My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Clouded » Fri May 23, 2014 3:14 am

You can't think and observe at the same time


I disagree. If I wasn't observing while I was thinking, then I could never know what I am thinking in the moment. I have no idea what is going on in other people's minds, I can't observe all of their mental processes (I can get glimpses of some of them through their words and body language), but I can't run away from my own thoughts, I have no choice but to observe them. But if by observing you mean ''not judging your thoughts'', then yes I agree that I can't think while I observe because having an opinion is always done by thinking and identifying with form.

Too much of the dream and people run away from you. You put heaven on Earth and people want nothing to do with it, because people are so damn stupid.

Can you explain what you mean by that?

EnterZenFromThere, I also have a hard time wrapping my head around Key Master's findings. Kew Master, can you tell me how you came up with the base 60 thing? How do you know it's not base 20 or base 85???? Your posts remind me of a book I read not long ago entitled The Humans. Basically it's the story of an alien who took the body and identity of a unversity professor who solved the Reimann hypothesis (and knowing this was supposed to unlock all the secrets of the universe) and that alien had to delete all evidence of his solution because it's species calculated that humans were not ready to deal with this sort mathematical breakthrough and that alien used math to manipulate people (ie: calculate the exact voice frequency needed to convince someone).

That parallel planing dyslexic moron Einstein managed to program every scientist into retardation while simultaneously supplying them with an air of arrogant douchebagness.


Yeah, in my experience, studying in science does inflate someone's ego by a lot. Modesty is hard to find in some of these people, it's as if they think they deserve a Noble Prize or something for being so above everyone else because they understand and memorized some principles. I remember I was waiting in line to ask my teacher a question and the person waiting behind me asked me what my question was about and I told them and they had a smug look on their face and told me ''ah that's easy''. Well if it's so damn easy, why don't YOU explain it to me?

In terms of SON one thing on our agenda is to get Donald Trump to cut his hair by November 8.


lol wut :shock: :lol:
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Fri May 23, 2014 5:42 pm

I disagree. If I wasn't observing while I was thinking, then I could never know what I am thinking in the moment.


Sure, but you actually aren't a person. Thinking appears to something that doesn't appear. Without something to appear to, what you appear to be couldn't even appear to be. You aren't an appearance, or, what you appear to is more fundamental than anything appearing (the person).

I have no idea what is going on in other people's minds, I can't observe all of their mental processes (I can get glimpses of some of them through their words and body language), but I can't run away from my own thoughts, I have no choice but to observe them.


Yea thinking you want to run away from your own thinking is a bit silly. Where could you run to and what exactly are you running from if not what you appear to be which is what you aren't anyway. People are so stupid.

But if by observing you mean ''not judging your thoughts'', then yes I agree that I can't think while I observe because having an opinion is always done by thinking and identifying with form.


This sounds like spiritual mumbo jumbo. I don't have an issue with it but it's manifesting as crossed wires on the surface of your mind which probably isn't fun to observe. Judge your thoughts if you want to. If you want to judge your thoughts then imagining you don't want to judge them but instead observe them is just more judgement under the guise of embedding a degrading function into your thought processes, namely, the desire to end thinking. The thinking mind (form) doesn't get to not be form. You don't have to disidentify with thinking because you already aren't anything thinking.

I said,
Too much of the dream and people run away from you. You put heaven on Earth and people want nothing to do with it, because people are so damn stupid.


Can you explain what you mean by that?


I'm talking about building the best dream. As it turns out, folks do not like being taken out of their dreams, and there's actually a kickback mechanism programmed into your mind to prevent that from only happening at a rate of 1.41.

