Is imagination egoic?

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citronella49
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Is imagination egoic?

Post by citronella49 » Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:28 am

I love imagination... I love to close my eyes and pretend things, always have, ever since I was little... even now (Im 29) I will act out things... basically play house... like I will pretend I am getting interviews, or pretend I am a singer in a popular bad, or I will pretend I have kids (something I really want)... these are all things I want but dont have... so I know thats not good... wanting and wanting just feeds the ego, but I love imagination... and my parents and teachers always said my imagination was a good thing, but lately it seems like a curse, cause it makes me resent where I am in life cause I dont have what I want... but I love playing pretend... and I know, someday, when I have kids, I want them to play pretend too and I want to play with them... but is that egoic? Will that strengthen their (and my) painbody?
I just want to understand

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domokato
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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by domokato » Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:51 am

Anything that you identify with is egoic. If you identify with your fantasies, it is egoic. It seems like you identify with yours. You use them to escape reality, and it only causes more suffering. I used to use drugs and video games in the same manner.

You can use your imagination to enjoy life more instead of less, like a child does. Oh no! There's hot lava there! Don't touch the ground! :D

You remember what your childhood was like? That's basically what being enlightened is. On some level, as a child, I knew that the vast majority of adults were unhappy and that my state of mind was the "correct" one. But I didn't know why or how to maintain it, so I lost it as I grew up. Good thing Eckhart came along and reminded me about it :)

Just pretend you're a child again! :D
~housecat

citronella49
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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by citronella49 » Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:14 am

I enjoyed being a child until I went to school... thats when I wasnt allowed to be me anymore... I had to be what the teacher wanted me to be... quiet and still and productive... and unfortunatly most of my memories of childhood were from after I started school... I have a pretty bad memory in general, but I know when I was really little I really didnt care what anyone thought about me... including myself... I didnt judge things as good or bad, even myself... but when I started at school and spent more time there I really didnt appreciate being treated like a second class citizen... so thats when I started with the drama, and the fighting and that eventually lead to depression and anxiety and what I have now... I wish I could remember what it felt like to run around as a little kid with no clothes on as my mom chased me and tried to make me "decent"... but I cant... I just remember what it felt like to have that freedom taken away... to join the "real world" where everyone has expectations of each other and I cant do what feels right, I have to do what the big people say is right;... and now Im a big person and I have no idea whats right... I wanna have kids, but I really dont feel like I know enough about the world to help them grow up any better than me... Im afraid I will just make them like me, all depressed and needy. I dont wanna do that, so I want to improve myself now
I just want to understand

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by domokato » Tue Dec 23, 2008 3:08 am

In a safe space, pretend everything you are seeing you are seeing for the first time. Explore the crevices......see what's in them and imagine how they got there....little pieces of lint......maybe a crumb..... See how the light shines off of things from different angles........ Feel the texture of things.........cold metal......soft pillow :)... Pick something up and enjoy the smell of it......mmmm....plastic...........put some tissue paper in your mouth and taste the....nothingness.... Maybe you'll remember what it's like to be a child then :)
~housecat

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by Techguy » Tue Dec 23, 2008 3:29 am

If the One Conciousness itself is a mature ego, then imagine the implications of that?

I imagine the Imagination is the unmanifested becoming manifest in a thought form. It is the cutting edge of conciousness. One of the rawest forms of unmanifested transformation into the manifested.
http://bestkarmayoga.com Om...Shanti, Shanti, Shanti... (peace, peace, peace)

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by Sighclone » Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:15 am

the "real world" where everyone has expectations of each other and I cant do what feels right.
You can do whatever you want to. Of course, there are consequences to every decision. I do not get the sense that the people around you are supportive of your path. Either your "egoic" path or your "Presence path." What can you do to change your environment? Move to Malaysia? I don't know, but surely there is something you can do...even in a small way.

Imagination is active often. Eckhart was asked in an Oprah webinar by an aspiring actress what she should do if "hoping and wanting and wishing about the future" was not going to work. He said, essentially: "Imagine yourself as the actress right NOW - be that actress. The world will bring the stage to you."

