What you resist persists - why?

Manifesting your reality or the Law of Attraction

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby dijmart » Sat Apr 26, 2014 4:37 pm

Onceler wrote:
dijmart wrote:So why does what you resist persist? Because if you are resisting something you are focusing on that thing, event, situation even if it's something you do not want. What you focus upon expands and persists.

Good example- Recently, I had been soooo tired in the past few months, so tired it was all I could think about. Anyways, I apparently had been thinking about it so much it just got worse and worse. I was confused as to what this tiredness meant. I started a thread "tired of the play" and I got some good advice (and some not so good ..drama). Anyways, I decided there was really nothing I could do about this tiredness it had been with me now for so long (months) and I was going to stop thinking about it, low and behold, it's become manageable in the last week. I can say I actually feel better! I may still be tired, but I'm not focusing on it and I'm not creating any "story" around it, it just is what it is.


You put a frame around it and hung it on your wall? Thanks, this helps me think thru some things in my own life. I am noticing this pattern as well.....we certainly do energize situations and states far beyond their natural course.



Yep, and it had a pretty frame and everything :lol: But, seriously, I looked at what I wrote later and thought "Wow, I could substitute anything I'm resisting (pain, loss, ect) within the context of what I wrote and letting it just be, without the story and without projecting it into the future, this made it manageable and suffering has ended.
Take what you like and leave the rest.
User avatar
dijmart
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:35 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Onceler » Sat Apr 26, 2014 8:18 pm

I'm going to sound like Ashley77 here for a moment, but that's not a bad thing, and suggest that its not about resistance at all....I recently read a simple article that has really got me thinking about a lot of things. It basically said that the left prefrontal cortex has one job and it does it very well: to find evidence to validate whatever we are thinking. It works 24/7 to find examples from memory or life to validate what we are thinking about.

Example (hypothetical, of course): I'm so tired, why am I so tired? I feel I will never have energy again, etc. Your LPFC went into to overdrive to obediently gather evidence that validated your tiredness. All the times you felt tired, comparing your current state with past energy states, and maybe even creating situations that nudged up the fatigue factor....eating more poorly, sleeping less well, etc. When our brains are in this mode, I think we have a hard time getting out of the cognitive rut, until, if in the groove long enough, our actual tissue begins to adapt to the thought patterns, and our environment shifts subtly to align with our thinking. Of, course the opposite is true. Think 'positive' thoughts and the LPFC will go gather evidence as to why these thoughts are valid.

The LPFC has to be disrupted somehow. Questioning validity of thoughts, increasing cognitive awareness, shifting attention to breathing (or anything else neutral or positive). So it sounds alike you made a conscious effort to question or disrupt....in fact I would go so far as to say we may need to "resist" this negative train track and make an effort to shift or question our cognitive process.

This has opened up an even broader range of questioning for me, which, thankfully I won't go into now, but I really am questioning [i]everything/i] in a way I hadn't before....especially the endless loops of spiritual discussion and queries. From a left pre-frontal cortex point of view, which is simply grey matter set to certain algorithmic standards, we can validate anything. Including.....our particular twist on non-dualism-tolle, advaita, being, fill in the blank.....but it is not necessarily truth, just the sweaty little LPFC validating our thinking robotically.

Living begins when we disconnect the LPFC, or at least mute the effects.

Here is a link the article I referred to:

http://goodmenproject.com/the-good-life ... o-forgive/
Be present, be pleasant.
User avatar
Onceler
 
Posts: 2198
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:35 am
Location: My house

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby bf2 » Sat Apr 26, 2014 9:56 pm

starting wrote:Carl Jung was the first who said "What you resist persists"
Then, the Universal Law, the LOA...so why?

The Universe gives you more of what you are focusing on, so if you want a "X" situation in your life, of course you do not want a "Y" situation. So, the Universe should respond by saying ok, I will give you more "X" situation. So, why the Universe is always giving you the "Y" situation (what you do not want)?

I think this is really funny btw, he (the Universe) is always giving you what you do not want, even if you want a lot of things? :?
Thank you for your comments.


