Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby hanss » Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:28 pm

snowheight wrote:How, in teaching the LOA, would you deal with the concept of attachment?

They don't deal with it so much. But there seems to be wide-spread misunderstanding (or maybe I read them wrong) that they teach "getting more stuff", when my view is that they again and again talk about the joy of creation, not ownership.
"In today's rush we all think too much, seek too much, want too much and forget about the joy of just Being."
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby hanss » Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:39 pm

Webwanderer wrote: Life is endlessly challenging, and pain bodies and conditioning are frequently arising in ways that draw us out of alignment. Knowing how LoA works gives power to shortening the cycle of those emotional arisings.


Yes. But after practicing this for awhile I have found that it is nor me. The emotional guidance scale is a good tool, but for me some resistance creeps in. That to have moments or days on the lower scale is "bad" thing, out of alignment with Source and I must find a way to glide up the scale. This becomes avoidance of what is... This is what I have practiced most of my life, to find ways to feel better. Good, but not at the same time resist/deny/escape discomfort or emotions on the lower end of the scale. So I have not stopped to enjoy or appreciate but I have almost started to seek bad stuff/emotions to practice, to accept it, feel it as it is.
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby Webwanderer » Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:01 am

hanss wrote:The emotional guidance scale is a good tool, but for me some resistance creeps in. That to have moments or days on the lower scale is "bad" thing, out of alignment with Source and I must find a way to glide up the scale. This becomes avoidance of what is...

My study of Abraham's teaching suggests that resistance to what is is the very focus of attention that gives energy for its continuance. Only by accepting what is as a legitimate manifestation of Source energy (the only energy that exists), and being okay with it, can one begin to deconstruct the thinking and focus that maintains it. Focus can then be applied in more preferable directions to begin the process of creating more enjoyable conditions. Source energy only knows yes to whatever focus is maintained. It is only ego that judges right and wrong in the human experience.

Whatever conditions may present themselves, a conscious choice can be made as to how to perceive them. The wiser choice is to accept what is, and to perceive its value. Such choice is the precursor to dropping the resistance and thereby regaining the Source alignment lost through the focus on resistance. Acceptance is a primary step toward alignment.

It simply feels better to see the good in whatever conditions arise than to consistently see them through the eyes and energizing focus of negative judgment. To consistently look for the good in conditions, knowing there is always an element of such there, is the habitual focus that will make dropping resistance easier until the LoA energizes the process as an automatic response.

WW
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby runstrails » Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:20 am

Great discussion. Thanks everyone. Here is an Adyashanti video called: "Whatever you want--be it". I thought it might be relevant. The last part resonates particularly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7D5S8fl ... re=related
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby Sighclone » Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:52 am

Consider also, that the back and forth between the focus of attention on external creative desires, and internal alignment with Source, is the constructive basis for our conscious evolution. Desire and its experiential result is the creative edge of evolving consciousness. In the ongoing creation that is a joy born of Source Love, it is the pain of misapplied focus, that motivates a return to alignment. Down in the trenches of life's diverse experience it's often difficult to see through the confusion and misinformation; but from the clear heights of alignment the emotional attraction of feeling good about being is a reliable guide to apply one's focus.


Well put, WW. If the LOA speeds up the recognition that attachment to bodily or financial or even some emotional events is not alignment with Being, and is not listening to our "Inner Being," then lets have more and more of it, so we can "get over ourselves." It has certainly been marketed (at least as "The Secret"), however, as a tool for getting the stuff you want, including prestige (the egoic extension of respect,) greed (pure ego,) getting even (more ego,) finding a soul-mate (whom I need to complete me since I'm incomplete without him or her,) etc...

If it "works" for that level, we should hope dearly that the "back and forth" ends quickly, because the "external creative desires" for a great many people seem to mean more ego food.

hanss -

Buddha was pretty clear on the need to end the cycle of birth and death (samsara.) And yet the Tibetan Rinpoches keep re-incarnating to the delight of the monks...

My favorite author on the Zen Buddhist perspective is Philip Kapleau -- his book "The Wheel of Life and Death" expands upon this -- In the final chapter he comments: “It is the desire or craving for a continuation of life, and the clinging to a notion of a separate individuality that propel us again and again into new rounds of birth and death. This is why, when the Buddhist sage Nagasena was asked by King Milinda whether or not he would be reborn after death, Nagasena replied, “If when I die, I die with a craving for existence in my heart, yes; but if not, no.”



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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby snowheight » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:09 am

WW,

Thanks for the reply.

Webwanderer wrote:Abraham teaches how to use the LoA to deconstruct those beliefs and attachments that limit our growth and cause us pain, and to create new perspectives by virtue of a focus that offers conscious expansion, greater clarity and more enjoyment in life.