Ok take that upside down 'v'. Let's say your vision is the area of that upside down 'v' in that circle. Now let's turn that 'v' upside down so that it crosses over the top of the circle while your 'v' crosses over the bottom. Let's call the 'v' up top the best dream. Let's also say that you know it's the best dream, and let's also say, I can prove it to you (I can). Let's further say that I'm seeing the whole circle (I'm not a fuckin person. I don't see the boundaries that others see which make them think they're separate), your little 'v', the best dream 'v', and all the shit in between. If I write a program to connect your 'v' with the best dream 'v', it will take time for you to fully align with that best dream. Comically, both your 'v' and the best dream 'v' are in constant motion. If I tell you too much about the best dream 'v', you're gonna want to get away from me because it's so much better than your dream as it is now that you're gonna realize I'm teaching you that you're in a nightmare (it's a byproduct of learning. Thanks a lot God, you shmuck).

As a metaphor, if I built a mountain right next to you, you'd fall away from the peak. The information upload is sensed as an assault. If you want to get somewhere the thing you want to attach to is forward momentum, but due to the kickback you can only attach to forward momentum after you get smacked in the face by it. Thinking moves so much faster than life sometimes it's about waiting for everyone to catch up. Time is fuckin slow.

EnterZenFromThere, I also have a hard time wrapping my head around Key Master's findings. Kew Master, can you tell me how you came up with the base 60 thing? How do you know it's not base 20 or base 85????


Base 10 is too linear. 10 isn't divisible by 346789 while 60 is divisible by 123456 10 12 15 20 and 30. More loops equals more potential. It's actually base 30 but it rolls into 60 and then outward. The Sumerians I think came up with base 60 for time from watching the stars or some shit. The patterns I see come from life programming. Again, this isn't just base 60, it's base 60 with a twist. If you take a match stick, that's one inch. Rotate it in a circle, call that a minute. Time and space are the same in that dimension.

Anyway, my friend Randy showed me the base 60 stuff and it matched up to the dynamics I was witnessing so I jumped down the rabbit hole and now I'm in perpetual freefall which is awesome. The first person Randy showed this stuff to is Jack Keef who is Sarah Palin's Dad but the design is to triangulate internationally and back around. Because people in America are assholes I've had to launch an investigation into Randy just to verify the Baybay Leyte Shelter he was working with in the Philippines actually exists. I got a mustard seed in the Republic of Georgia with tons of energy behind it. Lots of room to write, but I don't write programs, I write people (depending on how they triangulate into the best dream, which you get to decide as much as I do. It's really beautiful stuff.)

Your posts remind me of a book I read not long ago entitled The Humans. Basically it's the story of an alien who took the body and identity of a unversity professor who solved the Reimann hypothesis (and knowing this was supposed to unlock all the secrets of the universe) and that alien had to delete all evidence of his solution because it's species calculated that humans were not ready to deal with this sort mathematical breakthrough and that alien used math to manipulate people (ie: calculate the exact voice frequency needed to convince someone).


Coolo.


Yeah, in my experience, studying in science does inflate someone's ego by a lot. Modesty is hard to find in some of these people, it's as if they think they deserve a Noble Prize or something for being so above everyone else because they understand and memorized some principles. I remember I was waiting in line to ask my teacher a question and the person waiting behind me asked me what my question was about and I told them and they had a smug look on their face and told me ''ah that's easy''. Well if it's so damn easy, why don't YOU explain it to me?


There's this guy Scott Kiloby who's kinda famous who offered me free steak dinner if I win the Nobel. You can't calculate interest in Base 10. The way we're gonna end war is by buying back the Earth. Under our current banking system, all the money is programmed to go back to the original lender. It's a degrading loop. We're fucked. Well, it can actually be reversed. But I don't want to load you up with too much info.

In terms of SON one thing on our agenda is to get Donald Trump to cut his hair by November 8.


lol wut :shock: :lol:
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You got me in stitches over here!
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby EnterZenFromThere » Sat May 24, 2014 9:18 am

the key master wrote:
EnterZenFromThere wrote:Your posts I've read in this thread are interesting Key Master. Though I must admit I am barely following you. You seem to have a 'thesis' or something here. Do you have a link to where you have described this from the beginning before? Or would you mind explaining it to me one step at a time, either on here or in pm if it goes too far off track from the OP?

