End Depression Now

Topics related to physical, emotional and psychological forms of pain and suffering

Re: End Depression Now

Postby ib42 » Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:54 am

Depression is. No amount of 'Get over it', make up your mind to be happy', buck up, man' and other- well meaning but useless advice really does any good; actually, it hurts the sufferer even more, because most of us are self-flagellating all the time, anyway. I am 65. I have been depressed for most of my life. I believe it's genetic + inadequate childhood security, in my case at least. A conclusion I have reached several times over due to failure in obtaining permanent relief from all methods and treatments for this anguish. Sometimes I feel a frontal lobotomy may be the only way to end the pain!
There is nothing I haven't tried. AA. For 15 years. psychiatrists and their infuriating prescription- at the- ready attitude, reading constantly, Attempts at meditation, praying (this one turned me into a complete agnostic, if not an atheist), church (saw through the whole organized religion almost instantly),and more.
The only 'way' that has given me pockets of relief from this blackness, this 'cancer of the soul, as someone said somewhere, has been the guidance of the book PON. I just finished 'Stillness speaks', and it was even more of a gift.
Being blisfully happy and fully engaged in life is the obvious way to live, and observing people in general making it seem effortless only increases my sense of failure at the basic art of living. 'They' already have a solid, developed personality which guarantees them a smooth passage through this life. And NO, they are not in denial, unconscious or dysfunctional. Well, not all of them. The tools, skills and abilities to live are sadly denied those like me who exist in a constant state of angst and despair.
I had to say all this, to others on this forum who will understand what i mean.
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby James » Sun Mar 23, 2008 1:46 pm

ib42
That was a beautiful testimonial, thanks for sharing it. You are living proof that the Ego does not have to be a personal problem. How simple it can be.

James
"Awareness is already present, already here, already now; before you try to be more.... In that recognition there's no effort, there's just acknowledgment"..."Awareness is not something you can understand, it's something you are."
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Narayan » Sun Apr 27, 2008 11:34 pm

I like to add some things, since I had a clynical depression 13 years ago which dissolved completely only 4 years ago. I like to 1. describe the state of the person of the depression and then 2. give some hints to people dealing with such the person (friends etc.).

What is clynical depression?

A clynical depression has nothing to do with feeling bad. What actually happens - for whatever reason - is: there is a biochemical imbalance in the brain, which slows thinking and acts like a dimmer to the mind and consiousness. It feels like not being in the life, or to speak in images: standing on a road and seeing life passing you by, without being able to interfere. It feels hopeless and completely empty. There is no energy. It is not possible to change the state by external stimulus.

How to help?

If you have a person as a friend, who is in a depression, please don't try to push him actively or say something like "C'mon, get up and get your stuff together, you will make it". This can't work, because the person is not able to experience it, the way it would be normal.
What you must do, is give the person complete attention and listen to him/her, it is important, that the person can speak his thoughts etc. and gets support. Not to confuse with pushing, understanding and really connecting/believing is the key. This is one thing that can help.
The other thing is right and competent treatment. Anti depressiva and therapy. It takes a lot of time, and progress starts slowly.

How to recognise depression?

A depressed person is not on the peak of it's cognitive functions. He speaks rather slow with a more deep voice. The energy-level is low. The body-language is more "down".
Some people - as I was - are embarresed by their condition and try to act around it. Then it is getting more difficult to see it, only if you knew the person very well or if you are able to to get a really honest conversation and can ask.

That were my experiences and I'm glad I can share them here. If you have any questions, please ask.

I am out of the depression for 4 years now. Funny thing is, I always wasn't sure if my awareness had returned 100%. That I am here today and it is about awareness, that is interesting :)
"Be the change you want to see in this world." - Gandhi | current site: Personal Development that Transforms
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby summer » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:12 am

Webwander wrote
From early childhood the mind incorporated assumptions about who it is. If those assumptions included the now mature unconscious belief: “I am not good enough” or “I can’t do it” or “I am bad” or “I am not loved” or any one of a thousand versions of this, then every success in life will be discounted and every failure will be magnified.


I love the way that you make this distinction, Webwander.