Another match with Tolle ... it was in something he wrote for Oprah a few months back, I remember his quote as "let go of limiting stories", and then he gave a few examples. Seeing all stories for what they are is a great aspiration but letting go of the damaging ones at least is a good start.

Webwanderer wrote:Is that creating new beliefs and attachments? Perhaps. But it's not quite the same if you know what you're doing consciously and have the understanding at hand to directly influence your ongoing experience. You're not trapped in a painful perspective by unconscious thought structures


Yeah, hey, I've related the personal story in my posts of a string of about a dozen authors starting with Carl Sagan and ending in Tolle that sort of built a ladder to me down in hell. Once out I learned here on this forum the difference between judging that ladder and discerning those healthy beliefs from the toxic stuff.

Webwanderer wrote:One tends to remember what brought them joy. Abraham makes it abundantly clear that beneath all desire for the stuff of life, what's really wanted is feeling happy and joyful about life. It's really a self correcting reality. Prizing the effect to the point of missing the cause will likely negate the most important effect - love and appreciation. If one becomes unaware of the Loving Source energy that created the joyful conditions, that separation is likely to become painful and contracting. The cycle back to alignment then becomes necessary. It also becomes easier in that there is now previous experience.

In truth, this back and forth, in and out, seems to be commonplace. So much so that its seems to be part of the Creative system. Maybe it's a good thing...(practicing positive focus here :wink: )


Yeah, good call, I've participated in the cycle and written about it. I remember hearing from a few sources that Sanskrit is a language that expresses concepts almost mathematically, one of those sources being Rob (Yumcha). I wonder if any of the old Vedics wrote about this cycle in terms of a damped sinusoid.
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby snowheight » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:46 am

hanss wrote:
snowheight wrote:How, in teaching the LOA, would you deal with the concept of attachment?

They don't deal with it so much. But there seems to be wide-spread misunderstanding (or maybe I read them wrong) that they teach "getting more stuff", when my view is that they again and again talk about the joy of creation, not ownership.


Thanks for the insight hanss.

runstrails wrote:Great discussion. Thanks everyone. Here is an Adyashanti video called: "Whatever you want--be it". I thought it might be relevant. The last part resonates particularly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7D5S8fl ... re=related


Thanks for the link 'trails. The question at 3:00 is close to what I asked WW ... and Adya's initial response (that first phrase) is especially priceless :)
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby hanss » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:03 am

Webwanderer wrote:...

I agree with every word. But there is also a possibility to stay neutral and not judge or focus like that at all... to focus on the experience and awareness itself... where can that lead us I wonder :) It is not all clear and verified 100% but my experience is that focus on the positive might not be necessary. More joy and positive attitude seems to come by itself the more I meditate or stay "present" with less attachments to thoughts and events.
"In today's rush we all think too much, seek too much, want too much and forget about the joy of just Being."
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby hanss » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:08 am

Sighclone wrote:Buddha was pretty clear on the need to end the cycle of birth and death (samsara.) And yet the Tibetan Rinpoches keep re-incarnating to the delight of the monks...

In a recent Satsang Mooji refers to Papaji who had said "this may be your only chance to wake up in a million years". Any more knowledge about this? Links?
"In today's rush we all think too much, seek too much, want too much and forget about the joy of just Being."
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby rideforever » Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:04 am

Webwanderer wrote:My sense is that neither the questioner, nor Tolle, actually addressed the LoA as taught by Abraham. Now it may be that they were addressing some other source of information on LoA, and if that is the case then both question and response may be more pertinent. WW

Yes indeed. And the question was clearly asked.

The answer is clear : he is NOT linking the two.

In fact what he talks of (for instance with the writing of the books) ... was that they wanted to come. In other words : he wasn't preferring a reality where he was a writer. But that the books themselves wanted to come - in fact he had become the hand of God acting through him.

He was NOT choosing a reality. He was NOT deciding that he preferred a reality with him being famous.

Tolle had released all doing, and had become the hand of God.

This is clear. And clearly very different from LOA.

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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby smiileyjen101 » Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:31 am

Ah, but if we are conscious of being the willing hand of god, what then?

http://bible.cc/luke/11-9.htm
New International Version (©1984)
"So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.

New Living Translation (©2007)
"And so I tell you, keep on asking, and you will receive what you ask for. Keep on seeking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and the door will be opened to you.

English Standard Version (©2001)
And I tell you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

International Standard Version (©2008)
So I say to you: Keep asking, and it will be given you. Keep searching, and you will find. Keep knocking, and the door will be opened for you,

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
“I am also saying to you, Ask and it shall be given to you, seek and you shall find, knock and it will be opened to you.”

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
"So I tell you to ask, and you will receive. Search, and you will find. Knock, and the door will be opened for you.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

American King James Version
And I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you.

