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Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:27 pm
by smiileyjen101
Maybe I can just go through all the threads dropping this little quote from Conversations with God 3 ... (sorry for the double dropping, it seems fitting in response to hanss above)

"My purpose is to evolve, not to condemn;
to grow, not to die;
to experience, not to fail to experience.
My purpose is to Be, not to cease to Be. "


Evolve, grow, experience, Be... YUM!!

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 5:28 pm
by Sighclone
hanss -

Regarding "spiritual bypassing" (getting zoned out on the Absolute), please read John Welwood's fine article here:
http://www.johnwelwood.com/articlesandinterviews.htm It is the one on "Embodying your realization". He has other writings on this subject also.

You might also like the CD available on Adya's website titled "The Journey after Awakening." Or Tim Freke's "How Long is Now." There is room for fun in all of this, and yes, just drop the whole enchilada for as long as you need to. If it remains something important, it will return.

Andy

PS - I'm going to stop jabbering about LoA until I read the Abraham-Hicks material...thanks for everyone's many fine posts!

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:24 pm
by hanss
smiileyjen101 wrote:Have you read webby's latest nde account?

Yes. And today I have also read your long nde-thread. Most questions are gone, thanks. About the electricty, it's nice that my el.engineering background is coming to "real" use (not boring jobs and income) and I can understand the "vibrational universe" when you explain it in those terms :)

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:27 pm
by hanss
Sighclone wrote:....Regarding "spiritual bypassing" ...

I have read the first part and that is exactly what I mean. Thank you for the link.

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 12:29 am
by smiileyjen101
One of the things I like with LOA is the attitude and message "Life should be fun". I have changed that to "Life should and can be enjoyed". It's funny how this mind works. I have listened to many old Satsang recordings with Adya and very often he ends them with "Enjoy yourselves". I have never "heard" it if you understand what I mean. Now I do. Next week, I don't know


Try taking the 'should' out of it ... Life can be enjoyed - ET's pointer that enjoying is not taking joy from 'something' (separate from you) but pouring your joy into 'something' (that is at one with you).

From this perspective there is no thing accepted that you cannot pour joy into.

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 12:39 am
by smiileyjen101
About the electricty, it's nice that my el.engineering background is coming to "real" use (not boring jobs and income) and I can understand the "vibrational universe" when you explain it in those terms :)


It's also nice that my communication background is coming to 'real' use (never boring jobs and I'm grateful for the income) and through learning the theory for a project on electrical safety I can understand the 'el.engineering' enough to explain it in those terms. :D

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:27 pm
by powerbowler
If you think of all that man has accomplished , flight , transportation , communication, all these things were first a thought in someone's mind , seemingly impossible at the time of the thought , now a reality. The law of attraction has always been there ,
we have always been creators of our reality for good or bad. The problem i see with the law of attraction is getting it confused with the power of the will. The law of attraction as ET describes it, is a natural progression from being in the Now . The law of attraction as described by some others is willing things to be the way you want . Hitler used the power of Will. Spiritual men and women use the power of Now.

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:45 pm
by Sighclone
Nice point, powerbowler...the question remains, did Hitler's technique use the same mechanism as claimed by the LoA advocates? Or was his deal something way different, and if so, what is the precise difference. That is, did Hitler's success using willpower invoke or link up with some cosmic "law of attraction?" If so, can the LoA be used to create all kinds of suffering when used by those who are not in touch with Presence, because it is just a pulse of added energy when big thoughts (of any content) are really focussed and repeated. I've ordered the Hicks book, so maybe I'll know more later...

Andy

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:19 am
by powerbowler
I have never seen so many threads and posts about one subject [ the law of attraction ] . Eckhart Tolle brought out a wonderful , simple , inspired book explaining fully how we can find peace and contentment , this discussion community is a testament to how deeply we were touched by this book The Power of Now. But what has happened ? yes we love The Power of Now , but [now] we need just one more thing and then we would be happy . If you only had this one book in your possession you would have all that you need. The Law of Attraction might bring you what you want. The Power of Now will bring you what you need. When you use the law of attraction when do you stop wanting? If Hitler had been content in 1941 to stop when he controlled all of Europe , history may have been written very differently , but he wanted more.
The law of attraction is a real force in the universe that can be used by all , good or bad , it can be a creative or a destructive force.
The Power of Now is all that is required it encompasses the law of attraction naturally.

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 2:36 pm
by Webwanderer
powerbowler wrote:When you use the law of attraction when do you stop wanting?

The thing about wanting however, is that it seems to be natural to the human experience. One might argue that it's the Creative urge expressing itself. We picked up The Power of Now or A New Earth because of a want for clarity, or alinement, or awakening, or something. Want in human terms may well be the driver for the evolution of consciousness. This evolution may be conscious or unconscious, but the experience of following our wants offers endless feedback on the effects of their pursuit.

Much of it is simple trial and error. We may not understand that what we want may not be in our, or others, best interest. But careful attention to the effects can reveal much about our priorities and efforts. Not paying close attention can lead to increased pain and suffering, but that's the nature of a life system base on cause and effect. Eventually our pain will make us look elsewhere in how we engage life.

