Embodying awareness

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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:09 pm

Yes, I agree, using the term cult is inappropriate with this little information.

I think that pretty much every religious group has some degree of an exclusive, us/them, spiritual superiority attitude at its root. But only a small number of religious groups qualify as cults.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby bobdylanfan » Thu Sep 01, 2016 3:43 pm

Yesah I understand your point Rach miel , if you google cult characteristics then a lot of these traits come up. I think it's kind of unintentionally turned into a closed organisation, there are so many good points about it, the people are genuine loving open hearted people and the essence of awareness is very obvious from the moment you walk into your first meeting. I have many friends who are still involved and seem very happy, I just personally felt a bit trapped and not as free as I knew I could be.

I can totally relate to the self consciousness of hugging a tree aswell as finding this a good way to antagonise and provoke this fear in me, to help me rest with it and work with it. I'm interested to see if there's anything trees can teach us, if we can download knowledge from nature in this way. I heard a guy once describe taking peyote and the plant informed him that humans are consist of primate and alien DNA. Very interesting stuff and I wonder it we can receive this information without have to ingest a plant.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Thu Sep 01, 2016 8:16 pm

bobdylanfan wrote:Yesah I understand your point Rach miel , if you google cult characteristics then a lot of these traits come up. I think it's kind of unintentionally turned into a closed organisation, there are so many good points about it, the people are genuine loving open hearted people and the essence of awareness is very obvious from the moment you walk into your first meeting. I have many friends who are still involved and seem very happy, I just personally felt a bit trapped and not as free as I knew I could be.

Sounds like you did the right thing.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Fri Sep 02, 2016 3:57 pm

I think there is some truth to that kind of communication with plant-life BDF. My teacher often says that trees are radiant beings that can teach as well as any awakened human - we just require the openness to hear their teaching. It's the same presence manifest as the tree that is manifest as you and me and it is in constant communion with itself despite any physical and mental boundaries.

Though there is certainly a lot of good that can come out of this line of exploration, a word of caution. It is easy for us to get confused between authentic communcation and our own egoic mind and it's lust for control. Left unchecked and unguided by an outside teacher this can get confusing and disorienting especially if you are already having some difficulties with grounding. Keeping it simple during the grounding process is often more helpful than trying to get too out there exploring the big cosmic stuff. I think the story of Icarus points to that. Try not to get too carried away and get too close to the sun - patience is a virtue, you've got all the time in the world :)
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Fri Sep 02, 2016 4:44 pm

EnterZenFromThere wrote:My teacher often says that trees are radiant beings that can teach as well as any awakened human - we just require the openness to hear their teaching. It's the same presence manifest as the tree that is manifest as you and me and it is in constant communion with itself despite any physical and mental boundaries.

Beautiful! And rings true. :-)

If you feel comfortable sharing, who is your teacher, what tradition, etc.?
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Fri Sep 02, 2016 5:54 pm

His name is Francis Bennett. He was a Trappist monk for 30+ years and also ordained in Theravaden Buddhism and was well studied in Zen Buddhism and Hindu Vedanta. He left the monastery following a big awakening in 2010 and started teaching in a style that drew from his experience across traditions. Recently he became formally initiated as a teacher of Adyashanti's Open Gate Sanga.

I used to think I didn't need a teacher. My awakening has been spontaneous for the most part so I thought I could make it on my own but I see now I was missing out unnecessarily. I feel very fortunate to have Francis as my teacher. I consider it one of the most valuable relationships I've ever had.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:47 pm

Sounds like a good relationship for you. Enjoy! :-)
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby Sighclone » Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:06 am

Jack -

I know Francis reasonably well. He showed up at the 2012 SAND conference in the US, just about the time he published "I Am That I Am." We have spoken briefly at all the conferences since then, and I have followed his Facebook page. What a wonderful "person." And also quite assertive in some areas that are controversial, and I always line up with him. Plus he is very modest and yet clear, etc. Forming a relationship with Adya was a plus for him. I'm sure I will see him in October again.

And how absolutely synchronous and splendid that you settled in with him as a teacher - I also admired your powerful wide-ranging path and your Big presence here!!

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Tue Sep 06, 2016 10:41 am

Hi Andy,

I think I now Francis well enough that he would be a bit confused at seeing you refer to him as a "person". His next book is called "Fully Human, Fully Divine" and points to the Truth that we are simultaneously completely the ephemeral Presence of the radiant Spiritual Heart AND completely the simple, flawed human form that we experience in birth, growth and death.

Francis IS a person! I AM a person! You ARE a person! We just aren't exclusively limited to this one dimension of the totality of what we are. We are the individual wave (the exclusive human entity) AND the entire surface of the ocean (all relative phenomena) AND the depths of the ocean (pure awareness/Spirit). I see a lot of teachers pointing exclusively to the ocean and denying the individual wave and the surface of the ocean. Frankly I think it's nonsense. You'd have to be pretty deluded to deny you are a human while literally living a human life!

It was an interaction on this forum that first led me to Francis. I think it was actually something you yourself said Andy. I was looking for some advice on some experiences I was trying to make sense of and I think you recommended Francis, having seen his posts on Facebook. It's fascinating to see the ways Presence pulls itself together.. :)
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Tue Sep 06, 2016 4:03 pm

> We are the individual wave (the exclusive human entity) AND the entire surface of the ocean (all relative phenomena) AND the depths of the ocean (pure awareness/Spirit).

Yes! And *how* we are those seemingly exclusive things ... the individual and the entirety ... all at once ... that's the mystery.

Seems like we're headed in the same (non-)direction. All roads (eventually) lead home? :-)
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby Onceler » Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:38 am

Oddly, I had the thought yesterday, before I read your post EZFT, that a good title for a book would be 'Fully Human, Fully Divine'. Not that I could write such a book, but it is in keeping with the way my mind and spirit are meandering these days.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:53 am

Interesting how so many of us Tolle forum old-timers are converging on the same understanding at the same time. Must be in the air ... :-)
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:36 am

I think it's a Christian phrase originally Onceler perhaps the idea crept in somewhere from there..who knows. Jesus spoke about being fully human and fully divine. It's a messahe often ignored throughout Christian history. The divinity of Christ was heavily emphasised, while the humanity of Jesus was put aside. 'The experience Christ was having wasn't for the likes of you and me', said the Church. That wasn't what Jesus was saying. Jesus said the kingdom of heaven is within YOU. YOU are the beloved child of God. Not other than God. YOU are fully human, fully divine!

I agree with your point about all roads leading home Rach. Just as night precedes day, ignorance precedes knowledge. It's a natural and inevitable movement of consciousness. Knowing itself to be any and every being, The One doesn't leave anyone behind.
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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby rachMiel » Wed Sep 07, 2016 4:21 pm

Us too?

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Re: Embodying awareness

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed Sep 07, 2016 5:05 pm

Nah. God hates meercats. These guys are f&£ked.
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