You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Here you may share how the words Eckhart Tolle have affected your life.

Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:02 am

Hey Slice. I'm happy to read such a considerate answer from you - I thought you might get angry. When confronted with questions about spiritual practices Tony Parsons has been known to literally huff and walk away without saying a word.

Psychoslice wrote:I feel Tony Parsons has a lot of good to teach, he has helped many people, and many have awoken because of his teachings


I agree. From the little I know about it it seems that people with many years of spiritual practice who feel like they have hit a road block get a great deal from his teachings - is this true of your experience? (both personally and in others you know?) I've heard it said that in these cases the individual has progressed enough and that stopping the practice is what is required to move on - e.g. as the Buddha said about using a raft to cross a river but not taking the raft with you. It seems that Tony recommends then stopping the journey completely which contradicts my own view but as djmart points out this is just an opinion. Incidentally, in reply to the question of 24/7 consciousness / self-awareness (depending on your terminology), sages have reported experiencing this for thousands of years and I assume it is why it is called "awakening". When awareness becomes self-aware this process should continue uninterrupted as awareness is timeless. Here's a quote from Nisargadatta on the subject:

"By elminating the intervals of inadvertance during the waking hours you will gradually eliminate the long interval of absent-mindedness, which you call sleep. You will be aware that you are asleep."

Psychoslice wrote:and many have awoken because of his teachings


Do you feel that Tony is teaching you something then? If so, how does that wake someone up if they are already awake? Does it help them to realise that they are already awake? If so, then don't spiritual practices also help people realise they are already awake - or awaken them to the awareness that they are?

Great talking to you - I hope this debate continues,

Jack
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby Onceler » Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:12 pm

dijmart wrote:
EnterZenFromThere wrote: Are you conscious 24/7? If not, in my opinion, you are not fully awakened


Wow, that's quite an opinion :? . This business of having to be conscious 24/7 sounds like hog wash and frankly I've yet to hear of it until now.



I agree, not that I disbelieve someone has this state, but that it is somehow a criteria for enlightenment. We have such seperate experiences and routes to awakening and I don't believe the infinite mystery can be quantified. To say one has to have this or that state is decisive both internally and externally in the community.

One criteria I do believe in is an end to suffering.....and that this can happen in a very humble ordinary way, without states of consciousness, etc.; that it may also be possible that people experiencing these states, 24/7 awareness, etc.. have not ended suffering....
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby dijmart » Wed Apr 09, 2014 3:06 pm

Onceler wrote:
dijmart wrote:
EnterZenFromThere wrote: Are you conscious 24/7? If not, in my opinion, you are not fully awakened


Wow, that's quite an opinion :? . This business of having to be conscious 24/7 sounds like hog wash and frankly I've yet to hear of it until now.



I agree, not that I disbelieve someone has this state, but that it is somehow a criteria for enlightenment.


That's what I meant exactly!
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed Apr 09, 2014 4:25 pm

Onceler wrote:One criteria I do believe in is an end to suffering


For me an increase in awareness and a decrease in suffering are one and the same.

I agree that this can happen in a very humble ordinary way. I suppose there are more paths / no paths than people / no people. With many people making many claims and others following them based on these claims it made sense to me to have something simple and potentially provable like 24/7 consciousness that could not be faked and therefore tested to have a better idea whether someone is speaking the "truth". It's a learning curve trying to discuss this - so many different definitions for the same words and so many different opinions on what is what..

Jack
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby dijmart » Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:48 pm

Psychoslice wrote:
dijmart wrote:
EnterZenFromThere wrote: Are you conscious 24/7? If not, in my opinion, you are not fully awakened


Wow, that's quite an opinion :? . This business of having to be conscious 24/7 sounds like hog wash and frankly I've yet to hear of it until now.

Why would you want to walk around 24/7 feeling within consciousness, there is the mind body to take care of, consciousness didn't make the mind body to do that, why would it when it SELF is consciousness, through the mind body we can enjoy the beauty of our creation which arises from our true being of consciousness. Its silly to think that we have to be in pure bliss all day and all night long, after all its just that, a feeling, the feeling is not what is, it is secondary to that, you seem more interested in the feeling and not what is beyond the feeling.


The way this above is quoted it looks as though you are addressing me.. But I doubt that, from what you wrote it seems like you were speaking to EZFT, is this correct?
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby dijmart » Thu Apr 10, 2014 3:43 am

EnterZenFromThere wrote:With many people making many claims and others following them based on these claims it made sense to me to have something simple and potentially provable like 24/7 consciousness that could not be faked and therefore tested to have a better idea whether someone is speaking the "truth".


So, how could 24/7 consciousness be tested? and if this is testable, have you been tested?.. if not, why? You state in your other thread that you do this (are aware/conscious during the sleep cycle) so, don't you want others to know you are speaking the truth, as you put it?
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby Psychoslice » Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:03 am

EnterZenFromThere wrote:Hey Slice. I'm happy to read such a considerate answer from you - I thought you might get angry. When confronted with questions about spiritual practices Tony Parsons has been known to literally huff and walk away without saying a word.

