down to how do we define right and how do we define wrong?

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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by smiileyjen101 » Sat Apr 26, 2014 2:21 am

I'm only mentioning christianity because my uncle says that there is an overwhelming amount of evidence to support that it exists.

He even went as far as to say that if I could find one thing that doesn't make sense about the bible then he would completely drop his religion.
In Kantian ethics it deems that if one is to hold a position as if 'absolute' eg: Thou shalt not kill. Then there are no exceptions to it. It is universally able to be applied. If one breaks this Categorical Imperative (a 'command') then one is instead following the moral code that it is okay to kill, by individual, not universal perspectives. Therefore 'cases' can be made by anyone with conviction that the ends justify the means that it's okay to kill.

So imho, on one hand having Thou shalt not kill as a core commandment, and in other places in the bible exhorting that people should be killed by and to support Christian beliefs, a Christian breaks the Kantian 'Categorical Imperative' of a core command - Thou shalt not kill.

Further in the bible it dictates the 'sin' of being hypocritical, and yet itself is hypocritical by this example. Even more so when 'God' is used in order to support the individual perspective.

If there is a 'god' as in a personified deity (which I don't believe) what on Earth must they be thinking when two armies face up to each other, each praying to 'god' to bring them success (as in let them kill the most number of their 'enemies').

Morality is merely the societal agreements by which we give authorities power to punish for actions deemed inappropriate.

Rape is not a crime in the animal other than human world, there are only the natural unfolding consequences of that action.
Pack rape can and does occur within species when there is competition to seed the next generation.

In the same manner then - if rape is not considered a crime, then being raped is just a part of the natural existence, it is not an offence, or offensive to be raped, it is just rape as a natural act within a species. If one followed this the natural consequence would be that there are no 'perpetrators of a crime/offence, and therefore no victims of a crime/offence.

Now I'm not saying I agree with rape (it's as upsetting to watch in the animal kingdom as I imagine it would be in the human one, particularly where violence is involved).

I'm saying that humanity has decided that there is an 'offence' being committed that is offensive for human kind (thinking that we are more than 'animals').

That, as with many things, that permission and agreement must be sought from individuals as to the use of their bodies. That violence, coercion, deception etc are 'wrong'. And yet, this too does not fulfil the Kantian absolute moral 'Categorical Imperative' when society deems other acts are permissible to commit by violence, coercion, deception etc upon another without their consent.

Or indeed in the pro-life stance of some sections of society that dictate by law or by moral code how one person can and 'should' use their own bodies. Or further in the bible where it states that a woman must/should submit her body to her husband for his use, and that her body can be traded within his family on his death etc.

On the other hand free flowing consensual sexual activity (particularly for females) is frowned upon or in some cases a 'sin' punishable by moral codes, even by death (more insanity/hypocrisy).

In terms of lying - if one believes it is 'wrong' to lie, then one will assume everyone tells the truth in all circumstances. Kant's view was that if lying is wrong is a dictum, then there are no circumstances in which it is 'right' to lie. Therefore if you were hiding a person from someone who is seeking to harm them, if that seeker comes to your door and asks if they are there, one must tell the truth. If one believes it is okay to lie in some circumstances then one must assume that others also lie for their own ends/beliefs. Therefore the seeker would be quite sane to assume one is lying if they say they are not hiding the person in danger if they have reason to believe that one is hiding that person, and will factor this into their actions in order to achieve their goals.

So in all of this there are very few 'universal truths' in any moralities, there are societally adopted agreements that even if in place they are acknowledging that they (the actions) are a part of our society and therefore will be broken, they are likely to be broken, and rather than natural consequences unfolding as in the other than human species in nature, there will be imposed 'punishments' or 'penalties' applied in societally imposed consequence.

These dictums are more about trying to 'control' imposed (personal preference) order than creating or accommodating natural order, which is in fact quite chaotic.

There are more professional/experience born opinions/dictums than there are universal truths, and there are even more personal perspectives based on imagining 'offence' rather than experiencing an experience.
Girls will compare themselves to other girls and derive their sense of self worth based off of how they look in comparison while boys will look at other boys and derive their self worth based off of how much more income they makes. If you don't have anything then you will be considered to be inferior to those around you while if you do have everything then you will be considered superior.
Your statements above are your personal perspective, believed to be real and absolute.
I'm female, and I do not compare or derive my sense of self based on how I look compared to other females.