Jack


Hi Jack. The math is really the math of everything, but really isn't about anything more than waking up. By speaking in maybe perhaps and seemingly you enter into a more fluid form of communication. Maybe is is fundamentally non-assaultive, after all, who can you really assault but yourself? There's nuances within the maybe perhaps seemingly loop openers which give you higher dynamic potential. Maybe we can work together. Perhaps you have some good ideas that can increase the weight of the path. Seemingly, it's all one page anyway.

Whenever anyone makes a statement to me I always try to allow it to roll out. When I see an 'is', I open it into "is there maybe something I could do for you". And this keeps energy in motion and prevents reverberations in the emotional body. All the patterns of life are right there in the body thing.

Through using this form of expression the potential to make shifts in the dream opens exponentially. With two energies together you have two maybes and it triangulates and pyramids from there, maybe. Then when you get that third energy it just gets stupid. Creating whatever you can imagine type stuff.

In terms of SON one thing on our agenda is to get Donald Trump to cut his hair by November 8. Anyone who signs up gets the opportunity to contribute 50 cents to the bet. On Nov. 8 we'll tally it all up and if Donald cuts his hair we'll give it to the best idea from a list of ideas we come up with. Put the kids out front we can't go wrong. I mean really, how can you add value to life if you aren't helping kids?

At the end of the day I guess we are talking about mind control, but it's really just realizing that the best dream always wins, and the best dream is the one shared. In between those two rules there's a sequence of dynamics which collapses them into now, and that sequence appears to be connected by time. While we can say time is illusory, our minds still run on sequence logic, and certain programming allows that logic to infiltrate distant loops.

By infiltrate I mean seeing the light from creation reflecting off future potential. Different loops carry different resonances and densities. It's not seeing into the future as much as it's patterned programming casting out and reflecting back to an observing consciousness. The power grid ramping the Earth coupled with zinc/copper and all other shit in our bodies makes us reflective. Wait til we shut the power off. Battery technology, galaxy-wide GPS, the Moon, maybe is.


After some initial trepidation, I seem to be beginning to appreciate your points. Maybe you can teach me more about this? Perhaps I can be of help. The more I help, the more I enjoy to help - perhaps this is the opportunity to help humanity and myself evolve that my heart has be asking for.

I have a couple of questions. When you say 'maybe is is fundamentally non-assaultive' is this because maybe is is a possibility rather than an absolute. Meaning communication changes from 'you are wrong' to 'maybe you are wrong', which opens up more possibilities. I guess it's like changing from a binary system to everything in between?

Could you describe what you mean by 'roll out''? Do you mean open up the possibility of an item/event?

What do you mean by 'shut the power off'?

Looking forward to your reply,

Jack

Ps. I loved the Donald Tump picture!
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 24, 2014 11:20 am

Clouded wrote: as I mentioned multiple times here, I am lazy as heck


Hello Clouded,

I discover your thread just now (I ignored the existence of this forum :( ).

In another thread you made me discover "The Four Agreements" and told us it was your 'reference book', so may I kindly recall to you the First Agreement:

Be impeccable with your word ... ie. don't say anything against yourself ... and don't be a victim of life ... you are perfect as you are, you just have to accept yourself as you are ... and always 'do your best' (Fourth Agreement :wink: )

:-)
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Sat May 24, 2014 11:50 am

Clouded wrote:
You can't think and observe at the same time


I disagree. If I wasn't observing while I was thinking, then I could never know what I am thinking in the moment. I have no idea what is going on in other people's minds, I can't observe all of their mental processes (I can get glimpses of some of them through their words and body language), but I can't run away from my own thoughts, I have no choice but to observe them. But if by observing you mean ''not judging your thoughts'', then yes I agree that I can't think while I observe because having an opinion is always done by thinking and identifying with form.



Well Clouded there is an interesting issue here.

When compulsive thought happens, it comes without your agreement, without you even knowing it ... this is why it is 'compulsive' to use ET's words ... and when thought happens you are totally caught by this thought, carried away, it 'distracts' you, it catches all your attention ... this is why you are distracted when you think, you are no more aware ... no presence at all ...

