How do you keep in the now when negativity is always there

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Long Time Seeker
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How do you keep in the now when negativity is always there

Post by Long Time Seeker » Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:49 pm

In a lot of what I do, I am fairly positive and manage to keep fairly well in the present (I think!). But when I am tired and/or my partner is particularly negative (she suffers from depression), I quite often find myself losing that presence and "nowness" - often when I need it most to be there. I have tried detachment and meditation and yoga etc etc and all these things help, but still find that if I lose that "nowness" - even if its just once - it sets back things at home for days, sometimes weeks - not only in relationship terms, but in my own psyche. Maybe I beat myself up over it too much, but the learning curve which I am on seems to be a rocky one. Keeping calm when people around you are negative isn't easy, I think. I've heard it said you should avoid negative people - but that to me seems a cop out.

So how does anybody out there deal with situations like the above, whether its at home or work, or even out socially?

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dijmart
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by dijmart » Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:31 pm

Long Time Seeker wrote: when I am tired and/or my partner is particularly negative (she suffers from depression), I quite often find myself losing that presence and "nowness" - often when I need it most to be there.
Presence is always there, it's the mind that wanders away from it, into time. I like to call it being in/out of alignment, having/not having balance. When out of balance (in time) fear is dominate, all emotions are always available to us, but we can move past them quickly when present. So, when "present" if you have an emotion regarding something you feel it fully and don't distort it, by not distorting it and telling stories about it to yourself, is how they just go right through you, once fully acknowledged, if actions needs to be taken, then take action, but their not dwelled upon neurotically, like when you're in time.

However, If out of alignment, emotions and thoughts, become sticky and can create a biofeedback of negativity (distortion and story telling), that can make you stuck in "time" (past/future). Most depressed people are stuck in time, without knowing it. The negativity of their past becomes negativity projected into their future and on it goes. The law of attraction also plays a part in this. So, maybe ask your partner what stories she's telling herself? You can look up Byron Katie, she has a process she calls "The Work" to help people with debunking their dysfunctional story telling.

Maybe I beat myself up over it too much, but the learning curve which I am on seems to be a rocky one. Keeping calm when people around you are negative isn't easy, I think. I've heard it said you should avoid negative people - but that to me seems a cop out.

So how does anybody out there deal with situations like the above, whether its at home or work, or even out socially?
Forgiveness and non-judgement is key to not beating yourself or others up anymore. Always start with forgiving yourself and not judging yourself for "perceived" failures. Learn from whatever it is and move on, moment to moment, then you will be able to do this with others. Observe when you "over react" to people, situations and events, this can be a sign that you are out of alignment and that the conditioned mind in in the driver seat. Another words, you aren't being "present".

Others are great for presence practice, what you react to strongly in others is what is in you and until you can be accepting of yourself, you won't be accepting of them. However, you can try the opposite and accept it in them first and by default will more readily accept it in yourself.

Also, what you resist persists, so if someone desperately doesn't want to be around negative people, then guess what? They will find more negative people surrounding them then ever! So, if you say to the universe "I'm sick and tired of all these negative people!"...you're telling the universe, "you're sick", "you're tired" and "bring me negative people". If you say "I AM healthy and energetic and happy with the people around me" you start to reverse the process. Say it with belief and enthusiasm and you will start to manifest it into you're reality.
Take what you like and leave the rest.

Phil2
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Phil2 » Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:36 pm

Long Time Seeker wrote: Keeping calm when people around you are negative isn't easy, I think. I've heard it said you should avoid negative people - but that to me seems a cop out.
Well for sure it is easier to remain in presence alone than in relationship with others ... others will most of the time challenge you and expect from you some kind of behaviour or role ... you are a husband, a father, an employee etc so you 'should' do this and that ... difficult to be yourself in those conditions, you have to meet others expectations ...

So it is said "do not judge and you shall not be judged" ... it is a good start to not expect others to behave like you'd want to, in other words to learn to accept others as they are ... so they might accept you as you are ...