Is there an alternative? What do you think would happen if whatever we resisted immediately melted away? That would be the same as we all getting exactly what we want, when
we want. Do you think the universe would last two seconds with that system?
bf2
 
Posts: 52
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 8:28 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Enlightened2B » Sat Apr 26, 2014 10:49 pm

Onceler wrote:
This has opened up an even broader range of questioning for me, which, thankfully I won't go into now, but I really am questioning [i]everything/i] in a way I hadn't before....especially the endless loops of spiritual discussion and queries. From a left pre-frontal cortex point of view, which is simply grey matter set to certain algorithmic standards, we can validate anything. Including.....our particular twist on non-dualism-tolle, advaita, being, fill in the blank.....but it is not necessarily truth, just the sweaty little LPFC validating our thinking robotically.

Living begins when we disconnect the LPFC, or at least mute the effects.


Awesome Post Onceler.

I think you hit on an incredibly important subject matter. I'm in the same boat as you. I've started opening myself up to more 'research' pertaining to this stuff scientifically speaking as well and it's definitely changed my outlook as well. For a long time, I was 100 percent dead set on the idea that my nature was something 'beyond' the brain and never really gave much thought that perhaps, all of the answers lie WITHIN the brain. I'm still not 100 percent sold that the brain is the ultimate answer to consciousness because I think there are just to many unanswered questions, such as those in QM, but I've now accepted that what I previously took as 'truth' (being my true nature) is merely one interpretation of reality.

I feel that the only way to be honest with ourselves is to open ourselves up to all possible interpretations and research without clinging too tightly to any one interpretation nor claiming it as 'truth'.

Good stuff
Enlightened2B
 
Posts: 1885
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 10:51 pm
Location: New York

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby dijmart » Sat Apr 26, 2014 11:16 pm

I think mood imbalances, some mental illness and thinking "patterns" can be a brain issue from chemical imbalances, limbic system issues, negative/positive feedback loops and such. However, I do not think I'm just this brain and nothing beyond that. I know there is a lot to explore in the scientific realm of things, it's just not my thang, because I know, for me, there is more to it and that is where my focus of interest lies.
Take what you like and leave the rest.
User avatar
dijmart
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:35 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby KathleenBrugger » Sat Apr 26, 2014 11:21 pm

Onceler wrote:I'm going to sound like Ashley77 here for a moment, but that's not a bad thing, and suggest that its not about resistance at all....I recently read a simple article that has really got me thinking about a lot of things. It basically said that the left prefrontal cortex has one job and it does it very well: to find evidence to validate whatever we are thinking. It works 24/7 to find examples from memory or life to validate what we are thinking about.

Thanks for posting the article, Onceler, that was fascinating. In psychology they refer to this as the "confirmation bias," where we look in the world for evidence to confirm our beliefs. Sounds like neuroscience is now showing the mechanism in the brain that produces the bias, and also why it would have evolved. I think knowing these things can helps to disconnect the LPFC. And reinforce the wisdom of questioning our thoughts.

E2B--I agree that the brain isn't 100% of what consciousness is...but it's good to know what's going on!
We are ALL Innocent by Reason of Insanity
http://kathleenbrugger.blogspot.com/
User avatar
KathleenBrugger
 
Posts: 604
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2013 5:18 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Onceler » Sat Apr 26, 2014 11:53 pm

Yeah, Enlightened2B and dijmart, I'm not ready to go all scienetific either, but our brains are real and are they not the first boundary of the mind? I'm not saying gray matter is all there is, but it's a place to start. The brain is the modem connected to the mysterious and in turn projects a localized wifi (intelligent consciousness?) to our bodies (and those around us). Perhaps spiritual wisdom was simply a very sophisticated, pre-scientific method of explaining what science is beginning to do.... We can lost in the conceptual and abstract, just like we can get lost in the minutiae of science without realizing there is a whole forest which science doesn't have a clue about. Is scientific debate and inquiry any different than the dreary, endless nattering about being, ego, self, rebirth, states of consciousness, enlightenment,etc ? Sorry, folks, but....really (I am, of course, including myself in this criticism.....over 1400 posts about, what?)

