Apathy

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markallen
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Apathy

Post by markallen » Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:19 pm

Namaste

I am seeking wisdom and personal experiences on the topic of apathy.

Thank you all for your time and consideration.

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Webwanderer
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Re: Apathy

Post by Webwanderer » Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:57 pm

Apathy is a state one often encounters when first waking up from the egoic dream. It's usually only temporary but can be lasting for some. When one recognizes that one is not the identity construct that he/she spent a lifetime perceiving through and believed he/she was, there is oftentimes a rejection of all the perspectives one held dear for so long. The relationships, the interests, the experiences, virtually everything appears meaningless. It doesn't have to remain this way however, and in truth may be a leftover vestige of ego. "If it's all just an illusion, why should I care?" An egoic take I recognize. Pure awareness would not bother asking such a question, it simply takes in all experience as just part of the landscape of being.

The truth is, why not care? Life is here, it's happening right now, you have the option of engaging with life in this particular form. Why waste this opportunity to interact with creation as it unfolds. What else do you have to do? Sit around and sulk that you have deceived yourself for so many years? You could look at it as gaining night vision. While most everyone around you is stumbling around in the dark, you with greater clarity, are able to see what they cannot. You have a vision that allows you to navigate through life with comparative ease, avoiding many pitfalls that egos readily succumb to. Consider: just because life in form is illusory in nature does not mean that the experiences one has are not real. If you feel something, the sense of it is real even though the mind's interpretation of it is not.

Engage with life. Have some fun. Loving life as it unfolds is to love those you encounter. Not because you have to, or because you work at it; but because it's natural when you see the truth that life is not as it seems through the eyes of ego. It is far more interesting than the mind of man could ever imagine.

WW

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Re: Apathy

Post by runstrails » Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:24 pm

Fabulous post, WW!!! I'll be reading it often.

I just want to add, after the initial apathy, a sense of lightheartedness can occur. If life is an illusion, how can you take it too seriously? So life then becomes less stressful and more relaxed and enjoyable for the most part.

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Re: Apathy

Post by Mouse » Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:27 pm

'"apathy is described as a response to an easy challenge for which the subject has matched skills"

Does that sound familiar. The self can get stuck in circumstances that do not reflect much life to it. The solution in that case would be a fresh assessment of the living situation.
I have been inspired by Barry Long's teaching and I write this so as to acknowledge my source of inspiration. It is a wonderful help, and it is a wonderful gift.

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Re: Apathy

Post by Sighclone » Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:00 am

Great post, WW!!!

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: Apathy

Post by Novidez » Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:54 am

Hi all,

I am new here. And I'm sorry, I know that this is a really old post, but this is the way I'm feeling now.

I found Eckhart Tolle few days ago and since then, I only want to see more and more videos and read more and more things about what he says. I am kinda addicted actually. But, I'm struggling now. I mean, I am a 23 year-old guy, currently studying in college. I really understand and identify myself with the things that Eckhart says. But, instead of starting to be peaceful and living the Now, I'm finding very lost and apathethic. For example, today when I woke up I have to get dressed and move to my college to take my classes. But I just didn't. I stayed in the bed. I didn't have energies to get up and start a new day. I ended up falling asleep again and missed all my classes. And in the meantime, it seems I just don't care.
Webwanderer wrote:Apathy is a state one often encounters when first waking up from the egoic dream. It's usually only temporary but can be lasting for some. When one recognizes that one is not the identity construct that he/she spent a lifetime perceiving through and believed he/she was, there is oftentimes a rejection of all the perspectives one held dear for so long. The relationships, the interests, the experiences, virtually everything appears meaningless. It doesn't have to remain this way however, and in truth may be a leftover vestige of ego. "If it's all just an illusion, why should I care?" An egoic take I recognize. Pure awareness would not bother asking such a question, it simply takes in all experience as just part of the landscape of being.

The truth is, why not care? Life is here, it's happening right now, you have the option of engaging with life in this particular form. Why waste this opportunity to interact with creation as it unfolds. What else do you have to do? Sit around and sulk that you have deceived yourself for so many years? You could look at it as gaining night vision. While most everyone around you is stumbling around in the dark, you with greater clarity, are able to see what they cannot. You have a vision that allows you to navigate through life with comparative ease, avoiding many pitfalls that egos readily succumb to. Consider: just because life in form is illusory in nature does not mean that the experiences one has are not real. If you feel something, the sense of it is real even though the mind's interpretation of it is not.

Engage with life. Have some fun. Loving life as it unfolds is to love those you encounter. Not because you have to, or because you work at it; but because it's natural when you see the truth that life is not as it seems through the eyes of ego. It is far more interesting than the mind of man could ever imagine.