Also Carl Jung said : "what irritates us in others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves" ... the key lies in acceptance of 'what is' ... when you resist things as they are (because things are not as they should be) you run into problems ... and conflicts ...
"What irritates us about others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves"
(Carl Jung)

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by dijmart » Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:39 pm

Phil2 wrote:... the key lies in acceptance of 'what is' ...
Yes, to accept "what is" you have to be "present", so means the same thing to me. :D
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Long Time Seeker » Sun Aug 03, 2014 11:04 pm

Thanks for the replies. I hope I didn't give the impression that I lose my cool in the sense that I get violent or angry - that is not what I meant. Simply the fact that when I need to be at my calmest to be able to offer the right sort of support, I find myself slipping from my "nowness" to the extent that the support I can offer falls short of what I would like to be able to give.

I appreciate the points that wanting to avoid negativity will attract it - my issues with it are that the only way I can cope with the relationship I'm in is that I have to be detached and in a good frame of mind and not react to any negativity being shown. Trying to accept the person as for what they are is fine most of the time, but in a close relationship the trigger points are quite tightly interwoven into the history of that relationship - and that is where I sometimes struggle. My partner knows about my path and my following of ET and she is quite supportive most of the time - but when she is struggling to cope herself, all sorts of things come out that are designed to try and get a reaction, or she is just venting her frustration at how she is feeling - and that again is hard to deal with.

I feel I am a fair way down the path of learning and letting go of my ego - and I recognise when I do fall short and slip from nowness - and I read that this is quite normal for everyone who is looking to find a way to enlightenment - we all slip now and then - but I also want to be able to offer the right sort of support to help my partner when she needs it most. I do, I think, largely accept how she is and I have stepped back a long way from trying to help her because I recognised that I may have been doing the opposite to help her - making it harder for her to cope. In a sense the detachment I showed when I took the step back emotionally left a bit of a vacuum in our relationship, because I stopped reacting to her in the way I had previously when I had taken on her suffering and trying to help maybe too much.

Over time this has helped us both, I think, but I understand that my acceptance of her - and myself - has to be total - and maybe if I can do that, then it will alleviate situations for her too.

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by dijmart » Mon Aug 04, 2014 2:41 am

Long Time Seeker wrote:Thanks for the replies. I hope I didn't give the impression that I lose my cool in the sense that I get violent or angry - that is not what I meant. Simply the fact that when I need to be at my calmest to be able to offer the right sort of support, I find myself slipping from my "nowness" to the extent that the support I can offer falls short of what I would like to be able to give.
I didn't think you you meant that at all, not the impression I got. I just wrote what I wrote. One thing lead to another, I'm glad if some of it helped. As far as you giving support to your partner...sometimes depressed people just need someone to listen. Perhaps, give full attention and compassion when she's talking and see if you really need to give any further support then that? Of course, if you're busy, it's fine to ask her to wait until you're ready or willing to be attentive. As far as the triggers in relationships...those are a challenge :lol: Every time you are triggered and react in a way you would not have liked..bless it and learn from it..it's there to awaken you further!
Take what you like and leave the rest.

Manyana
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Manyana » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:10 am

Hi Long Time Seeker, a good book that you and your partner may find helpful is
The Mindful Way Through Depression: Freeing Yourself from Chronic Unhappiness.

Phil2
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Phil2 » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:03 am

Manyana wrote:Hi Long Time Seeker, a good book that you and your partner may find helpful is
The Mindful Way Through Depression: Freeing Yourself from Chronic Unhappiness.
Hi manyana,

Thanks for this reference. The book is available freely as pdf to download (no link here of course :-)

This book is written by psychotherapy professional practicioners and seems to be a blend of Cognitive Therapy (healing of the 'head' ie. thoughts and beliefs) and meditation (healing of the 'heart' ie. emotions) ... seems interesting indeed ... maybe I can say more on this later ...

:)
"What irritates us about others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves"
(Carl Jung)

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Sighclone » Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:45 pm

LTS -

Welcome to the forum. I was about to post an independent thread on this, but here is fine.

