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Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:08 pm
by OldThinker45
Hello to all...

I have read the books of eckhart tolle. He so much speaks of the afterworld with such unity and peace.

I am in so much pain... But if I try to follow his book to the letter... Doesn't killing yourself instantly attain you this sense of peace he speaks of ?

I mean, if are true selves are not our ego, isn't killing our ego takes us back to our true selves instantly ?

I am happy to cross the white light as I do not want of this life anyway, Eckhart Tolle's teachings are all about coping with it anyway, so why not end it ?

Thank you for your replies

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:18 pm
by Webwanderer
Welcome to the forum OldThinker. I don't see suicide as a right or wrong issue, more one of comparative value. As a being/soul who chose to come here for the value of the human experience, have you gotten all you came for? It's unlikely that anyone outside your self can answer that for you. If you haven't already, I suggest you do an in-depth study of near death experiences. Learn what you can from those who have had a peek beyond the veil and came back with some more clarity on how life works.

There are some very good discussion threads in these pages or you can go to the websites of several good research organizations such as NDERF and IANDS. There are others that are more archives of experiences and of course many good books of individual experiences. Get as much knowledge as you can from those that have the advantage of seeing just why it is we are here. There are many who have suffered enormous pain, both physical and emotional, and once they saw with clarity found their way to an enjoyable human life.

WW

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:29 pm
by steve Davidson
Hi OldThinker,

Yes, WebWanderers post contains a lot of good suggestions, please read and re-read what he wrote and look into NDEs and what they have to say especially about suicide. From what i read over the years, suicide is not the answer. And in fact, some on here, who have actually tried it, tried to kill themselves, are glad they did not succeed and have found life worth living now. And would never try it again now. You are in good company on here, with many similar people with similar backgrounds. Please stay on here and converse with some of them and learn and grow together.

In my opinion, your conclusion about Tolle and the afterworld, and why not just end it now, is a faulty conclusion and one of the dangers and misunderstandings of reading authors like him. He is not saying to end it now and just be at peace. Peace is found while living, not while dead. Tolle quotes a Zen Master when asked what happens when we die (paraphrasing here) : "I do not know what happens when i die. The disciple says, but you are a Zen Master, and the Master replies, but I am not a dead Zen Master." Life is about living, and dying while alive. Dying to our self and to the past, to each moment. All spiritual traditions point to dying while alive and then being truly alive.

Killing oneself is not seen as a solution nor does it bring peace from most spiritual traditions perspective. We all understand how hard and difficult and painful life can be, but life is where it is at, and is the most precious thing. Unity and peace can be found here, within oneself, that is Tolles message. Tolle is happy to be alive now and is at peace and glad he did not kill himself either, by the way. Please continue to reflect on this and try to see it in a different light and perspective, and continue to want to learn and grow and make the most of this precious human life. Please stay on this forum and share and be around like minded people. Wishing you the very best and much love and happiness.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:12 am
by painBody
I can't believe I didn't see this thread sooner.

People can (and will) go on and on and on about how suicide is not a solution to life's challenges. Or they might bullshit you with, "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem."

Let's not kid each other here. Suicide IS a 100% reliable solution to any and all problems one might have or believe one has. No one can deny that.

I think what most are trying to say is that, by going through with suicide, not only are you bringing a cessation to the problems and resultant suffering, but you are also bringing an end to your consciousness and any potential (fleeting) moments of joy that may come with it.

So, the question then becomes - when you put "life" and death on the scale, which one comes out on top ? That's really it, in my opinion. Is it worthwhile to stick around ? It's like plugging values for variables into a math equation and seeing what kind of result you get. Will things (probably) get better ? How much better ? Can they get worse ? How much worse ? And, then, the answer is a (simple, in my opinion) yes or no.

But, in any case, let's not beat around the bush with bullshit drug store suicide psychology. Suicide WORKS, if it is done successfully. Whether or not it is the right course of action for you ... only you know. As to whether it is right or wrong, people can debate all they want ... I don't think Vincent Van Gogh or Robin Williams care too much.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 4:02 pm
by Webwanderer
painBody wrote:I don't think Vincent Van Gogh or Robin Williams care too much.

It's interesting that you should mention Robin Williams in your comments. In his movie 'What Dreams May Come', Williams character's wife committed suicide. The theme of the movie was built around the destructive effect it had on her in her afterlife experience. We create our own experience based to a large extent on what we believe. Some investigative study into afterlife experiences seems wise.

WW

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 10:59 pm
by painBody
Webwanderer wrote:
painBody wrote:Some investigative study into afterlife experiences seems wise.
WW


I think we've covered this ground before, you and I :)

I think I'll just blissfully continue to believe what I know to be true ... that there is no such thing as an afterlife.

To each, his own.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:52 pm
by Webwanderer
painBody wrote:I think I'll just blissfully continue to believe what I know to be true ... that there is no such thing as an afterlife.


Knowing and believing are most certainly joined at the hip. How can one tell the difference?

Of course there is no 'afterlife' as such as seen in the context of this human perspective. There is only life eternal in infinite potential forms - this human exploration being one.

One interesting thing about consciousness being creative (supported by the way in quantum physics) is that through a strong belief in no afterlife, one might actually create that experience. It seems unlikely to last forever, but who can say what might become an unintended reality. If there is nothing so be it, but I see no point in engaging creative energy to that 'end'. I'm not sure 'no' is the best approach to infinite possibilities.

WW

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 4:09 pm
by Mystic
“Energy cannot be created or destroyed, it can only be changed from one form to another.” -- Albert Einstein

Energy is then eternal and ultimately not bound by time.

The eternal formless essence of who you are is deeper than the superficial shell of form.

Being keeps coming back here, reincarnating in new forms so there must be something valuable about life experiences in this physical universe.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:02 am
by sardinelover
oldthink45, please go and see a mental health professional.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:41 am
by turiya
Oldthink45,

Here's an Eckhart video about suicide that may be helpful to watch:

https://vimeo.com/68833662

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:46 am
by painBody
turiya wrote:Oldthink45,

Here's an Eckhart video about suicide that may be helpful to watch:

https://vimeo.com/68833662


Thanks for sharing that link ! I've been searching, forever, for Eckhart material about suicide, but was never able to find anything.

Will have a listen.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:56 am
by turiya
Thanks for sharing that link !


Sure thing, pB :wink:

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:20 am
by turiya
There is this video also (basically the same advice, though):

https://vimeo.com/85702064

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:41 pm
by painBody
Here's a thought about s****** ... I wish I had succeeded.

Re: Thinking about suicide...

PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:44 pm
by DavidB
Eckhart mentions in one of his talks that suicide will likely result in rapid reincarnation. I don't remember the talk, nor his exact words. But this might suggest that suicide only results in having to deal again, with whatever issue it is we feel is presently insurmountable.

My thoughts on this are that if pain is irretrievably beyond our threshold to bear, then termination can be a very attractive and logical conclusion. I've been there a few times.

Fortunately for myself however, I was provided with opportunity to see beyond my present experience and am now very much pain free. I'm only suggesting that pain, while it may well appear permanent, is most likely only temporary.