In the typical psychology and self-help books, they would write "From early childhood you have incorporated assumptions about who you are. etc. etc."

Whereas, it is much more helpful to realise that this is who the mind thinks that it is. :)
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Webwanderer » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:51 am

Thanks summer, if one can clearly see how the mind creates a sense of identity, it becomes a little easier to let go of the attributes of that identity as "me", and see it as a constuct through which we interact with the world. Then guilt and judgment lose their power to hold us in a state of perceived unworthiness and separation.
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Jman » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:35 am

I'm in one of my down moods now. Presence just feels like a very tempory block on the minds self flagellation. I try to accept/surrender to the issues but I just feel numb and the issues unresolved, I think I've only ever successfully surrendered once. Going to sleep and not waking up is becoming a comforting thought...

I've felt like my life's stagnated. I felt like something, anything needs to change even if it's for the worse. Things now have got worse with my parents splitting up and I can't help think my own fucked up mind contributed by giving off negative vibes towards one of them even though I tried not to resent them. Im now worried everything's falling into chaos.

I've read alot of about enlightenment, disidentification etc and i believe it intellectually but I haven't experienced the shift ,the background has not become the foreground no matter how much I focus on it :cry:
Whoever knows contentment will be at peace forever. - Tao Te Ching 46
That which offers no resistance, overcomes the hardest substances - Tao Te Ching 43
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby nightowl » Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:24 am

Jman wrote:I've read alot of about enlightenment, disidentification etc and i believe it intellectually but I haven't experienced the shift ,the background has not become the foreground no matter how much I focus on it :cry:
I understand...seriously, I do. Intellectual understanding just doesn't cut it. Here's the thing though...there is no 'it' to focus on.

I find it helps to listen to Tolle or Adyashanti cd's when I'm driving. My ego doesn't stand much of a chance around those two. When you're down, even a you-tube clip can be a huge relief.

You say you've read a lot about enlightenment...try different authors until you find one that resonates. I've started reading Rupert Spira's 'The Transparency of Things.' Eye-opening, to say the least; you might want to give it a go.
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Pennee101 » Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:23 am

webwanderer wrote:
To those on this board who suffer from chronic depression, please respond. You can be free of depression. How can one get free of false assumptions? “Physician, heal thyself.”

The teachings of non-duality are full of pointers, but no one can do anything for you other than point. You are however, made of the same Essential Being that is shared by all. The greatest teachers that have ever lived are not more that you are. They are just free of false beliefs. Get clear on this.


I may be wrong but I kind of read that as as, "I will help you" statement. So if that is true I really want to share a problem I am having.

I have the mental diagnosis of bipolar also. I was very talented as a kid and way over-productive. After graduation from college with highest honors I went onto Wall Street in a very god entry level position. I stayed there for about 5 months and then could not get out of bed. So then after about 4 more months I was ready to try again and I got another good position but the same thing happened. So I started lowering my standards as far as job qualifications go and every time I would either quit or get fired. I finally, after about 4 years ended up in the back of a hardware retail store putting price stickers on products. I quite that job too. It was then that I decided I needed to apply for disability.

So my thoughts are, "I'm fragile" I'm incapable" "I'm disabled" "I'm a failure". I don't feel depression a lot but when you asked that I sat quietly and asked myself and this is what I came up with. I know it affects me in other areas of my life.

So how do I let these feelings go? I am much better than I was back when I went on disability all those years ago. I think I can handle a part time job now.

I hope you or someone sees this post as I know this thread is from 2007. Right now I feel low after thinking about these things. I'm going to do a little bit of breathing and concentrating on the now to get myself centered right now.

Thanks.

Pennee
The Holiest site on Earth is where an Ancient hatred has become a present Love. TCIM
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Pennee101 » Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:18 pm

I have the mental diagnosis of bipolar also. I was very talented as a kid and way over-productive. After graduation from college with highest honors I went onto Wall Street in a very god entry level position. I stayed there for about 5 months and then could not get out of bed. So then after about 4 more months I was ready to try again and I got another good position but the same thing happened. So I started lowering my standards as far as job qualifications go and every time I would either quit or get fired. I finally, after about 4 years ended up in the back of a hardware retail store putting price stickers on products. I quite that job too. It was then that I decided I needed to apply for disability.