Pure presence is always available. "Staying present" is less important that returning there. Regular visits (say even 50 per day) makes "re-entry" easier. "Staying present" in a one-on-one conversation with someone who is angry or chronically depressed (and therefore loves company and probably has little conversational 'hooks" to grab you) is not easy without completely zoning out the person. So just leave. "I can't help you here, dear, I can only add to my own stress and I won't do that." And walk away. While it is true we need to help others, it is equally true we need to keep the saw sharp (Covey) and need to respect ourself. Even our "little me egoic self" or whatever "stage" you are at.

During the day when you are alone be extra sensitive to the arising of a stressful thought or response. And just be with that response as it arises -- be very "now-present" as it surfaces. After a while the "power of now" (... sorry for the cliché) will enervate the stressor. None of these mental goblins can stand up to Pure Awareness. PA wins every contest because it is the final crucible and just burns up these little stressors. Once your partner understands that you are simply going to disconnect during a pity party, they will slow that down. In the car, just pull it over and get out. I'm serious. ET says there are three things you can do when a difficult situation arises: accept it, change it or leave. Leave seems to me to be the best.

The negativity is not always there. The only thing that is "always there" is you. And you are aware presence. Identifying with anything less than that, as you know intellectually and conceptually, is a recipe for failure. Stop it... even if your capacity to be present feels like it's limited, keep practicing. balancedview.org has exercises for staying present. And the Williams book looks good, too.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

Manyana
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Manyana » Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:19 am

Phil2 wrote: Thanks for this reference. The book is available freely as pdf to download (no link here of course :-)
You're welcome Phil, there is also an audiobook on YT.

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by dijmart » Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:37 am

Sighclone wrote: In the car, just pull it over and get out. I'm serious.
:shock:
Take what you like and leave the rest.

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Long Time Seeker » Wed Aug 06, 2014 12:02 am

Sighclone wrote:LTS -

Welcome to the forum. I was about to post an independent thread on this, but here is fine.

Pure presence is always available. "Staying present" is less important that returning there. Regular visits (say even 50 per day) makes "re-entry" easier. "Staying present" in a one-on-one conversation with someone who is angry or chronically depressed (and therefore loves company and probably has little conversational 'hooks" to grab you) is not easy without completely zoning out the person. So just leave. "I can't help you here, dear, I can only add to my own stress and I won't do that." And walk away. While it is true we need to help others, it is equally true we need to keep the saw sharp (Covey) and need to respect ourself. Even our "little me egoic self" or whatever "stage" you are at.

During the day when you are alone be extra sensitive to the arising of a stressful thought or response. And just be with that response as it arises -- be very "now-present" as it surfaces. After a while the "power of now" (... sorry for the cliché) will enervate the stressor. None of these mental goblins can stand up to Pure Awareness. PA wins every contest because it is the final crucible and just burns up these little stressors. Once your partner understands that you are simply going to disconnect during a pity party, they will slow that down. In the car, just pull it over and get out. I'm serious. ET says there are three things you can do when a difficult situation arises: accept it, change it or leave. Leave seems to me to be the best.

The negativity is not always there. The only thing that is "always there" is you. And you are aware presence. Identifying with anything less than that, as you know intellectually and conceptually, is a recipe for failure. Stop it... even if your capacity to be present feels like it's limited, keep practicing. balancedview.org has exercises for staying present. And the Williams book looks good, too.

Andy

Thanks sighclone. I'll look at "balancedview" as I know I could use some help! Its quite strange, because I seem to be being "tested" quite a bit at the moment in this area - even away from home. I'm a very easy going person most of the time - and rarely have confrontations with others or difficulties with people - other than at home - but just recently I've had several situations that have really been awareness trip-wires where my reactions/emotions have been triggered quite out of the blue. Its almost as if people see me as an easy going person and occasionally someone will take advantage of that - and when that happens the ego trips in straight away - almost like my ego saying about the other person - "look here, I'm being nice to you and you are taking that as a sign that I'm weak and trying to exert power over me" I'm very aware of this kind of thing when it happens - more so than ever - but I still react. Accepting other people's angst and not reacting to it is still a big hurdle for me - at home it is largely predictable and habitual and I am aware of that and working at it, but these other trivial incidents that cause me to react are part of something we all have top deal with I suppose as we try to let the ego go and be present in the now. Acceptance seems to be the key here - and maybe the message that I am getting is that it is this I need to be able to do better.

