Guilt / responsability

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astaroth
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Guilt / responsability

Post by astaroth » Wed Mar 19, 2008 8:23 pm

Hi everyone!

The last time was... well... I could write a book about it :lol:

I found for myself, that I am not in the world. That may sound funny (it is). Consciousness is, to me, today like a window through which the nameless witness sees the world. It sees the world, it sees feelings, thoughts and so on... it sees a mental construct called "astaroth" which seems to move the body, according to his script, which most people call personality. But the Self is always before astaroth, even before the world. I am not from this world. Scary. :lol:

But which keeps me entrapped in astaroth's dreamworld is guilt. Somehow I see that all these struggles are astaroth's struggles, not mine. But astaroth moves the body. Doesn't he? He talks, thinks, feels, acts... Wrong?

But even seeing myself now outside the world doesn't keep astaroth from feeling guilt about what he has done. Today, that's all stories. But astaroth blames itself for having it done, anyway. So where is the problem, you might ask. :lol: But that feeling of guilt is, after all, pulling me back again and again and the more I think about it, the more astaroth becomes me. But when I don't think about it, there's a feeling of "I have to understand that damn guilt-question". Well, I can observe it. But I think I should understand it, anyway :lol:

webwanderer, you once wrote "do you still feel guilt about what you have done in a dream?" I didn't understand what you meant. But saying "okay, it isn't all that bad, it's just a dream" may sound true for me now, for I see I am not inside the world of form. But it sounds also cruel. You know what I mean? Just letting go completely of astaroth feels like sneaking away from responsabilty. Not being responsible for anything, after all, that feels cruel.

Please give me some wise words...
Thanks,
astaroth
...you might remember me from such educational films as "Zen for couch-potatoes - The wisdom of never doing anything" or "Buddha from da hood - Was he a brother?"

D'ray
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Re: Guilt / responsability

Post by D'ray » Wed Mar 19, 2008 9:25 pm

webwanderer, you once wrote "do you still feel guilt about what you have done in a dream?" I didn't understand what you meant. But saying "okay, it isn't all that bad, it's just a dream" may sound true for me now, for I see I am not inside the world of form. But it sounds also cruel. You know what I mean? Just letting go completely of astaroth feels like sneaking away from responsabilty. Not being responsible for anything, after all, that feels cruel.
Yes, a good one. Can you sense the feeling of guilt not being the real you? Ego makes itself a problem so you are in this mind-puzzle and there is no way out. Making better and better reasons to make itself alive. Basically you (ego) are trying to think its way out. And thinking in the first place got you there :D . The knot is trying to tie itself.

Feeling guilt. Does it somehow prevent or add the possibility that you do what perhaps is necessary to do? For example if you accidentally hurt someone's feelings and then you feel guilt - Does feeling guilt somehow have an effect that you would or wouldn't do the right action which comes in the Now?
There's no "I" to become enlightened. The "I" can have spiritual experiences.

DON'T resist the RESISTANCE! The resistance is there. Walk into it. Feel it. Become one with it.

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Re: Guilt / responsability

Post by Webwanderer » Wed Mar 19, 2008 11:55 pm

Astaroth, there are primarily two perspectives from which to view the memories which trouble you - from clear presence, and from mind-based identity.

Ideally one would live as awareness, cognizant of all that happens within its purview, without becoming identified with the mind that interacts with ongoing nature of life. That of course, is the purpose of ET's teachings and this forum in general.

The other perspective is that of mind itself, and while it's best to learn to recognize it's propensities as just an interesting phenomenom, emotions like guilt can bind us to a sense of separateness due to the isolating self-judgment that lingers indefinately. My earlier suggestion that one does not hold guilt for actions commited in a dream is a reference to the view from Essential awareness that is beyond dreams, and for that matter beyond life in form.

However, let's consider the mind-based perspective and see if we can loosen the binding a bit so maybe an effective path back to clarity can be found. First, recognize that the past cannot be changed, it doesn't even exist. What exists, and what troubles you, are present memories of past events. Knowing that you can't change the past, that only leaves your present relationship with those memories. Don't try to bury them, they will only sprout roots and grow bigger. Rather than suppress them, do the only sane thing you can do at this point, and that is to learn the lessons your past actions have to teach you.

Make this a point of genuine spiritual integrity. Be willing at any moment, to look your actions in the face and acknowledge your responsibility in them. Determine that these mistakes are to be life altering events that turn you into better person, and turn your recognitions into a more honest way of relating to the world around you. If someone or something suffered as a result of your actions (or inactions), make their sacrifice into a watershed of awakening in turning you away from destructive behavior. It's never too late to make good use of a bad memory.

You cannot change what happened, but you can let what happened change you into a more beautiful person. Don't hide from your past, embrace it. If accepted honestly, your past truly can be treasure chest of valuable gems of awakening.

In virtually all of the near death experiences (NDE) that I have studied, one common theme among them is a past life review where everything one ever does is laid bare. But what is also universal in the experience is the lack of judgment, and the loving acceptance for the one reviewing no matter how one conducted his or her life. The only judgment even remotely present is that of self-judgment which is also lovingly accepted. The point seems to be to learn from the experience, not to pay for it. I encourage you to check into them for yourself. I think you will find that your guilt is an anchor you have placed upon yourself, and that genuine self-forgiveness, not self-judgment, is the greatest gift you can give to the world - and to the one you may have harmed.

Note that all of us have done harm, and all of us must face our misdirected conduct. Better to be honest and recognize it "now", than to waste anymore time mired in guilt over mistakes we cannot change. Learn how to be honest with your memories and forgive those actions that hold you prisoner. The world needs your spirit - present, aware and free of its binds.

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