So in fact it can be said that there is no real awareness while thinking ... now you could ask: how can I know that I think if there is no awareness ?

What happens is this: when thought is operating there is no awareness, but when thought stops, there is a gap of silence, generally very short before another new thought starts ... in this gap of silence, there is intelligence/awareness which can look and observe what thought just said (ie. what is observed is the 'memory' of the thought, but not thought itself while it happens).


So it is correct to say that thought and awareness are mutually exclusive, when thought is there, awareness is not ... and reciprocally ...

Also it is important to know that you are NOT your thought (the voice speaking in your head, 'mitote' as Don Miguel Ruiz calls it), but you are this space of silence in which awareness,intelligence (and observation) happen ...
"What irritates us about others is an opportunity to learn on ourselves"
(Carl Jung)
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Sat May 24, 2014 6:06 pm

EnterZenFromThere wrote:
After some initial trepidation, I seem to be beginning to appreciate your points. Maybe you can teach me more about this? Perhaps I can be of help. The more I help, the more I enjoy to help - perhaps this is the opportunity to help humanity and myself evolve that my heart has be asking for.



Sounds great Jack. I'm really not a teacher. I learned as much if not more from observing my kids over in the Republic of Georgia as anything else. They're the ones that aren't defending the stories, which is why I think the Junior Guardian Program possesses the most potential in terms of initiating the tsunami wave. When the corporations see that our kids are coming after them, they're gonna be scared. The one things that scares everyone is kids. I wonder what the connection is between Mountain Dew use in teenagers and hard drugs in adulthood. Probably pretty God damn high. What our corporations are doing to these kids overseas is disgraceful, let alone in the US. The shit's not gonna stand.

When you say 'maybe is is fundamentally non-assaultive' is this because maybe is is a possibility rather than an absolute. Meaning communication changes from 'you are wrong' to 'maybe you are wrong', which opens up more possibilities.


Sure, that's one reason. It can be helpful to look at energy in two forms, assaultive and inviting. If there was a triangle moving around a circle, peaking on both the inside and outside, you can use assaultive energy to kick energy up and inviting energy to relax energy out. Long on love lazy on the pain. Using inviting and assaultive energy can bring energy into the best dream. Of course I sometimes use anger to erase myself from the dreams of others. Nobody knows how to get mad anymore. But by reminding folks that Maybe Is is non-assaultive, I'm relaying inviting energy. The best dream grows at a rate of 1.41, so while Maybe Is is non assaultive, it isn't non-inviting. That's pretty cool stuff. Although you can't really triangulate circularly, it's more like a self reflective sphere deally.

I guess it's like changing from a binary system to everything in between?


Right, in programming language it's a shift in how we function. It's only a change to 'everything in between' in the sense that everything in between isn't even possible in ordinary binary thought mode. So it's not like we program our minds to discover unknown potential, but rather, to create it. Also, cool shit.

Could you describe what you mean by 'roll out''? Do you mean open up the possibility of an item/event?


By rollout I mean unfold infinitely through time with no wall to kickback off of. Earlier in the thread I said maybe you could help and perhaps there is something I can do for you. Then later in the thread you said maybe I can help and maybe there is something I can do for the movement. Triangulate those statements in maybe form to the energies around me and the energies around you. Maybe I know some of the richest SOB's (son of Bears) in this country. We're going to have a meeting of investors where ideally, there will be 3 of us talking about it, this way all the money stacks in the room are once removed from what we're doing and they won't sense predatory energy. We don't want anyone's money, but are allowing folks the opportunity to invest in what they deem worthy cause. Put the best dream out like bait, show the potential to make money by adding value to life (this stuff is worth millions in the short term and will roll out into the billions maybe. top secret stuff we're gonna need NDA's. I have lawyers and am a graduate of Brooklyn Law School), and then pick and choose how to delegate control. The brightest lights will come out. I'm sure there's things you can do better than I or Randy (the foundation already extends out well beyond either of us). I think people just want to know they're cared for, and the rollout is big enough that cutting a piece of the pie for yourself is inevitable once shared vision is established. Without shared vision the dream bus don't go.