LoA makes achieving our wants more effective by aligning them with the power of Source. The misunderstood value of LoA however, is not so much in achieving some material desire, but rather the alignment with Source. And that is what ET points to in PoN as presence awareness. In the clarity of presence awareness, the quality of our interests is raised. How can one not be moved to enhanced desires when aligned with our Essential Being? Our interests become less about stuff and more about love and compassion.

WW

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 4:58 pm
by powerbowler
Thanks for your reply Webwanderer, the reason many of us post is because we need our thoughts clarified or at least a new perspective put on our thoughts , and you have done that for me, thankyou.
I have been going to a Science of Mind meeting most Sundays and started to question the rightness of what is being said , what you said made perfect sense to me , i will persevere and see where it leads, but i am very thankful that i read Eckhart Tolle first .

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 5:39 pm
by Sighclone
How can one not be moved to enhanced desires when aligned with our Essential Being? Our interests become less about stuff and more about love and compassion.


Surely true.

So, the LoA becomes an activation catalyst for manifesting, a kind of nitrous boost for the normal engine of creation? If so, and I'm not suggesting otherwise, as an utter novice, I'm curious about how that works. Will I learn that from the Abraham-Hicks material, or can I just channel ol' Abe myself? (Yup, me being skeptical of this channeling thing...)

Andy

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 7:52 pm
by Webwanderer
Sighclone wrote:So, the LoA becomes an activation catalyst for manifesting, a kind of nitrous boost for the normal engine of creation? If so, and I'm not suggesting otherwise, as an utter novice, I'm curious about how that works. Will I learn that from the Abraham-Hicks material, or can I just channel ol' Abe myself? (Yup, me being skeptical of this channeling thing...)

Skepticism is surely a healthy filter of un-experienced information. Cynicism, not so much. Of course the litmus test for channeling is the same as anything we might read in a book, even PoN. What is our direct sense of it? Do we gain in clarity, or does it muddy the water? Abraham is said to be a channeled group of entities. He/she is certainly not the first in that endeavor. What, after all, is the information contained in Conversations with God if not channeled.

There are scores, if not hundreds of channeled sources out there. If life does indeed exist beyond our human experience, and the reports of the NDE'ers holds some truth about the vastness of life beyond, why would it be such a stretch that someone deeply and clearly in presence awareness, aligned with Core energy, would not be able to be a conduit for some non-physical consciousness interested in helping those struggling in human form. Are we not one after all?

I think most of us can relate to writing or speaking some insightful truth that upon our relating it, is the first we've heard of it - insight that seems to come through us but not from us. Could this not be a type of channeling as well? My sense is that channeling is authentic based on the quality of information that comes through. That's not to say every channel is of the highest quality. It may be that there is an influence from the channel that can distort some of the information. I think the later books of the Conversations With God series are an example of Walsh's own influence on the material, and lacked the authenticity of the the first book.

No doubt, Andy, you will do you homework with due diligence. Let the truth be what it is, whatever that may be. Meanwhile, you may want to look into the scores of YouTubes from Abraham-Hicks. Some are better than others, but I think you can get a good sense of what he/she is about.

WW

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:14 pm
by snowheight
Webwanderer wrote:Skepticism is surely a healthy filter of un-experienced information. Cynicism, not so much. Of course the litmus test for channeling is the same as anything we might read in a book, even PoN. What is our direct sense of it? Do we gain in clarity, or does it muddy the water?


Your point about cynicism is well-taken -- in the abstract, this is always just a counter-belief, a knee-jerk negation of a belief.

But can a completely subjective litmus test ever lay the basis for a claim to skepticism? Skepticism, with respect to the super-natural, in the end, is something that fails in that the application of skepticism as a practice requires an objective point of view. Scientists have reached the point where they recognize that such points of view are artificial and limited. Skepticism can be applied if a set of definitions and ground-rules are first laid down. We can agree that there is an earth and things raised above it will fall back to it and Galileo can test our skepticism as to his claim that all things, no matter how big or small, will fall with some uniformity. That is skepticism.

But if you or I or anyone decides that someone else has channeled whatever it is that is beyond the material, then the only thing left to question is our own personal and subjective understanding and application of what has been channeled.

For example, based on my personal experience, Tolle seems to have channeled something in three of his books and in his talks. He makes it easy for me to come to this conclusion as he constantly disclaims the notion that he is asking me to believe anything that he is saying. Just as you recommend above, he recommends that I test anything that he is saying by experiencing it and further disclaims that I can understand it with my mind.

But this LoA is something that wraps around the concept of our recognition of our true nature, which is beyond understanding of the mind, and layers over with a message that apparently can be understood with the mind.

Now my conclusion and yours about this understanding is different, but because there is this issue of whether or not the message is channeled, we can't rely on any sort of artificial objective framework from which we can apply the practice of skeptical consideration.

So it looks like there is some other term that might apply, but skepticism doesn't. There is no debate here, only a decision to be made as to how to react to the subjective experience of another perspective.

Re: Combining E. Tolle and Law of Attraction into one philos

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:36 pm
by Sighclone
Tim Freke is also very skeptical about channeled sources. If these beings are out there, he says, why don't they just pick him, or at least one or two or three others to "speak" their stuff, since there are these skeptics. It's always a one-to-one deal...one special entity, one special person...

That said, some profound truths can be felt or heard, perhaps by anyone. Why does some entity name like Seth have to be added?

Andy