So my thoughts are, "I'm fragile" I'm incapable" "I'm disabled" "I'm a failure". I don't feel depression a lot but when you asked that I sat quietly and asked myself and this is what I came up with. I know it affects me in other areas of my life.

So how do I let these feelings go? I am much better than I was back when I went on disability all those years ago. I think I can handle a part time job now.


I'm going to answer myself now as the answer came to me while I was driving home today. It doesn't matter what the story is. All those thoughts are just ego illusions. I could be a successful wall street trader and still have those thoughts because they probably came to me at a much earlier age anyway. It is all a way for the ego to keep me unhappy. It is not the real me. The real me is the God Presence. I can treat these thoughts the same way I treat other ego thoughts and just look at them at well, ego thoughts, and then I have the power to let them go or let them die a natural death.

And part of it is the collective ego, which I have a choice to be a part of or not.

I feel better now.
The Holiest site on Earth is where an Ancient hatred has become a present Love. TCIM
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Webwanderer » Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:35 pm

Wow you dug out an ancient thread.
Pennee101 wrote:I may be wrong but I kind of read that as as, "I will help you" statement. So if that is true I really want to share a problem I am having.

I may be able to point to something I see, but it is upon each of us to take what steps feel right.

So my thoughts are, "I'm fragile" I'm incapable" "I'm disabled" "I'm a failure". I don't feel depression a lot but when you asked that I sat quietly and asked myself and this is what I came up with. I know it affects me in other areas of my life.

So how do I let these feelings go? I am much better than I was back when I went on disability all those years ago. I think I can handle a part time job now...

...Right now I feel low after thinking about these things.

This last line is key to the effect of the thoughts you cited. "I am fragile" "I am incapable" etc. Thinking these thoughts and identifying with them, and with the intense emotional energy that goes with them, tells the universe that this is what you want for yourself. So you attract it as a reality to experience. Consider that right after thinking about them, you began to feel low, and you believed that the thoughts might be true about you.

If they do feel true, it is because you made them feel that way by your focus and belief in them. If this statement is true, then the way out should be clear. Think in ways that make you feel better, more empowered, more in love with life. Think less in ways that bring you down. Our emotions are truly a gift from our Creator. All of them - painful and joyful alike. They are our divine guidance system when it comes to our focus of attention and our experience in life. If you are feeling down, in pain, depressed etc, the message of those feelings is that your focus of attention is generating an experience that creates them.

There is no right or wrong in this, so don't beat yourself up. It's just the way natural law works. So what to do?

The most important matter is to get a sense of your true nature. Tolle's teachings are a good place to get pointers, as are a number of other sources. Mostly it's about getting a sense of who/what you are when thinking is not present. It's not that hard to do with a little practice of being alert to being aware when thoughts and feelings are not the point of attention.

Understand, thoughts and feelings are content withing awareness. You are conscious of them, but you are not them, and they are not you. They are but temporary residents for the purpose of experiencing unique conditions. If you want other conditions to experience, focus on what you want until that focus becomes energized enough to be automatic. In truth, your habitual concerns of failure, fragility and the like are on automatic because they have been energized to be the default condition. But regardless of how long they have been there, they are still only temporary residents that will lose energy and effect as your focus of attention becomes more interested in something else.

See the truth here. You create your experience by the focus of your attention. You choose what any experience, any conditions mean. Two, or twenty, people can be in the same conditions and they will each have unique experiences of the conditions by virtue of what those conditions mean to them. Some will respond automatically through established perspectives, some will choose actively what those events mean and exercise more control over their experience. Is it the end of the world, or an opportunity to engage in? We each get to decide. And we will decide regardless - consciously with intent or unconsciously through existing conditioning.