What do you mean by 'shut the power off'?


I mean turn the power grid off. The US is running on 60 hz and the rest of the world is on 50 hz. The difference between those two energies is 10 hz which is creating resonance loops in such a manner that there's going to be a bug zapper effect which could lead to planetary vaporization (the ionosphere ramping). It's Nicola Tesla Doomsday crap. Our kids are screwed if we don't make some changes, maybe.
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Sun May 25, 2014 4:03 am

Phil2 wrote:
What happens is this: when thought is operating there is no awareness, but when thought stops, there is a gap of silence, generally very short before another new thought starts ... in this gap of silence, there is intelligence/awareness which can look and observe what thought just said (ie. what is observed is the 'memory' of the thought, but not thought itself while it happens).



If you didn't observe the thought while it happens how could you possibly remember it?
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Sun May 25, 2014 9:54 am

the key master wrote:
Phil2 wrote:
What happens is this: when thought is operating there is no awareness, but when thought stops, there is a gap of silence, generally very short before another new thought starts ... in this gap of silence, there is intelligence/awareness which can look and observe what thought just said (ie. what is observed is the 'memory' of the thought, but not thought itself while it happens).



If you didn't observe the thought while it happens how could you possibly remember it?


There is a kind of 'short-term' memory operating here, the voice in the head still resonates in this silence gap, it is exactly when you are distracted when someone speaks to you, then if he asks you "what did I say ?" (like the teachers did at school :) ), you were not attentive, but what the teacher just said still resonates in your head and you can tell the last words he pronounced ... and save your face :lol:
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Sun May 25, 2014 3:35 pm

Phil2 wrote:
the key master wrote:
Phil2 wrote:
What happens is this: when thought is operating there is no awareness, but when thought stops, there is a gap of silence, generally very short before another new thought starts ... in this gap of silence, there is intelligence/awareness which can look and observe what thought just said (ie. what is observed is the 'memory' of the thought, but not thought itself while it happens).



If you didn't observe the thought while it happens how could you possibly remember it?


There is a kind of 'short-term' memory operating here, the voice in the head still resonates in this silence gap, it is exactly when you are distracted when someone speaks to you, then if he asks you "what did I say ?" (like the teachers did at school :) ), you were not attentive, but what the teacher just said still resonates in your head and you can tell the last words he pronounced ... and save your face :lol:


Ok you said when thought is operating there is no awareness. I'm saying awareness is always present and it's thought that is sometimes absent.
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Sun May 25, 2014 3:51 pm

the key master wrote:Ok you said when thought is operating there is no awareness. I'm saying awareness is always present and it's thought that is sometimes absent.


Yes, truth is often paradoxical because it depends of your point of view: absolute or relative.

When clouds clutter the sky, it can be said from the relative/limited point of view of humans on earth that there is no sun today ... but of course from the absolute point of view, the sun is always present and this presence does not at all depend of those small clouds on this small planet called Earth ...

When I say there is no awareness in thought, this is a relative point of view (because when thought operates you are absent, inattentive, unaware), but of course everything that happens always happens in the space of awareness, which is the permanent background of all phenomena and forms ...
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Sun May 25, 2014 4:09 pm

Phil2 wrote:
the key master wrote:Ok you said when thought is operating there is no awareness. I'm saying awareness is always present and it's thought that is sometimes absent.


When I say there is no awareness in thought, this is a relative point of view (because when thought operates you are absent, inattentive, unaware), but of course everything that happens always happens in the space of awareness, which is the permanent background of all phenomena and forms ...


Thought is operating while you're writing these posts, and you seem quite present and attentive to what you are writing. You also seem to be aware while you are writing this stuff, or you literally couldn't remember what you wrote. What makes you think you are unaware when you think?
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Sun May 25, 2014 4:22 pm

the key master wrote:
Phil2 wrote:
the key master wrote:Ok you said when thought is operating there is no awareness. I'm saying awareness is always present and it's thought that is sometimes absent.