American Standard Version
And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given you: seek, and you shall find: knock, and it shall be opened to you.

Darby Bible Translation
And I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given to you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you.

English Revised Version
And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

Webster's Bible Translation
And I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and the door shall be opened to you.

Weymouth New Testament
"So I say to you, 'Ask, and what you ask for shall be given to you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and the door shall be opened to you.'

World English Bible
"I tell you, keep asking, and it will be given you. Keep seeking, and you will find. Keep knocking, and it will be opened to you.

Young's Literal Translation
and I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given to you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you;


It's not the 'thing' / material, but the experience that is the gift.

Matthew 7:7 "Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.

Luke 11:10 For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby Webwanderer » Sat Jul 07, 2012 3:52 am

In fact what he talks of (for instance with the writing of the books) ... was that they wanted to come. In other words : he wasn't preferring a reality where he was a writer. But that the books themselves wanted to come - in fact he had become the hand of God acting through him.

He was NOT choosing a reality. He was NOT deciding that he preferred a reality with him being famous.

Tolle had released all doing, and had become the hand of God.

This is clear. And clearly very different from LOA.

Maybe not so clear as you suggest. Tolle stated, long before he wrote Power of Now, that he felt he was ready for more, to offer more. It was after he showed a definite interest in doing more in the form of teaching that the books began to come. Did his clarity of interest not attract the flow of Source energy that became his books. That he became famous just came with the territory. If he had wanted to avoid his notoriety he could have written autonomously.

Maybe he's enjoying himself.

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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby rideforever » Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:38 am

No, I think it is clear that TPON is not LOA. And any attempt to link them is just wishful thinking.

If you desire something, you are living in the future. And Tolle in this extract really makes clear what 'desire' is when you are the hand of God. It is no longer your desire.

I just saw a seminar by Tolle where he begins it by saying something like : "as we sit here we are not waiting for the seminar to begin, we are not waiting for anything". If you desire something you are waiting for something.


In terms of the practicalities of conveying the message of Truth to people, Osho also talked about following your inner desires - just like LoA. The big difference is that he also advocated 3 hours of meditation (Dynamic, Kundalini, and Vipassana) and studying awareness every day, so that your inner core was being developed. If you don't do the meditation then you are just even more lost - and indeed some people who 'followed' Osho did become more last ... and this is possibly why.

Thank you for the quotes from the Bible. Of course most people on the planet operate in this way. They just walk around the world wanting things. This is called unconsciousness.

How many Christian priests are currently being prosecuted for raping young children around the world ? 5000 in many countries ?

Certainly the Bible and Christianity can be self-serving. You can make it justify anything you desire. This is the ego at work. If you see this and you want to break free I would suggest you do something different.
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby smiileyjen101 » Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:46 am

Isn't it ET that suggests the ego can make enemy, obstacle, means to an end of any person, thing, situation?
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Re: Eckhart on the Law of Attraction

Postby Webwanderer » Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:09 pm

rideforever wrote:No, I think it is clear that TPON is not LOA. And any attempt to link them is just wishful thinking.

What is the "Power" of now? In other words, what in living consciously in the now moment is powerful? Power to do what? Power to perceive how? And what is the origin of this power that is so available in the now. What is the point of being focused in now? Could alignment with our Source energy be a part of it?

In terms of the practicalities of conveying the message of Truth to people, Osho also talked about following your inner desires - just like LoA. The big difference is that he also advocated 3 hours of meditation (Dynamic, Kundalini, and Vipassana) and studying awareness every day, so that your inner core was being developed. If you don't do the meditation then you are just even more lost..

Are you aware that the teachings of LoA include meditation as a key part of a valuable practice? And what is the purpose of meditation in any case? Is it to think deeply about this or that? Or is it to quiet the mind? And if it's to quiet the mind, then what is the purpose of quieting the mind? Is to gain clarity of being by perceiving the now moment free of the clutter and distraction of automatic/conditioned thought? Could it also be to align with one's true beingness to allow conscious expansion in order to perceive life from a greater perspective?

There is no escape from Universal Laws. LoA operates in our lives regardless of our understanding of it or not. It does so either consciously or unconsciously. It follows our focus of attention either intentional or by default. It makes no distinction. As it is not possible in this human experience to live life totally devoid of thought, it would seem wise to choose as best we can the nature of those thoughts. Quieting the mind is a primary step to applying a quality of thought that brings more joy and happiness to our experience as compared to emotionally reactive thoughts generated by a more egoic perspective.

Quieting the mind is imperative to making peace with what is in order to refocus our attention (and the natural energy that flows through that attention) toward a more preferable experience. This is the conscious application of LoA working as the power in the clarity of now.

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