Namaste, Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

citronella49
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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by citronella49 » Fri Dec 26, 2008 12:18 am

Time for my pessimistic response... what if, even after pretending to be the actress, there is no stage... still just the same old person wishing she was something else?
I just want to understand

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by Sighclone » Fri Dec 26, 2008 8:58 pm

c49 -

My first response would be "jeepers, citronella, I don't know, ask Eckhart. :) " But, of course, that would be rude. I guess he might have answered: "Citronella, your principal purpose is to wake up. Center in the present moment as often as possible. As you awaken, the ego-stories about who you are/want to be will dissolve. Then read page 273 of ANE for more answers... :) "

(There he talks about people whose old external purposes changed. If the world is not bringing the stage to you, perhaps, when you awaken, your outer purpose would change. This is to say that the "wanting, hoping, wishing" to be an actress was an egoic purpose not consistent with your primary purpose, and might well not be supported by the universe.)

Namaste, Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by letitgo » Fri Dec 26, 2008 9:49 pm

Hello C49,

I couldn't help but chime in because it seems your delima relates to the merging of the spiritual and physical forms, something people with really vivid imaginations can either use to their advantage, like Einstein, or it can almost be a curse as you stated.

Techguy wrote;
I imagine the Imagination is the unmanifested becoming manifest in a thought form. It is the cutting edge of consciousness. One of the rawest forms of unmanifested transformation into the manifested.
This is a great use of the imagination. The trick is to use it in a way that your intent is to bring forth something into form. If it is just to escape, then it's more of a separation from form rather than a union.

C49 wrote;
what if, even after pretending to be the actress, there is no stage... still just the same old person wishing she was something else?
I believe it is the "wishing she were something else" that may limit your imagination from being an asset. Maybe you could use that wonderful imagination as your tool by starting small. Tap into your imagination on some small problem and find a unique solution you never would have considered otherwise. Then who knows... you may continue to use it and bring more and more into your life that was previously just a fantasy.

Good luck, Norm
To the world you may be one person, but to one person you may be the world.

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by domokato » Tue Dec 30, 2008 3:27 am

citronella49 wrote:Time for my pessimistic response... what if, even after pretending to be the actress, there is no stage... still just the same old person wishing she was something else?
That quote about imagining yourself to be the actress was just a pointer, not to be taken too seriously. I think the point he was trying to get across is that your imagination is very powerful in influencing the outcome of your life. If you believe something about yourself or others, that limits it to that belief and influences your choice of action. You have more power and range than you think. If you are wishing you were something else, that is not presence. I think Eckhart said that quote in relation to action vs inaction, or maybe it was future vs present. Either way, he doesn't want you to play roles or hope for a better future. Be who you are now. There is no wishing to be something else. You are this moment. Literally. There's nothing more to it.
~housecat

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by Lisa27 » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:06 am

If you are imaging, then you are not where you are ...you are not in the present moment...are you wanting to escape? Or is it ,you want what you image now... a present desire to be what you are imaging. These are just thoughts... no conclusions...(2nd post ever on Tolle site!)

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by peleke4 » Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:21 am

If you feel attached to fantasizing, don't fight it.. just "watch" it and ask something like, "What is that that wants things to be different than the way they are?"
Last edited by peleke4 on Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by jugu » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:17 am

Imagination is beautiful... Do whatever it takes to let that beast run wild and rampant!

citronella49
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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by citronella49 » Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:16 pm

Im kinda surprised to find such polar opinions on this... I guess I have to think about it more.
I just want to understand

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Re: Is imagination egoic?

Post by weichen » Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:33 pm

When a baby of a few months old is staring at a toy, an adult put a towel over the toy. The baby no longer sees the toy, she loses interest, or shows some frustration. To her, the toy no longer exists. However, psychologists found that some baby of several months old have developed the 'imagination' ability, in other words, she can see the toy underneath the towel through playing some mind projection. With the help of this imagination, the baby push aside the towel and grasp the toy.

A preschool kid came home and found her teddy bear not on her bed. she had an imagination that her bear is on the sofa in the living room. she went to the living room and the bear is not there, then she had another imagination about where her bear is at....

Direct sensory perception based on 'Here and now' has huge limitation. Mind projection greatly expands human capacity. Enlightenment is not about restricting ourselves with direct sensory limitation, but join force with science so that our mind projection (with help of science and technology) help us to get closer to truth.

'Here and now' is a way to retract ourselves from one delusional mind project trip back to a basic truthful (very limited) simple state, to prepare us to take a better mind projection trip.

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