Another Reminder from ET

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Another Reminder from ET

Postby Sighclone » Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:58 pm

This is current as of March 22, 2012 -- from Eckhart TV

You are not IN the universe, you ARE the universe, an intrinsic part of it. Ultimately you are not a person, but a focal point where the universe is becoming conscious of itself. What an amazing miracle.


Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby ashley72 » Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:41 pm

Hi Andy,

This is a great reminder. 

I would like to share with others my direct-looking in relation to Tolle's pointer above.

When I look outwards at There, a "me" with a head and body seems to arise HERE. So the world arises, and to get over THERE from HERE takes the perception of time.

Now, when I now turn the arrow of attention 180 degrees back to where the head resides (in time). I look inwards. From HERE, I lose my head... And THERE now seems like HERE. The world now appears inside of "me". However, for this appperception to occur, a pherpherial "inviolated level" is directly sensed around this outer world which is now within. I call it an inviolated pherpherial (discontinuity)... It's a mysterious or invisible boundary. This invisible boundary is unmoving and always HERE.... but extremely subtle and unnoticed. It is obscured by a tangled hierarchy that Amit Goswami refers to in his book "The Self-Aware Universe". 

A tangled hierarchy
requires self-reference, i.e two different perceptions of the same "object" separated by degrees. One perception is primary and another apperception is secondary, both feeding one another in a strange loop. The first sets the context for the secondary apperception, which redefines the primary perception... creating a contradiction or paradox. 

In this case 180 degrees from a perception of a head to a apperception of no-head. 

In all of this direct looking a mysterious discontinuity is noticed or more accurately "sensed" at the periphery... Which is invisible... an inviolated level. This dicontinuity obscures the union between HERE and THERE... as Amit says it acts like a veil. 
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby Sighclone » Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:24 am

Excellent stuff, headless one!!

I will supplement this post later with a quote from Rupert Spira's new book "Presence" which directly addresses the phenomenon of the body. He emphasizes the seamlessness of the body and the universe and the Self, and, moreover, that that seamless quality can be sensed.

Also, when Philip Kalpleau was grilled by his Zen Masters, one of the Zen koans was "Are you in the Universe or is the Universe in You?" I can think of all sorts of cutesy responses including " There is no 'me' to be anywhere," or " 'in' implies duality (i.e. if I am 'in' the universe, then there is a separation) therefore the question itself is false" or, my favorite, is Albert Low's response to me when I sent him the question: "What universe?" -- made me laugh out loud.

Anyway - when I get home, I'll expand with Rupert's take...

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby ashley72 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:01 am

Andy,

Can this two-way seeing be examined with a very simple equation?

This is what I've managed to come up with.....

In the "The Self-Aware Universe" Amit Goswami uses imaginary numbers to resolve a paradox within the real numbers "system".

The real numbers paradox is: (if you try and find the square root of -1 on a calculator you get an error)

Image


To understand the paradox better, Amit Goswami first put the equation into this form,

Image


If you substitute either a -1 or 1 into X you get a contradiction.

Basically the only way to resolve this equation is to introduce rotation operation on a real number axis. Two rotations in either direction is -1: it brings us back into the “regular” dimensions of positive and negative numbers.

Image


Image

Therefore a new axis called the imaginary axis was introduced called i. Whereby an imaginary number is a real number multiplied by the imaginary unit i, which is defined by its property i2 = −1


Let's now take this a little further......

Now suppose we replace 1 with the word “whole”. What is the opposite of “whole”? Well, if we divided the "whole" by two... we would get a Duality.

Therefore, whole . X^2 = Duality

so using a rotation operation like above we can do the following:

whole x 180 degrees rotation = Duality.

What is the Duality? “Me” in the “World” of course

Whole x 180 degrees of rotation = Me in the World

Whole = "Me" in the "World" divided by 180 degrees of rotation.

Therefore, 180 degrees of “Looking” is required to “Sense” the Whole!!!!

Now consider this from A Course in Consciousness and relate it to 180 degrees of rotation.

a. Thought always results in inseparable pairs of concepts (dual pairs) because every
thought has an opposite.
b. Reality is apparently split into dual pairs by thought. However, no thought is real since
Reality cannot be split.
c. The result of apparently splitting Reality into dual pairs of concepts is called duality.
d. The two concepts of a pair are always inseparable because the merger of the
opposites will cancel the pair.
e. Example: "I"/not-"I" is a dual pair of concepts. If the "I" and not-"I" merge, neither
concept remains


Therefore, two-way looking (180 deg rotation) merges the pair, so neither concept remains!