If there is one 'exception to the rule' then the 'rule' - the perspective, is flawed.
If the map doesn't agree with the ground, the map is wrong.

Gordon Livingston MD (From 'Too soon old, too late smart')
What other people think/say of you says more about them than it does about you - it describes their 'perspective'.
What you think/say of others says more about you, than it does about them - it describes your 'perspective'.
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

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dijmart
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dijmart » Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:03 am

dijmart wrote: So, the question now is, how do you live in the world, but not be of the world?
What I'm saying is, this is the question, not that I have the answer to give you and if/when I have the answer for myself, it doesn't mean it's the answer for you. The great sages did this, they lived IN the world, but no longer were OF the world. If they could do it, then so can you, so can anyone.
Take what you like and leave the rest.

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dannydawiz
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by dannydawiz » Sat Apr 26, 2014 4:01 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:
I'm only mentioning christianity because my uncle says that there is an overwhelming amount of evidence to support that it exists.

He even went as far as to say that if I could find one thing that doesn't make sense about the bible then he would completely drop his religion.
In Kantian ethics it deems that if one is to hold a position as if 'absolute' eg: Thou shalt not kill. Then there are no exceptions to it. It is universally able to be applied. If one breaks this Categorical Imperative (a 'command') then one is instead following the moral code that it is okay to kill, by individual, not universal perspectives. Therefore 'cases' can be made by anyone with conviction that the ends justify the means that it's okay to kill.

So imho, on one hand having Thou shalt not kill as a core commandment, and in other places in the bible exhorting that people should be killed by and to support Christian beliefs, a Christian breaks the Kantian 'Categorical Imperative' of a core command - Thou shalt not kill.

Further in the bible it dictates the 'sin' of being hypocritical, and yet itself is hypocritical by this example. Even more so when 'God' is used in order to support the individual perspective.
This is the exact same thing I was thinking. To say "thou shalt not kill" and let death be the penalty. This is one of the reasons why christianity at times to me just doesn't make sense. God to me according to their religion sounds like a hypocrite. He says to not kill and then he kills. The death penalty according to christianity IS considered to be moralistically ok.

Thank you Jen. I really love your definition of absolute. If one is to hold a position as absolute then there may not be any exceptions. It MUST be universally applied.

In regards to my later statements about superiority and inferiority I apologize. I did not mean to imply that what I said was absolute. I'm merely speaking from the perspective of a female friend of mine who had told me this. Nothing that I said was meant to be considered absolute.

What do you think I should do Jen?

What are some of those universal truths you were speaking about?

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smiileyjen101
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by smiileyjen101 » Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:34 am

In regards to my later statements about superiority and inferiority I apologize.
No need to apologize, Danny I was not taking offence, and neither did you commit any.

I was pointing to how perspectives become believed to be true. (be it in religion or cultural norms - anywhere where personal perspective is elevated to 'truth' and held onto, defended, used as a basis for other choices.)
What do you think I should do Jen?
I would not presume to choose, or answer for you, and neither do you need me to. For me, all life is, is a unique opportunity to experience - foo - whatever.

The greatest respect and regard I can offer is to tell you that I do not worry about you, I believe in you. If you can hold the same regard for your self (and others) the path will flow seamlessly wherever it will. Things will arise that poke at you (as you may have already noticed) and you'll ask the questions, then experience elements of them, and on it goes.
What are some of those universal truths you were speaking about?
Now that is a great question, answering it may take you a lifetime of experiences :wink:

I am happy to share my hindsight that you may pick upon to use as your foresight, discard anything that holds no interest.

In studying philosophies and ethics fields, and in asking that question experientially myself I've found very very few universal truths withstand the criteria, and even some of them that I've adopted, I'm not sure if they are just so within my own awareness, capacity and willingness to consider. Many that are considered to be universal either do not apply to all individuals, or to other species, or elements of the physical world.

