"Gay" forcing me out of unconsciousness

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yougarksooo
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"Gay" forcing me out of unconsciousness

Post by yougarksooo » Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:59 am

Tolle says in a New Earth that being gay often forces a person out of unconsciousness. And that can lead to re-identifying too strongly as a gay person and then that becomes "who you are."

I experienced this myself. Growing up attracted to other men made be feel like an alien. Once I came out, I identified too strongly for years with my homosexuality. That was who I was. As a result, anything that anyone said which could be construed as ignorant or homophobic or even slightly anti-gay was seen by me as a threat to who I was, something I needed to attack the person on and defend myself from. I was overly sensitive and fragile in that identity. Also, before the shift, being gay, coming out, the "struggle" for acceptance, the people who were "homophobic" was one big story I was telling myself and others. I was lost in that. Straight people were the "others."

Eventually, I believe that, along with some other events, forced me into the shift in consciousness. I was ready.

Now, of course, being gay is not who I am. It is my sexual orientation. Such freedom in that. As a result, I simply don't get offended much anymore when I hear slurs. I'm not caught up so much in the collective effort for gay rights. As Tolle says, anything you oppose you strengthen. I'm more interested in continuing to know who I am beyond form and egoic identity. Although I do give some money to certain advocate groups, my main focus is on being present. I have no idea who I am on the level of form and I'm comfortable with that today. But I know who I am on the deeper level. And that makes all the difference when it comes to self-acceptance and acceptance by others.

Interested in knowing if anyone wants to share on topic?
"When people ask me who they are or who God is, I smile inside and whisper to the light: there you go again . . . pretending."

Adya

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Re: "Gay" forcing me out of unconsciousness

Post by Tin Soul » Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:26 pm

yougarksooo wrote:I have no idea who I am on the level of form and I'm comfortable with that today. But I know who I am on the deeper level.
Wow. I really like that openness. And by saying you have no idea who you are on the level of form, it's like you're making yourself flexible and adaptable to anything that may happen in life. Right away when I say that, my inner voice says, "Watch out, that could be dangerous, you'll be taken advantage of!" But I know that's just a mental 'little me' message.

In the last 6 years or so I've had almost every preconceived notion of my identity challenged. And I've been forced to re-work those ideas, until most recently when I began changing as a result of Tolle's books, and living just right now. It's funny because, standing back and looking at how my life has been going, I can see that it's a process. This is kind of a fanciful thing to say, but I almost feel I've been prepared and guided just for the purpose of finding Eckhart Tolle. And when I say that, I know that he is just another sign post, that I am being guided even further along even past him. And the final results are none of my business, because what is happening is where I'm at. I'm on a need to know basis, taking direction only from the intent of the universe for right now.

Just now I was going to make a sweeping statement about how everyone should just accept one another as brothers, but then it occurs to me that it's not even any of my business where anyone else is at on their inner path.

There was a time in my not too distant past when I would have rejected you because of my closed-mindedness. I now say wholeheartedly with all of my being that I accept you as you are, as my brother.
No me.

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Re: "Gay" forcing me out of unconsciousness

Post by eseward » Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:34 pm

Tin Soul wrote:I now say wholeheartedly with all of my being that I accept you as you are, as my brother.
I second the motion. :)

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Post by weichen » Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:22 pm

yougarksooo wrote:. That was who I was. As a result, anything that anyone said which could be construed as ignorant or homophobic or even slightly anti-gay was seen by me as a threat to who I was, something I needed to attack the person on and defend myself from. I was overly sensitive and fragile in that identity
Thank you yougarksooo,
In a way, you speak much better than Eckhart, because he was not gay and he was not speaking directly from his own experience.

Reading your post also is very helpful to me to be more conscious.

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Post by completeinthenow » Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:59 pm

yougarksoo, thank you for your post, I can relate as I am a gay man too who went through the same process.

I was gay and if you didn't accept me something was wrong you. AND I would have nothing but disdain for your closemindedness. I was right and you were wrong.

And too be honost I still get that feeling now and again when I detect homophobia. I've even spent a good number of years being heterophobic towards men.

I am not a gay man, I am Spirit expressing itself through a human dynamic that happens to include being gay.