To me, technologies of science are as specious as technologies of religion; prayer, meditation, yoga, inquiry.....they all give about the same results, some clarity, but mostly greater confusion and questions.
Be present, be pleasant.
User avatar
Onceler
 
Posts: 2198
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:35 am
Location: My house

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Enlightened2B » Sun Apr 27, 2014 12:28 am

Onceler,

I think it's a great topic to discuss and I'm really glad you posted what you did. Our brains are most CERTAINLY real. I cringe at some of the stuff I tend to read pertaining to spirituality on this board and other places. There's a lot of 'mind' stuff where people believe they have live by a certain set of 'teachings' and then the teachings just get regurgitated back as if they are 'truths'. I know that I too, have been a culprit of some of this since I joined this site.

Granted, what I see as more sensible and often backed up by many Quantum Physicists now is that Consciousness or the 'Mysterious Being' IS the ultimate reality (Unified Field) and as you indicated, the brain is more of a 'modem' or 'computer' of sorts, yet it still doesn't change the fact that we are essentially biological physical organisms and each of us are incredibly biochemically unique beings. I like physicist Tom Campbell's approach to this by indicating that we essentially live in a 'virtual reality' and the brain is just that....a computer of sorts that dictates how we live our lives. But, the big thing is that we STILL live in this reality and that's why it makes all the sense in the world to better understand it by talking about things like neuro research and other areas of study of the physical world. I love science and love talking about it.

The way I look at it now as that I embrace our humanness and embrace every aspect of the physical world while understanding that perhaps we are CONNECTED to the greater source of being (Unified Field/consciousness/intelligence) as opposed to bypassing reality and saying I AM that greater source of being which is unfortunately what spiritual bypassing essentially is.

It's the same analogy with the 'wave' and the 'water'. We can say our nature is the 'water' (whatever that may really be), or that we are essentially COMPOSED of the water, but we are still existing merely as 'waves'.
Enlightened2B
 
Posts: 1885
Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 10:51 pm
Location: New York

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby runstrails » Sun Apr 27, 2014 1:33 am

Onceler wrote: It basically said that the left prefrontal cortex has one job and it does it very well: to find evidence to validate whatever we are thinking. It works 24/7 to find examples from memory or life to validate what we are thinking about.


Actually the Left Prefrontal Cortex does a lot of things like processing semantic aspects of language, memory type things, executive function, decision making. LPFC has been implicated in neuroimaging studies of feelings of happiness. Richie Davidson's studies on tibetan monks performing loving kindness meditations also showed activation in LPFC, if I recall correctly. In the article you linked, I could not find a reference or a study that was cited so it was hard to know what exactly they were saying. I wish they had. In general, I wish spiritual sites that talk about science did a better job of sourcing their material. It would lend more credibility. For example, Gary Weber's site does a nice job of it.

As a neuroscientist, I'm delighted at the interest in neuroscience and spirituality, of course :D. Although to be honest, personally I don't think that the ultimate mystery of consciousness can be figured out by examining brain activations. Although a colleague did tell me that when some of his patients underwent TMS stimulation in the temporal lobe, they had out-of-body experiences :roll:. But I don't think he's published it yet. Ultimately, a human's interpretation of everything is dependent on his/her brain. The brain in effect creates reality. But it is also part of the same reality that it creates :roll:. That to me is the most mind boggling part!

Anyway, thanks for starting a fun discussion, Onceler.
runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2123
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby dijmart » Sun Apr 27, 2014 1:50 am

runstrails wrote:
As a neuroscientist, I'm delighted at the interest in neuroscience and spirituality, of course :D. Although to be honest, personally I don't think that the ultimate mystery of consciousness can be figured out by examining brain activations.


Well, what could be more appropriate to the discussion, then a neuroscientist chiming in, who is also a moderator on a E.T. forum.
Take what you like and leave the rest.
User avatar
dijmart
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:35 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Onceler » Sun Apr 27, 2014 6:28 am

Thanks, Runstrails, I did wonder at the efficacy of the research presented. I think it's safe to say that some part of the brain functions in this manner in most people......
Be present, be pleasant.
User avatar
Onceler
 
Posts: 2198
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:35 am
Location: My house

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby dijmart » Sun Apr 27, 2014 7:07 am

Onceler wrote:Thanks, Runstrails, I did wonder at the efficacy of the research presented. I think it's safe to say that some part of the brain functions in this manner in most people......