So I'd suggest, don't assume that people don't lie, or kill, or rape, or steal or blaspheme or honour their father and mother, or any of the 10 commandments, legislations and philosophical doctrines, whether you do or not, if you do assume you are bound to be disappointed at some point. At the same time, don't assume that they do, be open to possibility either way.

Some even dispute that we are physically born, and therefore physically the body dies, but in my experience this seems to be a universal truth, all things that are born into physicality die to physicality and change in material form. From the moment we are born we are moving towards the demise of our bodies.

So in that I might suggest that all things are impermanent (in physical nature) is a universal truth. It's relative only within the comprehension of time, which is not universally real, it's a bit like a mathematical formula, it's just a means through which to understand and relate shared experience.

If this truth that all things are impermanent is met with gratitude and generosity, rather than fear then the preciousness of the fleetingness of it means all living things, and all physical experiences are sacred and precious and met with gratitude & generosity. On the other hand if it is met with fear then it will be considered as less than satisfactory.

Being in the world, but not of the world, means that we can embrace this ever changing relative 'reality' - a cyclone or tornado is just energy forming into 'wind', spinning until it stops spinning. A tsunami is just energy building in an ocean and flowing until it ebbs. A relationship is just a meeting of individuals for a shared time and possibly purpose, even if the purpose and the time of it is unknown. Emotions are arising responses to interpreted stimuli. A crisis is just an upset where our reality differs from our expectations and we respond to bring the two back into harmony. An insult is just an interpretation of an action, and an offence an interpretation of an action different to how we think we would respond.

This too will pass, is for me, a universal truth.

Another is an adopted one, that absolutely could be 'just me', just my awareness in my experience, but it appears to me that love (as in the energy of gratitude & generosity flowing in equilibrium) always, always creates a different experience than the energies of fear and separation. That love opens & unites and fear closes and separates the life force energies that every living thing shares in common.

That compassion (awareness that we are more alike than different, more one that separate) rides freely and confidently on the energies of love, and prejudices ride freely and confidently on the energies of fear, also seems to be universally true.

I just have not, and have tested many times, found an example where this is not universally true. Learning to overcome fear, not to eliminate it, or to avoid it or deny it, but to embrace it and love it as well, and allow love to flow does seem to mean facing and illuminating the false truths and recognising hypocrisy, in our selves and in others. Falling to fear at any part of that experience can and will create the sense of separation, give rise to prejudging things, and that's okay too, it's just a different experience.
Refer back to the previous truth.... this too will pass.

Apart from those, I am still playing with these two, haven't found any evidence to the contrary yet that universally stands up... every living thing is responding within its own awareness, capacity and willingness in any and every situation; and no choice is wrong, it just brings a different experience.
God to me according to their religion sounds like a hypocrite. He says to not kill and then he kills. The death penalty according to christianity IS considered to be moralistically ok.
This reminded me of another 'thing' but it might be a bit too theoretical - as it is above it is below, as it is within it is without.
It kind of speaks to that notion that what others think/say about you says more about themselves.

Those who wrote the bible (is this blasphemy? oh well) were writing it in accordance with their own moral principles and awareness, capacity and willingness in that time-space-situation.

It seems that the differences between the old testament and new testament writings do show a change of awareness, capacity and willingness in some areas to choose love over fear and in response to further understanding of natural and other phenomena. For instance in the old testament it's a 'sin' to combine different natural fibres, eg wool and cotton, wood and mortar - and in pure logical understanding there was probably logical wisdoms to keep them separate - the 'ply' and the strength of the different raw materials would / could create engineering and manufacturing 'problems' based on their different properties, densities and needs etc

The notion of 'sin' is sometimes benignly referred to as a realisation of a 'wrong thinking', an error of judgement or perception, expectation etc Until one realises there is an 'error' in it, there is no 'problem' with it. It's all natural and logical consequences unfolding based on our thinking and actions.

As with any doctrines the 'importance' of having this/these realisation/s might be pre-empted in fear and separation, making them 'punishable' here or in the 'hereafter'. Rather than them being a personal discovery through experience or compassion for experiences of others, (more like an aha moment in the unfolding of our awareness, capacity and willingness), which is how I tend to view 'stuff' after committing, and still committing, many, many, many infinitum 'sins' myself.