Be patient, be resolute. It's about creativity on a life scale. There is no failure possible, because it is a cause and effect relationship. Life energy makes no distinctions in energizing that which we focus upon. No doubt in can get painful, but, as I suggested earlier, our feelings are a wonderful gift of guidance. Pay attention to feelings and move your focus and attention to that which you prefer. Surround yourself with beauty - things that bring feelings of happiness and joy. Let go of the focus, as soon as you recognize, feelings that bring you down. Don't be critical of yourself, just move on. Self criticism is just more of the same. Dump it as soon as your recognize it.

You are an extension of God, of Source energy, of Infinite Being. Nothing you can say or do will ever change this. Your pain is a result of believing you are separate and different. It is a disconnect with the truth that your feelings will warn you of, and guide you back into alignment. Unworthiness and failure are only beliefs that can be recognized for what they are and abandoned.

Re-discover the beauty of who you are in silent awareness. Rest in clarity often, many times every day. Explore the love that exists in who/what you are. Life is meant to be beautiful and joyful, and it awaits anyone who will follow their feelings home.

WW
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby heidi » Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:12 pm

Hi Pennee101 and welcome to the forum.
Recently I have been doing some facilitated inquiry of the Scott Kiloby Living Inquiries style. I have found that I am becoming able to "unstick" sticky thoughts and the physical sensations that go with them. Things that took decades to develop, learn and stick, can be unstuck through inquiry. It is a practice, and there's a reason spiritual practices are called practices. When we get present with our thoughts and their accompanying physical sensations, we realize their fleeting and unfindable nature, we realize that everything is momentary and subject to change. Nothing lasts. Nothing sticks. Nothing is actually "findable." :)

Through inquiries I have learned that when something has an emotional "hit" it is because a thought triggers a physical sensation, be it racing of the heart, tightening of the throat, old fight, flight response, etc. When the body responds, it is because a thought - word or picture is linked to a sensation. When we can see these words and pictures for what they really are, merely words and pictures, we are able to allow the sensations to pass on their own, rather than clinging to them and "running with the ball." When we rest as awareness regularly, whatever comes up tends to be met with that understanding and allowed to pass on its own.

When I get a strong emotional hit, I've learned to slow down and just look for the picture - the ghost image that popped through so quickly only my body noticed. So much of the suffering we experience is simply habituated thinking. We are addicted to our thoughts!

When the student is ready, the teacher appears. Over the years I've looked into a lot of spiritual and psychological practices, whether to break a bad habit, quiet my babbling mind, improve health, or the dwell in the openness of presence or whatever... done all sorts of practices from EFT and NLP and all kinds of other "methods" from Vipassana meditation to inquiry, read a gazillion books and watched and listened to myriad CD and videos, and I can recommend what I'm doing right now. I used to have to do everything for myself on my own. So, doing the inquiry with a facilitator has been amazingly powerful and liberating. If you want to look into it, Scott Kiloby has lots of youtube examples of his inquiries.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... fzMnLXeWkw

Here's to your health!
Heidi
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Re: End Depression Now

Postby Salem » Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:14 pm

Pennee101,

I think I've written this somewhere else, but I don't recall where, so I'll state it again for you.

The mind is a product of the body, not an ethereal zone that you have or inhabit or see through. So, by extension, mental illness is also a physical illness, albeit more invisible than more obviously bodily illnesses or injuries.

I didn't see anything you wrote about treatment you might be getting, so my post might be completely unnecessary. Don't fall into the trap of thinking Presence will stop the thoughts. Words like "presence" and "ego" and "painbody" and "Self" and all that are good POINTERS to what "you" are. In reality you are just existence.

That said, don't downplay treatment or medication, if it's necessary. Bodies (and so minds) are organic mixtures, and sometimes chemicals do things that is not preferable. Some people will find that they can leave the meds behind, other people will not be able to due to the individual needs of "their" bodies.

Remember, peace is not happiness or quietness or the absence of pain, although bodies do prefer those usually. Peace is more like the steady flow of the Life that you are, the acceptance of whatever comes up, even if it's disagreeable feelings to a body or mind!

The true You are not doing anything anymore than the sky is doing something when storm clouds or sunlight pass through it.
"The eye through which I see God is the same eye through which God sees me; my eye and God's eye are one eye, one seeing, one knowing, one love." — Meister Eckhart
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