Psychoslice wrote:I feel Tony Parsons has a lot of good to teach, he has helped many people, and many have awoken because of his teachings


I agree. From the little I know about it it seems that people with many years of spiritual practice who feel like they have hit a road block get a great deal from his teachings - is this true of your experience? (both personally and in others you know?) I've heard it said that in these cases the individual has progressed enough and that stopping the practice is what is required to move on - e.g. as the Buddha said about using a raft to cross a river but not taking the raft with you. It seems that Tony recommends then stopping the journey completely which contradicts my own view but as djmart points out this is just an opinion. Incidentally, in reply to the question of 24/7 consciousness / self-awareness (depending on your terminology), sages have reported experiencing this for thousands of years and I assume it is why it is called "awakening". When awareness becomes self-aware this process should continue uninterrupted as awareness is timeless. Here's a quote from Nisargadatta on the subject:

"By elminating the intervals of inadvertance during the waking hours you will gradually eliminate the long interval of absent-mindedness, which you call sleep. You will be aware that you are asleep."

Psychoslice wrote:and many have awoken because of his teachings


Do you feel that Tony is teaching you something then? If so, how does that wake someone up if they are already awake? Does it help them to realise that they are already awake? If so, then don't spiritual practices also help people realise they are already awake - or awaken them to the awareness that they are?

Great talking to you - I hope this debate continues,

Jack

Hi Jack, yea sometimes that is all one can do is to just walk away, this consciousness or source cannot be argued about, it cannot even be known, that is intellectually, it can be pointed to as Tony Parsons does, and as many other do also.

I myself have never really had a practice or path, I was always interested in religion, and the concept that we are all one in God, I was a Christian for about 17 years but gave it up because I couldn't agree with it any longer. The awakening experience happened spontaneously, it was when I had enough of life and I just feel onto my bed and gave in to life, in that moment I was free from all that held me in its prison, that is the mind.

The experience was like dissolving into the cosmos, becoming all there is, I felt like I was connected to everything there is, it gave me the feeling of love, not love for a particular person or persons, but for everything there is. When I cane out of this experience I began to laugh and laugh, I am still laughing today lol.

Yes I agree with Tony, when most are on a so called path, they begin to be addicted to the path, they practice for years just to simply realize their already there, in this case its best to give up the path and just be who you are. No matter what we do to awaken, its not going to work, because why we are trying to awaken, the trying is going to keep us from awakening, as it is said, "let go and let God".

Yes Tony is teaching something, as we all teach, and all learn from each other, if there is going to be an awakening in ones life experience then no matter what they learn it will happen, some people are like wet wood and can take a long time to realize their true being, some are like dry wood and awaken more easily, and there are those who are like gun powder who only need a little hint, they ignite instantly.

There are so many teaches who all teach in their own way, each individual who is trying to find their self will adapt to whatever teacher they feel drawn to, one teacher might not be for one, and another may be the very thing that will ignite your inner being.

Great talking to you also, remember whatever I say is only my understanding, and maybe right or wrong for you.
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:10 pm

Great stuff here Slice - lovely to hear things from your perspective.

Psychoslice wrote:it can be pointed to as Tony Parsons does, and as many other do also.


Very true - "the finger pointing to the moon is not the moon" - the concept of non-duality is not non-duality.

Psychoslice wrote:The experience was like dissolving into the cosmos, becoming all there is


A wonderful experience :) I used to dabble in a lot of different drugs and people often refer to these drug induced states as the best there is but dissolving as awareness is just more. Do you still experience this? For me my "practice" is to remain in this state as much as possible during waking life, deep sleep, and dream states. The "practice" is like the subtle flow of energy. The more this is done the more suffering dissolves, life continues with its own momentum without my own interference clogging things up (like a passenger trying to steal the wheel from the driver), and awareness becomes permanent.

Psychoslice wrote:No matter what we do to awaken, its not going to work, because why we are trying to awaken, the trying is going to keep us from awakening, as it is said, "let go and let God".


I love this quote - let go and let God - great stuff! For me there is a paradoxical free-will vs no-will thing going on. Let go is an act of free-will, Let God is an act of no-will. A practice that seems to require effort which leads to the free will of letting go (for me self-inquiry in the mind and devotion to God in the heart) results in alignment with God and the pull of that over which we have no-will engages us further.

Only my experience/no experience. As you say our understanding may or may not be right for one another - there are more paths/no paths than there are people/no people.

Jack
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby Psychoslice » Wed Aug 06, 2014 8:13 am

Hi Jack, wonderful words from you.......no the original experience of awakening was unique, I will never have that experience again, and I don't want it again, why dwell on the past, and trying to masturbate on that one experience, be with the flow of life, don't build dams to try and hold onto the past, truth is forever flowing, be in that flow always, renewing your self daily.
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Re: You Are Already There, You Cannot Be Anywhere Else

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Wed Aug 06, 2014 11:49 am

Psychoslice wrote:why dwell on the past, and trying to masturbate on that one experience


Haha! I love that!

Psychoslice wrote:truth is forever flowing, be in that flow always, renewing your self daily.


Mmm yes I agree. Be that wonderful creativity exploding forever forward. The fearless, free, family spiralling into the new.

Delightful to have you back Slice.

Love,

Jack
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