We are all perfectly imperfect and doing our best with what we have.

:wink: Gee, aren't you glad I didn't prescribe for you :wink:
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

peas
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by peas » Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:41 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:The greatest respect and regard I can offer is to tell you that I do not worry about you, I believe in you. If you can hold the same regard for your self (and others) the path will flow seamlessly wherever it will.
To do this there must be two of you - the believer and the believee.

Woop-woop: Split Personality Alert

;-)

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smiileyjen101
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by smiileyjen101 » Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:46 am

Take another look at the yin-yang symbol and what you said about it Peas.
The misconception is that yin and yang represents two differences. It doesn't. That is the literal mind at work.
No need to evacuate the building :wink:
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com

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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by SandyJoy » Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:33 pm

peas wrote:To do this there must be two of you - the believer and the believee.

Woop-woop: Split Personality Alert

You yourself, Peas, must be being a believer and a belivee --- or you would have absolutely nothing to add to her comments i.e you believe she is wrong and you believe in something called a split-personality--- Well, that is your belief and you are the one believing it.

We are all believers and belivees--- that is not a split, that is all inclusive Being being what you are.

Wholeness includes ALL. There is not just "one"---There is ALL and that is Totality and Totality is All--- "One" means that there is nothing that exists that can ever be 'outside" of this ONLY ISness. It does not eliminate diversity and nor does it mean one cannot or should not be a believer and a believeee--- how could you want to be less than all that you are.

There are even greater things and more that you can do and be.


As to the morality thing, Danny-- I think we are here to learn and when we do something something 'wrong' we know it. Most of us do. Sometimes it takes a long time to figure it out, but we do. Eventually we do. We repent, we ask for forgiveness, we change---and some of us are even transformed by grace and Light and Love--- and here in the this life time. It is quite a magical and glorious journey being here, being alive, living our Life, blooming into the fullness of Our Self.

I think if you just keep following your own heart and listen to that Inner Voice, that Knowing Self, the Guide within you, the part of you that is YOU before you got buried under all the garbage (and you are still young the garbage is not so much and you are being home schooled, wonderful, less corrupt government indoctrination and social garbage heaped on you--- You will be on your way, just as you are.

You can find that Self of you that is free and unbound and fearless. Think of who you were as a little kid; what were you like? Were you silly, and happy, and carefree, and fearless and unconcerned about 'morals' and religions -- I bet you were. I bet you were delightful, don't lose that child of your heart and soul, he is the one closest to Your Pristine and Pure Selfhood, the Self that IS Moral because IT is Unafraid and IS LOVE.

Find that Child again and you won't have to worry about others, you will just know for your self and do what is right for you. And really YOU are the only one who matters. It is all within you, alone and solitary. Like Jen says, I won't won't worry about you, you'll be fine, of course you will. And you do not have to worry about others, they are in good hands, just as you are.

Not one of us, even the worst sinner in the world, is not already alright, already perfect and whole and Home in the Light of Truth---but getting our self back to Seeing This, that is the Journey Here, some of us have "been there done that" and found out for ourselves the Living Truth--- and we know first hand and directly that Everything really is Perfection as it is. We know that in this life or the next or some day or whenever, you will find It and Live It too and you will be free and happy and whole and in Love--because in the Light of Truth This is Already so.

And we give and share because we want you to Live your Fullness without having to go through the what we had to. We want you to find It without the 40 days in the wilderness ---but even that is alright-- and even that leads to Goodness and Love, if we let it.

Life is sort of a backward unfolding into what already is -- enjoy Life, just as you are, be yourself, be true to you and Love, Love, Love-- that is my best advice.

You're doing fine --- Vienna waits for you.
You are not finished, until you play in that meadow and live there. You can, you know. But only you can take yourself there.

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treasuretheday
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Morality

Post by treasuretheday » Sat Apr 26, 2014 4:05 pm

Beautiful Sandy.

Sing it Billy!

Slow down, you're doing fine.
You can't be everything you wanna be before your time...

You know, that when the truth is told, that you can get what you want or you can just get old.
..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZdiXvDU4P0
Life itself is the proper binge.
-Julia Child

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