I give up

Here you may share how the words Eckhart Tolle have affected your life.

I give up

Postby xpansion » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:47 am

I've come to the conclusion after many years of meditating that there is nothing but a mind and a body. I have sat and tried to experience what any others say is there but have still not seen nor felt it. All that seems to be there is a mind in various states. It's either thinking erratically or peaceful. Even when I'm aware of breathing it's still seems to just be my mind that's aware. I think that perhaps Buddhists, spiritualists, ET devotees etc all just convince themselves that there is something more in the same way that Christians do. If this is not the case then why can I not experience it. I also have friends who say the same thing. Christians say there's a soul, ET devotees say a presence, Buddhists say a non self. All I see is a mind and a body. If it really is there then why is it so difficult to find? People will say that's because you're not conscious or enlightened or you're not ready. I see this as the same thing Christians say ie it's because you don't pray hard enough or you don't know god. I shall continue in my meditation practice because it gives me a sense of peace sometimes which is helpful but I'm giving up on trying to find something more. I'm tired of being led up the garden path with a carrot dangling in front of me. It's incredibly frustrating and not conducive towards inner peace at all. Listening to people like ET and Sherman claiming they have all the answers just irritates me now. At first I thought I had finally discovered something more and I was on a new spiritual path again but now I realise it's all just someone else's experience and not necessarily enlightenment at all. Enlightenment in my opinion is not something you can sell in a book anyway, if in fact there even is such a thing. It seems to me sometimes that claiming to be enlightened or more conscious than others is delusional.
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Re: I give up

Postby peas » Thu Feb 20, 2014 5:30 am

That's all fine. If you feel at ease with that place, be there and enjoy it. Keep us posted though on how it all goes. Don't write us all off because we've chosen a different path. Peace.
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Re: I give up

Postby kiki » Thu Feb 20, 2014 6:25 am

Believe it or not, "giving up" is an important milestone because it allows you to just rest in/as what you already are. When everything is given up seeking also ends, and with the end of seeking what's always present, true nature, is ripe for discovery. The struggle to get somewhere else, to have some particular experience you've heard or read about, or to become "enlightened" is the very thing that gets in the way of seeing/realizing the very simple and ordinary presence of what you actually are. Nothing needs to be done for true nature to be fully here because that's what You are. That which you are is silently and unobtrusively noticing every change in the body or within the mind. No effort is needed to notice anything because noticing is the nature of what you are.

So, forget about "enlightenment" or following some spiritual path or teacher and just be what You are without trying to be anything in particular.
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Re: I give up

Postby karmarider » Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:00 am

Nicely said. Let it all go.
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Re: I give up

Postby rachMiel » Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:05 am

How about your self, I, ego ... is that real like your body and mind?
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Re: I give up

Postby xpansion » Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:41 am

kiki wrote:Believe it or not, "giving up" is an important milestone because it allows you to just rest in/as what you already are. When everything is given up seeking also ends, and with the end of seeking what's always present, true nature, is ripe for discovery. The struggle to get somewhere else, to have some particular experience you've heard or read about, or to become "enlightened" is the very thing that gets in the way of seeing/realizing the very simple and ordinary presence of what you actually are. Nothing needs to be done for true nature to be fully here because that's what You are. That which you are is silently and unobtrusively noticing every change in the body or within the mind. No effort is needed to notice anything because noticing is the nature of what you are.

So, forget about "enlightenment" or following some spiritual path or teacher and just be what You are without trying to be anything in particular.

This is the kind of rubbish that is the reason I'm so over this whole thing. No offense but you've read too many books dude and now everything that comes out of your mouth is just a bunch of mystical sounding empty quotes. None of it means anything. It's all just meaningless new agey speak that doesn't help anyone. Bye.
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Re: I give up

Postby rachMiel » Fri Feb 21, 2014 5:12 am

xpansion wrote:
kiki wrote:Believe it or not, "giving up" is an important milestone because it allows you to just rest in/as what you already are. When everything is given up seeking also ends, and with the end of seeking what's always present, true nature, is ripe for discovery. The struggle to get somewhere else, to have some particular experience you've heard or read about, or to become "enlightened" is the very thing that gets in the way of seeing/realizing the very simple and ordinary presence of what you actually are. Nothing needs to be done for true nature to be fully here because that's what You are. That which you are is silently and unobtrusively noticing every change in the body or within the mind. No effort is needed to notice anything because noticing is the nature of what you are.

So, forget about "enlightenment" or following some spiritual path or teacher and just be what You are without trying to be anything in particular.

This is the kind of rubbish that is the reason I'm so over this whole thing. No offense but you've read too many books dude and now everything that comes out of your mouth is just a bunch of mystical sounding empty quotes. None of it means anything. It's all just meaningless new agey speak that doesn't help anyone. Bye.

For the record, I liked what Kiki said ... except maybe for the capitalized You. :-)
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Re: I give up

Postby ashley72 » Fri Feb 21, 2014 8:00 am

xpansion wrote:Enlightenment in my opinion is not something you can sell in a book anyway, if in fact there even is such a thing. It seems to me sometimes that claiming to be enlightened or more conscious than others is delusional.


I think we can attempt to define such a term....Enlightenment is "supposedly" transcending (dualism) the way we conceptualize & perceive the world into categories (good,bad, or neutral).

The amygdala interprets this perceived duality, or in other words, labels experiences in a separatist and dualistic manner as in fear, anxiety and distress.

Nondualists say that the "I" is the cause of all the trouble (anxiety), and by directly seeing that the "I" is false (a fiction), we can end mental suffering. But I challenge that premise. I don't believe its plausible for a anxiety sufferer who naturally perceives the world in dualistic fashion... can suddenly stop this "perception" process through insight meditation or intellect.

I was someone who suffered immensely with, anxiety, panic, agoraphobia & even OCD for several years. I have dramatically recovered from this suffering not by seeing that the "I" was false (or a fiction). But by exposing myself to things "I" was categorising as "bad" or "dangerous" and stopped treating the symptoms of those fears as "dangerous". So I approach these difficulties with my "I" still it tack, but my "I" stopped interpreting these irrational fears as dangerous.

In summary, mental suffering appears to be a result of dualism or mental pigeonholing (good/bad/neutral), but seeing the "I" as a falsehood is not necessary to end ones suffering.

Image

So the illusion to overcome is not the "I" but the "Fear".
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Re: I give up

Postby Onceler » Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:16 pm

Brilliant! Giving up was the best thing that happened to me....good luck.
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Re: I give up

Postby rachMiel » Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:17 pm

There are different ways of "giving up." One leads to freedom, one to nihilism. Door #2 is probably not such a good one to take.
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Re: I give up

Postby Webwanderer » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:42 am

Nice one rach.

WW
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Re: I give up

Postby Phil2 » Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:30 am

xpansion wrote:
kiki wrote:Believe it or not, "giving up" is an important milestone because it allows you to just rest in/as what you already are. When everything is given up seeking also ends, and with the end of seeking what's always present, true nature, is ripe for discovery. The struggle to get somewhere else, to have some particular experience you've heard or read about, or to become "enlightened" is the very thing that gets in the way of seeing/realizing the very simple and ordinary presence of what you actually are. Nothing needs to be done for true nature to be fully here because that's what You are. That which you are is silently and unobtrusively noticing every change in the body or within the mind. No effort is needed to notice anything because noticing is the nature of what you are.

So, forget about "enlightenment" or following some spiritual path or teacher and just be what You are without trying to be anything in particular.


This is the kind of rubbish that is the reason I'm so over this whole thing. No offense but you've read too many books dude and now everything that comes out of your mouth is just a bunch of mystical sounding empty quotes. None of it means anything. It's all just meaningless new agey speak that doesn't help anyone. Bye.


I looked at some of your earlier posts, it seems it is not the first time that your emotional nature shows up dear friend ...

:)

Why react with anger when we don't understand something ?

In your initial post you said:

xpansion wrote: I shall continue in my meditation practice because it gives me a sense of peace sometimes which is helpful but I'm giving up on trying to find something more.


and I think it is a good point, because there can be no goal or intention in meditation, as soon as you create an 'intention', you create a 'tension', which is exactly the opposite of meditation ...

Therefore Kiki's recommendation here above was very appropriate:

kiki wrote:So, forget about "enlightenment" or following some spiritual path or teacher and just be what You are without trying to be anything in particular.


So why react so emotionally to this wise comment ?

It seems there is a fundamental inconsistency between what you say and what you do ... which of course is the nature of ego, always unsatisfied, always incomplete, always in contradictions and conflicts of all kinds ...
"What irritates us about others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves"
(Carl Jung)
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Re: I give up

Postby jongibirdi1974 » Sat Jan 31, 2015 1:54 am

Well done and couldnt agree more..i think sometimes people need to have a blowout and say what they need to say..but theres always a wannabe buddha or eckhart in the wings ..just waiting to throw a quote your way about ego or presence..these people are no diffrent than the door to door religious nuts selling jesus
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