Hi Onceler,
You are now being a bit vague, saying some part of the brain functions in "this" manner, what manner?
How can it be safe to say?
and how do you know it's this way in most people?

I know it sounds like I'm harassing you, but actually if you're creating a belief, then I just think you should have clarity about it, that's all. Clearly, the article didn't have references, therefore can't be considered creditable.

also I didn't get what you meant :)
Take what you like and leave the rest.
User avatar
dijmart
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:35 pm

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby ashley72 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 11:44 am

runstrails wrote: Ultimately, a human's interpretation of everything is dependent on his/her brain. The brain in effect creates reality. But it is also part of the same reality that it creates :roll:. That to me is the most mind boggling part!


The brain does not create reality, it merely maps reality via pattern recognition (neurons). My brain does not create a tree or a flower. Those environments exist independently of my human brain and neurons.

This video on Artificial Intelligence explains how to build machine learning algorithms that simulate the way perception works in a human brain using computers.

http://youtu.be/AY4ajbu_G3k

If every human being we're extinct on planet earth, machine learning algorithms would still perceive/recognize the trees and the flowers independently of humans or not.

Reality has absolutely nothing to do with human brains!

Consciousness is not universal or primary. A machine can be conscious of itself and objects in its environment. That video above shows how they have already built machines which can recognize objects like coffee cups and get machines to go through buildings locating all the coffee cups left by people in rooms and collecting them. A machine needs to be conscious of coffee cups for that to occur... It is a low level of consciousness... But still conscious of objects in its environment.

Here is an example of a robot that can understand a person asking it to fetch a stapler....Stanford Robot demo fairly amazing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhhJKeyOSGU
User avatar
ashley72
 
Posts: 2533
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 3:24 am

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Onceler » Sun Apr 27, 2014 1:58 pm

dijmart wrote:
Onceler wrote:Thanks, Runstrails, I did wonder at the efficacy of the research presented. I think it's safe to say that some part of the brain functions in this manner in most people......


Hi Onceler,
You are now being a bit vague, saying some part of the brain functions in "this" manner, what manner?
How can it be safe to say?
and how do you know it's this way in most people?

I know it sounds like I'm harassing you, but actually if you're creating a belief, then I just think you should have clarity about it, that's all. Clearly, the article didn't have references, therefore can't be considered creditable.

also I didn't get what you meant :)



You're right. I realize it has meaning for me and I'm embarrassed that I tried to communicate that meaning in a broader sense as truth. I inadvertently made my own point. I went out and collected evidence that proved the article true in my own life. It seems so clear........my own own personal experience, the kids I work with etc. I initiated a new schema into reality, effortlessly. All the evidence is there, if we look for it. (That's the manner or mechanism I meant, the brains/minds function of validating thoughts).

It's interesting that we immediately hold some ideas to a different standard......if it's in the empirical realm, which is simply a way of categorizing info, we hold the idea to research and truth, if it's an ancient spiritual construct from thousands of years ago which probably has been so changed and distorted from the original that it might be unrecognizable, we argue it's validity fervently without regard for some empirical evidence. We can't even operationalize the terms; enlightenment, ego, etc.
Last edited by Onceler on Sun Apr 27, 2014 3:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Be present, be pleasant.
User avatar
Onceler
 
Posts: 2198
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 1:35 am
Location: My house

Re: What you resist persists - why?

Postby Phil2 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 2:08 pm

ashley72 wrote:A machine can be conscious of itself and objects in its environment. That video above shows how they have already built machines which can recognize objects like coffee cups and get machines to go through buildings locating all the coffee cups left by people in rooms and collecting them. A machine needs to be conscious of coffee cups for that to occur... It is a low level of consciousness... But still conscious of objects in its environment.


A machine is just programmed to recognize objects according to shapes and patterns, it does not mean it is aware ...

Awareness does not arise out of matter ... awareness is unborn ... formless and timeless ...

Did you happen to read Eckhart Tolle maybe ?

??
"What irritates us about others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves"
(Carl Jung)
Phil2
 
Posts: 1379
Joined: Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:24 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Law of Attraction

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron