What made me wake up was the state of shock....

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What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:20 pm

It was the so called "state of shock", i had a "block", have you ever heard of it?? Fear paralized me that i couldn't talk anymore, move....nothing. Facing this "shock", i reached the neverending NOW, i woke up to the present moment...It's all.
Have you ever heard of this "state of emotional shock"?? Many oriental philosophies claim that one of the ways which lead to enlightment is the healing of a trauma (mine was a very big trauma).
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby ashley72 » Fri Apr 05, 2013 5:57 pm

Also called acute stress reaction or psychological shock.

Generlized Anxiety sufferers have these acute reactions frequently... Particular when they start facing the feared scenarios they may have been psychological dreading.

Recently I started confronting avoided scenarios where the nervous system went into overdrive. As long as you're willing to submit yourself to the psychological shock, you will start seeing the acute cycle with great clarity. Most sufferers avoid fully or partially, so they stay trapped in the recursive psychological state.

It's fascinating watching the flurry of thoughts which arise, usually with a strong sense of self, & self-conscious in nature. The battle is trying to bring the attention back onto the tasks at hand whilst simultanteously observing the constant stream of avoidance attached to low self esteem without "identifying" with a defeated self image...

You need to become the silent observer!

It can be done, the old self image needs to be discarded...I've punched through many psychological barriers by confronting the illusions of a poor self image. But like you say the fear can be paralysing, to the point where the thinking becomes so rapid that its like a white noise & scrambled. You can't talk and it seems like the whole nervous system is haywire.

The conundrum here of course, is the psychological self doesn't want to be embarrassed by looking weak & having a nervous system meltdowns in front of others, particular family & friends. This was the conundrum I faced, which kept the vicious cycle going.

The main thing to realise is that the fear-response is a perfectly normal reaction to feared stimulus. Through the release of adrenaline and to a lesser extent noradrenaline from the medulla of the adrenal glands. These catecholamine hormones facilitate immediate physical reactions by triggering increases in heart rate and breathing, constricting blood vessels. These reactions can become so intense that you can become momentarily paralysed by the fear.

But the good news is you don't die or go crazy. You eventually return to a normal state once the fear stimuli is avoided, faced etc.

If the fear is delusional i.e not a man-eating lion charging at you on the plains of the Serengeti, you should properly face it head on. If you don't face delusional fears, you become trapped by their persistent illusions. :wink:
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby Sighclone » Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:20 am

Lovely, meaningful, candid, self-effacing and complete, ashley -- thank you.

Whoever told you to adopt a low self-image needs to read some of your fine posts on this forum. Over the years, it has become quite clear to me that a healthy egoic-self-image is necessary to finally drop it completely...just another odd paradox in nonduality.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Sat Apr 06, 2013 6:52 pm

ashley72 wrote:Also called acute stress reaction or psychological shock.

Generlized Anxiety sufferers have these acute reactions frequently... Particular when they start facing the feared scenarios they may have been psychological dreading.

Recently I started confronting avoided scenarios where the nervous system went into overdrive. As long as you're willing to submit yourself to the psychological shock, you will start seeing the acute cycle with great clarity. Most sufferers avoid fully or partially, so they stay trapped in the recursive psychological state.

It's fascinating watching the flurry of thoughts which arise, usually with a strong sense of self, & self-conscious in nature. The battle is trying to bring the attention back onto the tasks at hand whilst simultanteously observing the constant stream of avoidance attached to low self esteem without "identifying" with a defeated self image...

You need to become the silent observer!

It can be done, the old self image needs to be discarded...I've punched through many psychological barriers by confronting the illusions of a poor self image. But like you say the fear can be paralysing, to the point where the thinking becomes so rapid that its like a white noise & scrambled. You can't talk and it seems like the whole nervous system is haywire.

The conundrum here of course, is the psychological self doesn't want to be embarrassed by looking weak & having a nervous system meltdowns in front of others, particular family & friends. This was the conundrum I faced, which kept the vicious cycle going.

The main thing to realise is that the fear-response is a perfectly normal reaction to feared stimulus. Through the release of adrenaline and to a lesser extent noradrenaline from the medulla of the adrenal glands. These catecholamine hormones facilitate immediate physical reactions by triggering increases in heart rate and breathing, constricting blood vessels. These reactions can become so intense that you can become momentarily paralysed by the fear.

But the good news is you don't die or go crazy. You eventually return to a normal state once the fear stimuli is avoided, faced etc.

If the fear is delusional i.e not a man-eating lion charging at you on the plains of the Serengeti, you should properly face it head on. If you don't face delusional fears, you become trapped by their persistent illusions. :wink:

Thank you for your answer Ashley, but i think you didn't properly read my post.
I said that i faced it, i overcame it, and that's what made me "wake up", fortunately. Those were terrible years to me, and now there's just an ancient memory.
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby ashley72 » Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:41 pm

Imago dei,

Hi There.