WW
This is a brilliant thing that you say here WW... But, why do I feel that I have no energies at all? What's wrong with me? I suppose this is all egoic mind talking, right...?
What do I have to do then?

Thank you all for your attention.

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Re: Apathy

Post by Webwanderer » Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:24 pm

Novidez wrote:But, why do I feel that I have no energies at all? What's wrong with me? I suppose this is all egoic mind talking, right...?
What do I have to do then?
First, there is nothing wrong with you. You have, or had, a perspective on life that has been called into question. The socially correct beliefs that you have been fed are being exposed in favor of a deeper and more inclusive view on the nature of life and being. And while you feel the things you are now realizing are inherently true, what do you do with that recognition? Life as you knew it seems like so much BS. So why should you continue to follow the course you have been on? Isn't it a waste?

In a way that's like the boat you are riding in is on course for a destination you no longer wish to go to. And now you're considering your options. Stay in your bunk and let it crash on the rocks? Jump overboard? Or maybe steer a new course? Until you decide it may be wise to keep the ship off the rocks and yourself out of the cold waters. In other words continue to play the game until you gain a little more clarity on your new perspective.

It will be easier to make decisions while in the flow than from off the rocks. The best thing about the status quo is that the familiarity offers enough stability that you can take a little time to consider what's best. Your new found knowledge and insight will take a little time (maybe a lot of time) to settle in in a way that your own inner guidance will become clearer.

Understand, life is about exploration and growth. And that can be accomplished wherever you're at and whatever you're doing. This is so simply because living from a greater perspective than the one we were en-trained with in our early years tends to be inclusive of life's circumstances rather than exclusive. So everything we do, everything we experience, has value.

Some valuable tips. Be patient and be steadfast. Patience because no one can tell you how to be. You have to feel your way to clarity by your own accord. We all do. We can get pointers from anywhere, but integration into our life perspective is on us individually. It can take time, so be patient as well as gentile with your self. There's no grading system here. Self condemnation is just one more thing to get in the way of the fun and joy that clarity of life offers. Again, be patient.

And be steadfast. That is stay the course. Find time to be mentally quite and peacefully aware every day, several times a day. Make it a way of life to rest in the present moment whenever you have the opportunity - even if it's only for a minute.

There is power in the now. Tolle recognized it. That's why he name his signature book for it. It's unlikely that you will stay mentally focused in the now all the time. There is just too much to consider in life. That's okay. Life in this human experience is designed that way. Just know where home is and return when conditions are right.

Life is inherently beautiful. If you choose to see it that way, you will experience it that way. Live in appreciation as much as you can and let go of your concerns as soon as you can. It's really that simple.

WW

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Re: Apathy

Post by CaiHong » Fri Apr 24, 2015 1:22 am

Hi Novidez,
thanks for resurrecting the old post. I really got a lot out of WW responses. I went through a couple of days of negativity, a short bursts of anger and listlessness. I took myself off to another city for a couple of days. as I walked the crowded streets I saw a man in a Tshirt that read, ""Do anything, do something". I was falling into a bit of apathy and though not a serious depth and could easily extricate myself, I needed to act to get out. WW has marvelous suggestions and insights.

Caihong

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Re: Apathy

Post by Niki » Sat May 12, 2018 2:18 am

I know this post is very old...even so, I was glad to find it—i simply googled ‘apathy and Tolle’ and I got directed here.

Not only am I having strong bouts of apathy, but Im wishing I had never heard if Tolle or Barry Long! Has anybody ever experienced this? Sometimes I want to run back.

I have no energy and all the things that gave me great pleasure—and big ego boosts because I was good at them—now seem meaningless to me. I feel very uninspired. I feel that Ive dine everything I was meant to do and dont really see the point of beng alive anymore. Although, i would never kill myself, i wouldnt really have a problem if it was time for me to die. Also, I just find myself tearing up randomly during the day—i used to pride myself on not being a cryer and very stoic.
Anyway, i feel so unsettled...so not me and yet more me than ive ever been since i was a smsll child!
Thank you for this post—i was very glad to read it.
Love niki

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Re: Apathy

Post by Webwanderer » Sat May 12, 2018 7:00 am

Hi Niki, welcome to the forum. I'm glad you found this thread insightful. Thanks for bringing it back up.
I have no energy and all the things that gave me great pleasure—and big ego boosts because I was good at them—now seem meaningless to me. I feel very uninspired.
I have found there is a lot more in life that brings pleasure and enjoyment than that which boosts the ego. That said, even the ego boosts can still be fun so long as we recognize them for what they are. Is it the ego that enjoys accomplishments? Probably. But maybe not exclusively. I enjoyed reading this thread again after so many years. It all still rings true. Consider what is enjoyable. Love is enjoyable and it's not exclusive to ego. Appreciation is much the same.