Another form of this equation would be:

Non-Duality = Duality divided by 180 degrees of rotation
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby snowheight » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:20 am

you ARE the universe, an intrinsic part of it.


Andy,

Infinity-in-a-box and the-world-turned inside out are two of the imperfect conceptual pointers I like to throw around. I love how ET just softball-slides the paradox through to his reader ... the inevitable consequence of naming the nameless.
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby Sighclone » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:11 am

Goswami is a strong science-based nondualist -- he spoke at SAND I.

I have less of a problem with duality/nonduality than I do with form and formlessness, although they emerge from the same fundamental conceptual paradox. As soon as we label anything as separate from anything else, the entire world of relativity is introduced, along with its dissection tool, the rational mind...to "help" us. Heidegger helps us a little:

“A person is not a thing or a process but an opening through which the absolute manifests.”


This is to say that the "forms" and all the tools to relate with it emerge along with and through the "opening" which we, and these very sensory bodies are remarkably well-suited to interact with. Forms, separate selves, ideologies, philosophies, and other ideas are only illusory when there is another recognized or realized perspective making them so. In their purely self-referential universe, they are very real. It is only in backwater forums like this one, and in the work of a small collection of writers and teachers where a larger "reality" which can be experienced is introduced and discussed. But fortunately, we have this sneaky little tool called "the present moment" which is available to everyone to get a glimpse of pure awareness.

It is as though the 'Guy in the Sky' got bored with the immanence of awareness and wound Himself up real tight and then just exploded 15 billion years ago. And the little pieces of Him/Her started to gather back together...of course, since they all came from their Source, they were never really separate from it, because the "space" which separates the pieces also emerged from the same Source. So we are like swimming around in this exotic minestrone.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby snowheight » Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:36 pm

Sighclone wrote: Forms, separate selves, ideologies, philosophies, and other ideas are only illusory when there is another recognized or realized perspective making them so.


The truth that there is no "I" is balanced in the paradox by the truth that there is a "you".

The frustration about not being present enough that we see expressed so often seems to be this hopeless wish to send back a bowl of soup that has no edges. How can we possibly step outside of the skin of our body, our Earth, this perceived reality labeled the Universe? The mind senses the fallacy of the separation. This can't be dominated. This can't be be-friended. Anxiety results. It's o.k. ... form simply is. Let the poor beast rest.

Thanks for that Andy. Wei Cool.
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby Donna » Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:27 pm

snowheight wrote:How can we possibly step outside of the skin of our body, our Earth, this perceived reality labeled the Universe? The mind senses the fallacy of the separation. This can't be dominated. This can't be be-friended.


This is why different forms of meditation are being practiced? I would not want to dominate, but feel close to nature again whenever I get a chance. Our modern society has fostered a disconnection, therefore, our acute senses that helped us once 'step outside' and not feel separated may be lacking.

Interesting choice of words...'let poor beast rest'...
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby smiileyjen101 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 2:10 am

This is what happens when you live it -

http://www.wimp.com/wecould/
Our rights start deep within our humanity; they end where another's begin~~ SmileyJen
http://www.balancinginfluences.com
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby ashley72 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 3:30 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:This is what happens when you live it -

http://www.wimp.com/wecould/


Jen, Thanks for sharing that video. Certainly puts life's purpose... into the right perspective. :D
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby ashley72 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:05 am

smiileyjen101 wrote:This is what happens when you live it -

http://www.wimp.com/wecould/


I was compelled to find the donation page relating to this video => http://www.akshayatrust.org/donation.php

In a nutshell, you can feed 425 destitute human beings (1 meal per day) with as little as $150 US dollar donation. So I made the plunge and made a $150 donation thru paypal today. That simple. Thank you Jen for posting that video and pulling the right compassionate string. :D

I'm sure Andy won't mind a small detour from the main thrust of his thread. :wink:
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby snowheight » Mon Mar 26, 2012 9:39 am

Donna wrote:
snowheight wrote:How can we possibly step outside of the skin of our body, our Earth, this perceived reality labeled the Universe? The mind senses the fallacy of the separation. This can't be dominated. This can't be be-friended.