I was just trying to expand on your initial post.

When I came here a few years ago, I was a confused sufferer searching for answers. :wink:

The "paralysing fear" you refer to was something that I was dealing with on a daily basis. Unfortunately, not every suffer wakes up after experiencing this state of shock, many use avoidance strategies that merely strengthen & prolong the suffering.

It's only when you start to embrace the fear, with utter acceptance... that a sufferer actually breaks the cycle of psychological fear. Until you're willing to do that, paralysing fear will be your companion.

Andy said: Whoever told you to adopt a low self-image needs to read some of your fine posts on this forum. Over the years, it has become quite clear to me that a healthy egoic-self-image is necessary to finally drop it completely...just another odd paradox in nonduality.


Andy,

Firstly, thanks for recent encouragement & kind words.

The low self-esteem came from the way I had been identifying with some major turn of events in my life. It's only now I'm starting to see them as growing pains rather than failures. :D

I had a big ego, and that big ego couldn't accept it's altered image or life story. I dreaded facing people who would see my fall from grace or loss of status. Even to this day.... Ego death or loss of face is a very painful process to endure... particular when you've spent your whole life doing everything in your power to keep face.
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby Sighclone » Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:27 pm

This is all the more reason you are such a valuable contributor here. Your face is ennobled here by the quality of your expression, your deep reading, your essential care for the purpose of the forum, and your amusing Harding-inspired self portrait avatar. "Face" of course, is public image. I read somewhere once that we are integrated and stable to the extent that our self-image and our public image are congruent. Jeepers, if we begin to Self-realize, we lose identification with the "little-me" egoic self. Of course, it was through the eyes of that egoic self that we saw our public image, and through the mind of that egoic self that we projected it. Maybe our public image won't have the same appearance, and maybe that is a good thing.

Who really knows what your public image is as received by another individual? You can be misshapen, loud and rude, and know it. But the moment you stoop to help a child, you have become an angel. The qualities which add to public-image are usually pretty shallow, and striving to achieve within that set of standards elevates the standards. Didn't Eckhart's favorite professor commit suicide shortly after receiving some award? Maybe there is another way.

Andy
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There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:44 pm

ashley72 wrote:Imago dei,

Hi There.

I was just trying to expand on your initial post.

When I came here a few years ago, I was a confused sufferer searching for answers. :wink:

The "paralysing fear" you refer to was something that I was dealing with on a daily basis. Unfortunately, not every suffer wakes up after experiencing this state of shock, many use avoidance strategies that merely strengthen & prolong the suffering.

It's only when you start to embrace the fear, with utter acceptance... that a sufferer actually breaks the cycle of psychological fear. Until you're willing to do that, paralysing fear will be your companion.

Andy said: Whoever told you to adopt a low self-image needs to read some of your fine posts on this forum. Over the years, it has become quite clear to me that a healthy egoic-self-image is necessary to finally drop it completely...just another odd paradox in nonduality.


Andy,

Firstly, thanks for recent encouragement & kind words.

The low self-esteem came from the way I had been identifying with some major turn of events in my life. It's only now I'm starting to see them as growing pains rather than failures. :D

I had a big ego, and that big ego couldn't accept it's altered image or life story. I dreaded facing people who would see my fall from grace or loss of status. Even to this day.... Ego death or loss of face is a very painful process to endure... particular when you've spent your whole life doing everything in your power to keep face.

I understand your point, and i find very interesting what yoy say, and i know the truth of your words coz i experienced it on my skin. Well, since that state of shock is hell on earth, the overcoming of it equals to heaven.
I cannot understand how can people avoid fear and renounce to live....they're living deads, just like i was since 4 years ago. I'm "afraid" i'm invincible now, though.
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:48 pm

Sighclone wrote:This is all the more reason you are such a valuable contributor here. Your face is ennobled here by the quality of your expression, your deep reading, your essential care for the purpose of the forum, and your amusing Harding-inspired self portrait avatar. "Face" of course, is public image. I read somewhere once that we are integrated and stable to the extent that our self-image and our public image are congruent. Jeepers, if we begin to Self-realize, we lose identification with the "little-me" egoic self. Of course, it was through the eyes of that egoic self that we saw our public image, and through the mind of that egoic self that we projected it. Maybe our public image won't have the same appearance, and maybe that is a good thing.

Who really knows what your public image is as received by another individual? You can be misshapen, loud and rude, and know it. But the moment you stoop to help a child, you have become an angel. The qualities which add to public-image are usually pretty shallow, and striving to achieve within that set of standards elevates the standards. Didn't Eckhart's favorite professor commit suicide shortly after receiving some award? Maybe there is another way.