Ego tends to see accomplishment in comparison to others and enjoys standing out. Recognize that and enjoy your own foibles. Self-deprecating humor is born of this recognition. It's quite freeing.

There is much more among our pages. Look around and enjoy.

WW

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Re: Apathy

Post by Onceler » Sat May 12, 2018 12:13 pm

Hi Nikki, I’ve been in your shoes.....actually lived many years in this state. What jumped out at me was your wish to forget you ever knew about ET & Barry Long. Let’s throw in all the other spiritual teachers, right? I think this is a good instinct. Things really changed for me when I finally realized I was going in circles after 25 years of chasing enlightenment.....I actually felt worse! I made a conscious decision to give it all up and just live my life, to put away the books and videos, to forget about any spiritual aspirations.

It was the reset I needed. I was able to listen to myself and feel my life in a different way rather than second hand, through the lens of all these ‘spiritual’ folks. You can read about this transition if you wish, I think I’ve posted enough here so I won’t bore you, but the point is to begin to feel your own life and to begin to follow your own instincts. Your path is completely unique to you and if you trust this I believe you will find direction. It may even lead you out of the spiritual woods, or ghetto as some call it. I am no longer interested in spirituality, religion, no duality, etc.....My immense anxiety, depression and apathy went away along with my spiritual aspirations. I no longer suffer nearly as much as when I was “spiritual” and I live naturally, finding life immensely satisfying.

If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him. Right?
Be present, be pleasant.

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Re: Apathy

Post by Niki » Sat May 12, 2018 3:22 pm

Dear Onceler--yes, yes, yes.

And maybe I'm just plain-old-sad and the emotion simply has to pass through my system, be digested and then expelled.

After all, my husband died in September and my children are leaving home to go live their lives. I was very, very much identified with being a mother, wife and caretaker--it was an enormous privilege. Now those roles have disappeared and I can see how deeply attached I was to them.

I have a love-hate relationship with all the spiritual teachers I listen too; sometimes they just annoy me, often they tranquilize me (like a medicine) and then sporadically I get a truly deep insight that opens my eyes and reveals a layer of 'crust' or 'shell' that I had been clinging to and I am then able to shed it.

Seeing how different in character all the spiritual teachers are is a comfort to me--we are truly unique 'fingerprints of god' or unique 'cells in one body' (whatever metaphor works--haha!). One thing that I have become aware of is, that not only do I have a gigantic ego, but I have lost my natural character...

Peeling back the layers, uncovering what has been very safely hidden away in a dark abyss for decades, and then exposing it to the bright light is at once liberating but also a truly uncomfortable/painful process.

Thank you for your reply to my post.

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Re: Apathy

Post by Onceler » Sat May 12, 2018 4:10 pm

I would say you’re in a good spot to transition to The next thing, a different direction.....and it may be spiritual. Condolences regarding your husbands death. I think these are times that can open us or close us, or maybe a little of both. My mother died around four years ago, then my mother in law died two weeks later, then the next day my daughter left for Argentina and my other daughter left for college.

I have found that we don’t have to suffer when we experience sadness or pain, we can simply be sad and pained without the meta emotions/cognitions about our sadness and pain. My freedom from all that came from a simple inquiry method promoted by John Sherman. I discovered this when I took the spiritual break. I did the inquiry which takes several minutes at the most, requires no faith, practice, nor beliefs and things have evolved since than to a life of self-reliance and minimal suffering. If I were to make a spiritual parallel I would compare it to a zen state of minimal suffering and mental turmoil and maximal acceptance of reality as it unfolds. But as I said, I no longer need the hope or promise of spirituality as I have what I need in a richly satisfying, constantly moving and changing life.

This was no easy transition and took a several years to decondition myself from a life of fear and neurosis. We are all different in our evolution, of that I’m certain, and I believe Sherman’s technique is a good stepping off point into that natural human life.

Welcome to the forums, by the way.
Be present, be pleasant.

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Re: Apathy

Post by kiki » Sat May 12, 2018 5:50 pm

Welcome to the community, Niki. My condolences as well on your husband's passing. Webwanderer and Onceler gave excellent responses in this thread.

I really have nothing to add to what they said other than to just be open to life as it unfolds. Any discomfort you are experiencing is understandable as these major changes have presented themselves in your journey. Mind/ego wants surety as to what's next, but there is no surety, and that can be an uncomfortable feeling. Your true essence naturally allows everything to unfold, and it's only the mind/ego that puts up a fuss about it. Becoming comfortable with the unknown gives space for the energy to expend itself, and that will open up a greater sense of freedom for you.

Once again, welcome to our community.

kiki
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
---

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Re: Apathy

Post by Niki » Sat May 12, 2018 9:58 pm

Thank you.

I'm too apathetic to know how to reply...hahaha!!

Sincerely, thank you

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