This is why different forms of meditation are being practiced? I would not want to dominate, but feel close to nature again whenever I get a chance. Our modern society has fostered a disconnection, therefore, our acute senses that helped us once 'step outside' and not feel separated may be lacking.

Interesting choice of words...'let poor beast rest'...


:) I have fun playing with words, thanks for noticing.

I wouldn't link the lack of possibility of mental accord on the fallacy of our separation with practice except indirectly -- maybe that's a motivation for some folks to practice, I don't want to speculate on that ... what I was getting at there was that the mind can attempt to explain our oneness with all things but a logical counter-point will always emerge. Abandoning reason we can fall back onto any one of a myriad of spiritual constructs, and while some can ride these to the grave for others they have a tendency to wither and fade.

So to clarify, what I meant was that there's no neat intellectual construct (a domination) or a universal supernatural meme (befriending) that's guaranteed to last for everyone in all cases for all times to quiet the mind on the issue.

That's o,k. :)

I love the outdoors for getting in touch with it too Donna. These day it doesn't even have to be anyplace special ... I just look up at the sky and if you can see enough of it you can perceive the curvature of the Earth and catch the briefest of realization that, in this moment, you're her eyes looking out into infinity as the Universe, in turn, drinks in a beauty that has no edges.
Stop talking. Hear every sound as background. Look straight ahead and focus. Take one deep breath. This is you. This is Now.
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby Sighclone » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:39 pm

Who could argue with the deep service offered by Akshaya -- great links, smiiley and ash. The link to Akshayausa is here:
http://www.akshayausa.org/, and their paypal donation tab is on the right.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby Donna » Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:37 pm

snowheight wrote:
Interesting choice of words...'let poor beast rest'...


:) I have fun playing with words, thanks for noticing.

I wouldn't link the lack of possibility of mental accord on the fallacy of our separation with practice except indirectly -- maybe that's a motivation for some folks to practice, I don't want to speculate on that ... what I was getting at there was that the mind can attempt to explain our oneness with all things but a logical counter-point will always emerge. Abandoning reason we can fall back onto any one of a myriad of spiritual constructs, and while some can ride these to the grave for others they have a tendency to wither and fade.


Well, yes, I have experienced this 'wither and fade' with spiritual constructs myself. It's like trying on or wearing clothes that are too tight (unfortunately for us women that happens way too frequently! Nice also on occasion to feel them too loose, but I digress,...sorry heh)... shedding what feels uncomfortable allows space to try on something new. Most likely, this correlates with transformation. Snake shedding skin, snake cannot grow new skin until old skin gone.

snowheight wrote:So to clarify, what I meant was that there's no neat intellectual construct (a domination) or a universal supernatural meme (befriending) that's guaranteed to last for everyone in all cases for all times to quiet the mind on the issue.

That's o,k. :)


Yes, I like that as well.

snowheight wrote:...you're her eyes looking out into infinity as the Universe, in turn, drinks in a beauty that has no edges.


Beautiful! :D I'm there!

Which brings me back to the quote Andy so sweetly plucked (feeling the vibes even more so now!):
You are not IN the universe, you ARE the universe, an intrinsic part of it. Ultimately you are not a person, but a focal point where the universe is becoming conscious of itself. What an amazing miracle.


I am not wanting to put a meaning on this for you, snowheight, but for me, your vision is really cool...the "beast," .... the very core physical nature of being on this planet,...without 'mind'... in rest....

Flapping arms running along the seashore 'flying,' being seagull, seeing through my seagull eyes, feeling the wind support and play with my wings....my ruffled feathers.

Standing near the water's edge, gently rocking back and forth, knowing the same energy that is doing this to me is what's moving the ebb and flow of the tide.

Instead of feeling a grains of sand on the bottom of my feet, feeling feet standing on me.

I am fast water, moving quickly over rocks, debris,..wow! the scenery is moving so quickly! a mish mash of colors!

This paperclip feels hard, yet really...is it just a bunch of soft molecules squooshed together held by two fingers that feels the squooshy hardness?

And oh! If I could stay in these moments longer or move into different ones (my form of meditation)...Being the Universe, Being I AM,...alas, this body may wither away? It seems I have a responsibility as this form (beast with mind) without forgetting who I truly am.
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Re: Another Reminder from ET

Postby snowheight » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:59 pm

Thanks Donna ... really nice. :)
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