Andy

What kind of terrible story is it?? How the hell can one commit suicide?? He must have been so far away from the Now and self-realization, don't you think??
I dunno what my face communicates, but i'm sure i'm a beautiful person and it's clearly visible, i have very sensitive eyes, i'm emphatic and not ruled by the ego....How can anyone renounce to this state of grace with killing himself?? I'm afraid he never knew real state of grace...
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby Sighclone » Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:44 pm

I have no idea what kinds of demons the professor faced - the story is in the first thirty pages of The Power of Now. I cannot know what was best for him, including the option of suicide. Absent the ability to live his life, I refrain from judging his decisions. I certainly agree it seems extreme, however.

And yes, ET included it as an example to himself how far from peace both he and the professor were.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:05 pm

Sighclone wrote:I have no idea what kinds of demons the professor faced - the story is in the first thirty pages of The Power of Now. I cannot know what was best for him, including the option of suicide. Absent the ability to live his life, I refrain from judging his decisions. I certainly agree it seems extreme, however.

And yes, ET included it as an example to himself how far from peace both he and the professor were.

Andy

In the version of PON that i bought there is not this story about the professor...I read that Tolle himself was close to suicide many times, but not about this "professor"....
I'm sure that anyone who has "discovered" the power of the present moment could never do such a terrible act against himself nor against any other being....I would never kill myself, even if in the past i even thought about it as option, when i was extremely desperate.
Anyway, in my own case, that terrible "state of shock" made me wake up....at the end that experience was the best i could ever have!!
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby Sighclone » Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:25 am

Sorry -- professor story is on p. 34 of "A New Earth."

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:03 pm

Sighclone wrote:Sorry -- professor story is on p. 34 of "A New Earth."

Andy

It doesn't matter anyway, whoever this professor is.....i'm just sure that a person like that never really discovered the wonder of the present moment, don't you think??! He must have been a real victim of the pain body...
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby ashley72 » Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:58 pm

imago dei wrote:I cannot understand how can people avoid fear and renounce to live....they're living deads, just like i was since 4 years ago. I'm "afraid" i'm invincible now, though.


Sufferers try and avoid the "state of shock" or first fear, because of second fear. Second fear is the little voice in the head which tries to convince the sufferer that avoidance is the best strategy for overcoming first fear.

It's only when a sufferer stops listening to the little voice in the head, and begins to utterly accept & embrace the first fear (unwanted physical sensations or discomfort)... body shocks, body zaps etc , that second fear..... that little voice in the head, then stops using avoidance strategies to overcome first fear.

Sufferers get trapped in a double-bind of fear, that's why it can take so long to traverse the fear-cycle.

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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby imago dei » Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:27 pm

ashley72 wrote:
imago dei wrote:I cannot understand how can people avoid fear and renounce to live....they're living deads, just like i was since 4 years ago. I'm "afraid" i'm invincible now, though.


Sufferers try and avoid the "state of shock" or first fear, because of second fear. Second fear is the little voice in the head which tries to convince the sufferer that avoidance is the best strategy for overcoming first fear.

It's only when a sufferer stops listening to the little voice in the head, and begins to utterly accept & embrace the first fear (unwanted physical sensations or discomfort)... body shocks, body zaps etc , that second fear..... that little voice in the head, then stops using avoidance strategies to overcome first fear.

Sufferers get trapped in a double-bind of fear, that's why it can take so long to traverse the fear-cycle.

Image

It took me 1 year about, no, almost 2 years, and now i'm free like a butterfly.
Should i fear anything else?! It brought me to the englightment i think, all that terrible shock/pain body...
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Re: What made me wake up was the state of shock....

Postby ashley72 » Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:43 pm

Imago Dei,

That's great you're free as a butterfly. Thank you for sharing your story here.

I think this Tolle quote below is very apt in this thread.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if you could spare them from all suffering? No, it wouldn't. They would not evolve as human beings and would remain shallow, identified with the external form of things. Suffering drives you deeper. The paradox is that suffering is caused by identification with form and erodes identification with form. A lot of it is caused by the ego, although eventually suffering destroys the ego--but not until you suffer consciously.

Humanity is destined to go beyond suffering, but not in the way the ego thinks. One of the ego's many erroneous assumptions, one of its many deluded thoughts is "I should not have to suffer." Sometimes the thought gets transferred to someone close to you: "My child should not have to suffer." That thought itself lies at the root of suffering. Suffeirng has a noble purpose: the evolution of consciousness and the burning up of the ego. The man on the cross is an archetypal image. He is every man and every woman. As long as you resist suffering, it is a slow process because the resistance creates more ego to burn up. When you accept suffering, however, there is an acceleration of that process which is brought about by the fact that you suffer consciously. You can accept suffering for yourself, or you can accept it for someone else, such as your child or parent. In the midst of conscious suffering there is already the transmutation. The fire of suffering becomes the light of consciousness. ~ Eckhart Tolle


"I should not have to suffer"...is the start of all the Ego's woes.

Once you realise that suffering is ok & very much apart of the human experience, you can utterly accept it (the state of shock)... this is when the avoidance stops & you start the healing process. :wink:
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