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degrees of intelligence & complete species enlightenment

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 5:43 am
by human
If animals cannot comprehend mortality, view ego, or become truly enlightened, is there a degree of intelligence determining what humans can become present?

Would it be impossible or less likely for all humans to become concious soon because of a lack of overall intelligence?

is it typically easier for brilliant humans to find presence and rid themselves of ego?

or would you consider intelligence a matter of pure mind and simply the existance of conciousness within the human brain creates the ability to become enlightened?

Re: degrees of intelligence & complete species enlightenment

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:18 am
by NoordZee
Human said:
f animals cannot comprehend mortality, view ego, or become truly enlightened, is there a degree of intelligence determining what humans can become present?

Would it be impossible or less likely for all humans to become concious soon because of a lack of overall intelligence?

is it typically easier for brilliant humans to find presence and rid themselves of ego?

or would you consider intelligence a matter of pure mind and simply the existance of conciousness within the human brain creates the ability to become enlightened?
That is an interesting question. My first reaction is that is should not matter how intelligent a human being is when it comes to living in the Present. I would almost put to you that this question of yours could also apply to matters of faith. How intelligent would you have to be before you can claim that your faith in God's existence and His purpose is total. I am sure that you can find people who are very devout Christians at every level of intelligence. I am equally sure that you would be able to find lots of people across the whole intelligence spectrum who simply are not enlightened, as they either haven't heard of this concept or they cannot translate their newly found knowledge into practice.

So, where does this leave us? There must be many factors coming into play in respect of finding the Presence and with it enlightenment. It sounds oh so easy when you talk to a guru. Just become aware. Do not look or purposely try to seek enlightenment a guru says. Well, is is the same with faith. Either you got it or you don't. So, how do we become aware of the fact that we are not our thoughts? Is it sufficient to become aware of this concept and that is it? Most people would say: no! If it were that easy, this forum would not exist. I am sorry, but I cannot help you further with your question but hope that you understand what I am trying to say.

Re: degrees of intelligence & complete species enlightenment

Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 8:17 pm
by Peaceman
"Not higher but, I sometimes say animals are closer to God than humans. They are closer to the source. The humans are more lost in the mind forms. Being is more obscured to the human because of the overlay of ego and mental formation.

I call animals “guardians of beings,” especially animals that live with humans. Because, for many humans, it’s through their contact with animals they get in touch with that level of being.

We are destined not to go back to the level of animals that we’ve come from but to return to being by going beyond thinking. The animals are at a level prior to thinking. They haven’t lost themselves in thought. We rise above thinking and then we meet them again, where we’re both in no-thought. There’s a deep connection.

The consciousness of the animal also begins to change when it interacts with a human who’s gone beyond thinking. It’s not only the animals assisting us; we are also assisting the animals. The animals certainly like to be close to humans, especially as humans go through the shift in consciousness."
The Awakening of Eckhart Tolle/ Red Room discussion

We must not take this literally, as some people have pointed out on here , not all animals are in Prescence, and I myself have actually been in contact with a "mad" cat!! What is meant is....I think....animals are not burdened by all the trappings of humanity and are closer to Nature, more sensitive to things ....simply put. In this interview he also touches on your question of highly intelligent people
"And intelligence in itself doesn’t help. You can have two or three Ph.D.s; it doesn’t get you any closer to spiritual realization. In fact, you might be more distant" Again simply put...highly intelligent people(unless they have spiritual leanings) find it harder to still the "thought processes" and needs must constantly question something that cannot be put into words. In fact, its like Tolle's writings, he has put into words something that we can only "feel" . Someone mentioned "oxymoron" , by trying with words to explain what Tolle is getting at, we are actually contradicting it!! Oh I give up!! Hope this at least helps a little.
Oh and I recall Tara's quote and can say "How do I know the cat was mad?!!!" I don't!!

Re: degrees of intelligence & complete species enlightenment

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 6:16 pm
by Peaceman
Talk about addiction! I feel embarrassed ! but can't resist replying.
[/quote]"Nature exists in a state of unconscious oneness with the whole. This, for example, is why no wild animals were killed in the tsunami disaster of 2004. Being more in touch with the totality than humans, they could sense the tsunami's approach long before it could be seen or heard and so had time to withdraw to higher terrain. Perhaps even that is looking at it from a human perspective. They probably just found themselves moving to higher terrain. (lol)......whereas Nature lives in unconscious oneness with the whole." Tolle ANE