When I say there is no awareness in thought, this is a relative point of view (because when thought operates you are absent, inattentive, unaware), but of course everything that happens always happens in the space of awareness, which is the permanent background of all phenomena and forms ...


Thought is operating while you're writing these posts, and you seem quite present and attentive to what you are writing. You also seem to be aware while you are writing this stuff, or you literally couldn't remember what you wrote. What makes you think you are unaware when you think?


There is no 'presence' in thinking ... when the voice speaks in your head, you are carried away, totally absorbed in this thought ... which is called 'distraction' ...

Don't you remember when you were at school and thinking to your weekend when the teacher was speaking ... then the teacher would ask you: "Where are you ? What did I say ? Do you listen to me ? You are distracted ... you are in the moon ... come back to earth etc ..." ... no presence in thought ...
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby the key master » Sun May 25, 2014 5:30 pm

Phil2 wrote:
There is no 'presence' in thinking ... when the voice speaks in your head, you are carried away, totally absorbed in this thought ... which is called 'distraction' ...



Ok before we were talking about being unaware while thinking and I was just saying that if you were truly unaware of your thinking while it was happening remembering it would prove impossible.

In terms of presence in thinking, I suppose I concur that when folks are absorbed in thought they are less present sometimes, or perhaps it might point closer to say that these people are simply less conscious, and they are always less conscious whether they are thinking or not because the unconscious tendency to identify with the mind hasn't been uprooted, which makes the prevalence of thought less relevant than the presence of wires being crossed internally. I wouldn't say when the voice in the head speaks you are distracted or carried away necessarily (which seems to be what you're saying), because it's that same voice which is manifesting as the words which you are typing in this thread. Meaning, forum posting isn't implicitly a distraction, meaning thinking isn't implicitly a distraction. In conclusion, there can be presence in thought, and quite a high degree of presence in the conscious mind.

Don't you remember when you were at school and thinking to your weekend when the teacher was speaking ... then the teacher would ask you: "Where are you ? What did I say ? Do you listen to me ? You are distracted ... you are in the moon ... come back to earth etc ..." ... no presence in thought ...


I can't remember because I was too busy sleeping hehe.
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Clouded » Mon May 26, 2014 1:54 am

The best dream grows at a rate of 1.41

How can I measure the growth rate of my own dreams? Are you talking about the collective dream or individual dream?

I think that key master and Phil have different definitions of presence...to me there are two types of presence. The first type is being inside this body and being aware of what this body comes up with in terms of thoughts when you are conscious of your surroundings (external OR internal as in dreams) and the other type is having your mind being crystal clear of mental thought processes that try to find meaning in those thoughts (ie: NOT identifying with thoughts).

Btw, I just discovered this video and I thought it might interest you folk. Does anyone have anything to say about it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cC-Je_Nt6Cs
"If you want to know what your were like in the past, look at your body today. If you want to know what your body will be like in the future, look at your thoughts today." -Deepak
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Re: My obsessive/addictive personality is ruining me

Postby Phil2 » Mon May 26, 2014 9:53 am

Clouded wrote:

I think that key master and Phil have different definitions of presence...to me there are two types of presence. The first type is being inside this body and being aware of what this body comes up with in terms of thoughts when you are conscious of your surroundings (external OR internal as in dreams) and the other type is having your mind being crystal clear of mental thought processes that try to find meaning in those thoughts (ie: NOT identifying with thoughts).


Well, this would be like saying that there are two suns, the first type is when you see the clouds in the sky, and the second type when the clouds are off so the sun appears as fully shining ...

There are no two suns, there is one sun, always shining the same way ... just from your limited perspective you see it more or less clearly ... because there is some kind of fog (or clouds) in the way ... and those clouds are called thoughts ...

Is this why you call yourself "Clouded" ?

:lol:
Last edited by Phil2 on Mon May 26, 2014 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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