Thanks for the advice - leaving is something I'll try too, in the future, if I feel my habitual trigger points at home are being targeted too cleverly! :)

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by disengaged » Fri Aug 08, 2014 5:58 pm

Hi, Your life situation sounds almost exactly the same as mine. The only thing that really helped me, and I mean it's tried and working, is disengage myself from the thoughts and emotions as quickly as possible and stay there whenever a challenge occurs.

Try it next time you feel angry or sad. Just say to yourself, the anger/sadness doesn't belong to me(they in fact belong to the collective human pain body as ET beautifully explained), then observe what happens. Also you mentioned you feel you need to do better at the end. That sounded exactly like my old story. That thought belongs to ego, don't believe that. I don't know if you are familiar with the concept of non-self, basically when I believe in that story, I become this imperfect, emotionally charged "I". A false self is born.

One final silly point I discovered about wives. They are actually quite pleasant to be around most of the time, i.e., they are not as annoying as I originally thought:-).

Hope any of these would offer slight help to your situation.

51sth
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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by 51sth » Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:02 pm

Long Time Seeker wrote:In a lot of what I do, I am fairly positive and manage to keep fairly well in the present (I think!). But when I am tired and/or my partner is particularly negative (she suffers from depression), I quite often find myself losing that presence and "nowness" - often when I need it most to be there. I have tried detachment and meditation and yoga etc etc and all these things help, but still find that if I lose that "nowness" - even if its just once - it sets back things at home for days, sometimes weeks - not only in relationship terms, but in my own psyche. Maybe I beat myself up over it too much, but the learning curve which I am on seems to be a rocky one. Keeping calm when people around you are negative isn't easy, I think. I've heard it said you should avoid negative people - but that to me seems a cop out.

So how does anybody out there deal with situations like the above, whether its at home or work, or even out socially?
Well I have noticed that there is a fake way of being present. The way that you don't face the emotions that are currently there, but instead try to avoid them by being "present". This ofcourse isn't being present. So there is resistance to the ongoing feelings what arise from the moment. There is also thought patterns which might be unhealthy and they basicly keep breathing because I resist the emotions which are there and really should be faced. I haven't had the strenght to face them earlier, but now I have found it from loving myself. I use the method described in the book "Love Yourself Like Your Life Depends On It" ( http://www.amazon.com/Love-Yourself-Lik ... B0086BX8UE ). I basicly do a daily practice of loving myself whenever I remember and have the time. I sit in front of a mirror and say to myself that I love myself, when I am jogging I think to myself that I love myself, when I go to sleep I say to myself that I love myself etc. Small things has started to happen and my problems have started to dissolve. I don't know what's the mechanism behind it, but it really seems to work. When I started my practice I cried a lot, but it was in a good way. I would suggest everyone to try this one out for a month. What arises from this practice is the best thing where your life should go, whatever it is.

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Re: How do you keep in the now when negativity is always the

Post by Sighclone » Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:27 pm

51sth -

What a lovely, timely post. Thank you. People might think that "loving yourself" means buying gifts for the ego. That's not what is indicated, of course. From the perspective of the brain, we need to activate the parasympathetic nervous system, part of the autonomic nervous system, which is done by diaphragm breathing, progressive relaxation, meditation, feeling safer, and secure, finding refuge, loving and serving others. I have not read the Ravikant book, but I have ordered it. My comments above are from "Buddha's Brain," by Hanson and Mendius:
http://www.amazon.com/Buddhas-Brain-Pra ... %27s+brain
-- also a fine brain-based, somewhat scientific approach. The subtitle is "The practical neuroscience of happiness, love and wisdom."

As our "little-me" separate inside self dissolves, we naturally will know to tend to the needs of the body and spirit, such as we sense them. Sleeping ,eating, resting, exercise attain equal priority to serving and caring for and loving others. In a somewhat different context, Stephen Covey's "The Seven Habits of highly Successful People," 25 years ago reminds us to "sharpen the saw."

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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