Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

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Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:40 am

I have a hard time with people who feel the need to take moral high ground over others, especially when they do some disservice to another. I find that busybodies agitate me, because they tend to claim some moral highground for doing what they did, like a controlling person sees themselves as especially caring, or taking a stance against evil. Or in other people who feel the constant need to punish, belittle or nag others, and claiming they are taking some moral high ground against the bad guys, or being more caring. I find that I have a pretty anti-coercion personality, as I have very Libertarian politics, and in general am pretty individualist when it comes to friends and family. I am not one to tell people close to me how to live their lives(maybe in emergency situations), and sometimes wish others would do the same. I really dont like when those who I have no personal relationship with stick their nose in my business and try being controlling or judgmental.

So I think that I have a hard time forgiving people who ever claimed moral or any form of higher ground over me. I keep trying to figure out why this is. I have said that it is undignifying to call judgmental, degrading or controlling behavior morally proper in any situation. I have sometimes thought it was out of fear of being unable to find healthy relationships with others if they have to be controlling, critical, or be competitive with me. Then I have thought maybe there is some truth they are exposing about me that I do not want to face, and get mad at the messenger.

Now I wonder if it is even worth trying to figure out in the first place. Similar to the Arrow Sermon. I just know that I have a hard time with moralism and people claiming some moral high ground.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby dijmart » Tue Jan 03, 2017 8:30 pm

I don't think it's an accident that certain people cross our path. Perhaps, we need to learn something from them or they need to learn something from us.

There's a plethora of reasons, but since you feel so irritated I'm going to assume you need to learn something from them. Perhaps it's advice you don't want to hear or to learn to stick up for yourself when a situation arises or maybe to learn to be tolerant of and have patience with others or learning to simply ignore the behaviors of others that gets under your skin...that's a spiritual practice all by itself!

However, there a certain people that abuse others, that's not what I'm referring to, just to be clear.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:23 am

I think I definitely have a personality where there are things I really like and things I just dont like. Then there are those things I dont care about. I wonder if it really is about identification with liking and disliking things. Because I think a personality that dislikes or likes everything is also just as prone to egoism, or someone trying to change their likes and dislikes.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby dijmart » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:48 pm

I think I definitely have a personality where there are things I really like and things I just dont like. Then there are those things I dont care about.


That's basically how most people are...

I wonder if it really is about identification with liking and disliking things.


Right, likes and dislikes can distort reality, like if you don't get something you want or the flip side, you get something that's not wanted, then you feel resistance. If you get what you like, thats all well and good, but dont get to attached to it.

Better to let your preferences guide you, but be okay with what presents itself. Surrender to what is, then go from there.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 9:23 pm

I think the biggest source of Moralism is due to a fairly recent traumatic experience I had with Spiritual Abuse with being part of Fundamentalist Catholicism, and their belief in Eternal Damnation for committing mortal sins without going to confession before I died. Plus there was so much emphasis on them being the one true religion, and that their doctrines and dogmas were unquestionably right and the rest were wrong. I saw in the "True" Catholics like those who followed the teachings to the very letter were extremely self righteous, dour, judgmental, draconian and had a major guilt complex on themselves(also known as false humility). They often used justifications that people were too evil to understand right from wrong, and too stupid to understand true justice.

So I find that I hate anything that resembles Spiritual abuse whether its A) Authoritarianism of any sort where one is expected to surrender their will and intuitions to another authority, B) Use of intimidation through threats of punishment or violence, or scolding C) Criticism, correcting, lecturing or reprimanding that was not asked for, D) Authoritarian personalities who submit to the powers, and act like it is their moral duty to enforce this authority onto others, or E) Ideologies that treat people as incompetent, and therefore undeserving of being treated with dignity.

I get easily annoyed when workplaces, families, governments, schools, religions, social groups or cultures behave in such a fashion.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby dijmart » Sun Feb 26, 2017 11:37 pm

Yeah, I don't do religion. Many years ago I tried the Christian thang, didn't sit well with me. So, I turned away from it and didn't look back!
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 4:48 am

I have also observed that I much of my attachment to Libertarianism is my overall disdain for external Social Structures. I think this is the Postmodern Metanarrative, but it sees all the problems of society centered around having too many laws and structures. In my case, I feel like the structures make personal relationships difficulty and untrustworthy. In the sense that people are too likely to put the institution in question above their family and friends, whether becoming very conditional with their friendships or neglecting relationships.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:47 pm

I have found that the Collective and the Individual Ego both have a hard time seeing the egocentricity on the other side, but not their own. I dont know about other Spiritual Traditions, but the Judeo-Christian tradition at its best seemed to always be harder on Collective Egoism than on Individual Egoism. I remember they called the traits of the Collective Ego sins of the Spirit and of the Individual Ego sins of the flesh.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby painBody » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:09 pm

Can you ignore such people who "take a moral high ground" over you ? It is just their egos talking, in an attempt to feel "right" or "superior".

I don't think you need to forgive them. Just ignore them.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:31 pm

I had an interesting realization about why I am so attached to Libertarianism, because I am not inhibited from pursuing my own desires. However, upon further realization, Libertarian Politics cannot give me what I want. All it can do is prohibit any power from not allowing me to pursue what I want, without any prohibitions(So long as I dont impede on others). SO I see my hatred of controlling people or strict authorities is due to seeing them as a direct refusal to let me have what I want. Yet there are many other factors into getting what one wants, and not all about who has what power.

Yet I find myself still stuck in a Postmodern Deconstructionism Ego. For me, I am not a fan of people making Ideological truth claims. On one hand, Deconstructionism is a good tool for exposing ideological presumptions, and any so called monopolies on truth and goodness. I remember a few years back having a terrifying experience with the Realization that my mind cannot of what it knows. Everything the Mind understands comes from Intuitions. Yet the scary realization was that I could not be so certain that any intuition is correct. However, the good thing about this was that I came to the Realization that all egocentric claims or "isms", are ultimately illusory, in particular the ones that I found so threatening.

Yet I cant help but wonder if Deconstructionism and Postmodernism are still egocentric. Since I still find in myself the need to judge those who I deem as unconscious to the extent that they affirm their beliefs on particular matters. I cannot help but see bigotry as being inexcusably stupid, due to the egocentricity in calling anything evil if it does not fit into some narrow ideology, whether its something that can be controlled(Religion, political affiliation, preferences, lifestyle) or that cant be controlled(Race, Gender, Ethnicity, Sexual Orientation or Disability). I still cannot help being so judgmental and opposed towards any authoritarianism, and so pro-libertarian, along with a bias towards the left over the right.

Yet I can see that the Postmodern Ego is not enlightenment, only a deconstruction of what is thought to be enlightenment. Since all it does is create an enlightened elite with some special esoteric knowledge, and therefore unquestionable and beyond reproach. I remember how in my younger years, adults often times demanded blind obedience, because they were so enlightened, and often time showed no accountability, but demanded it. Or in religion, many times the priests and sacred texts were put on a pedestal to be blindly unquestioned, due to containing some esoteric knowledge.
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Re: Am I worrying too much about my annoyance with moralism?

Postby jtightlips21 » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:55 pm

I realized that I most fear incompetence
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