Peace Is With Us

Israel
"Only what is loving is true." A Course in Miracles

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Post by yougarksooo » Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:27 pm

I am not a gay man, I am Spirit expressing itself through a human dynamic that happens to include being gay.
Nicely put. You can say that to some gay and lesbian people and they respond that you are in denial. "Of course you are a gay man. That is who you are. Don't deny that," they might say in so many words, not seeing the difference or seeing it as just wordplay. But you are pointing to something deeper about who you are and I feel that. I know exactly what you mean and the freedom in that is hard to put into words. I think most on here sense what you are saying, gay or straight or black or white or whatever we tend to call ourselves on the level of form. It feels light. No longer carrying that heavy gay identity. And sure, sometimes the old pain arises in me when someone says something that is "anti-gay," but I watch that voice as I do all others. Thanks.
"When people ask me who they are or who God is, I smile inside and whisper to the light: there you go again . . . pretending."

Adya

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Post by heidi » Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:38 pm

I think any sort of identification with a self image can be applied to this very good discussion. We could replace gay with black, Jewish, female, internet forum moderators :lol: especially in circumstances when others outside of yourself have decided that your ID is "wrong" in some way because it goes against some belief they are identified with; so the ego gets hackles up and wants to defend the identification.

Since the '60s, I had identified with being a peace activist. And as I became more conscious of it - what peace really is - I tend to distance myself from those so vehemently identified with what's wrong in the world, finger pointers, anti-war people, because peace isn't about being against anything - it's a state of acceptance, of allowing. (Granted I speak out for justice all the time, but it comes from a different place now.)

Thanks so much for your honest and thoughtful posts. :)

Oh goody - you have given me an opportunity to quote one of my most favorite quotes that I now identify with!

Outside the ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing
there is a field; I'll meet you there.
(Rumi)
Heidi
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wonderment on the third wave

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Post by yougarksooo » Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:02 pm

Heidi wrote:
Since the '60s, I had identified with being a peace activist. And as I became more conscious of it - what peace really is - I tend to distance myself from those so vehemently identified with what's wrong in the world, finger pointers, anti-war people, because peace isn't about being against anything - it's a state of acceptance, of allowing. (Granted I speak out for justice all the time, but it comes from a different place now.)
Thanks. Right, anything we oppose we strengthen. Same goes for gay rights. The collective egoic identity known as the gay and lesbian community may or may not have been necessary in terms of form in order to bring awareness to a silent group, in the beginning. But the push/pull that is going on now between that community and other collective egoic identities (some aspects of the far right, for example) does not seem to be helpful towards peace and acceptance. Both sides seem just to polarize each other into rigid, un-budging mental positions, further strengthening their identities, which were false to begin with.

Thanks for sharing your perspective. And yes I think this discussion is much broader than just gay/straight. I welcome others to share on stepping out of thought patterns.
"When people ask me who they are or who God is, I smile inside and whisper to the light: there you go again . . . pretending."

Adya

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Post by wwooten » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:35 pm

Thank you for this thread. There have been some wonderful posts.

What arises for me is the collective consciousness around "what gay means"....and the evolution in consciousness around this "label"...

Since, none of it is "personal".....I get a chance to peer into the collective and see what is there.....each body brain organism has been conditioned to function in the totality according to a complex web of....genetic and environmental influences.........it's not personal.....

The evolution of consciousness has revealed so much about the sexual orientation and the experience of "gay".......because individuals have been willing to have open dialog around it.......I am grateful for the dialog and openness....

The inner suffering, the inner conflict, the torture that can happen in an individual......in relationship to the collective...... was clearly revealed when a leading, "Christian Evangelical" in Colorado was exposed.....here is a man who is held captive by a "conditioned pattern" of rightness and wrongness concerning the gay experience.....while he, himself....was hiding his behavior.....suppressing his feelings with drugs.....living a "double life" if you will.....and later going to "rehab" to "fix" it, as if it is a problem.....and then having the need to confess that he is heterosexual after 3 weeks of "rehab".....and the so-called problem is now repaired......

This exposes the severe conflict.....the insanity.....the inner suffering......the pain....around the label of "gay"..... at this period in the evolution of consciousness............

My heart goes out to all who suffer in this context....

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Post by yougarksooo » Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:26 pm

The inner suffering, the inner conflict, the torture that can happen in an individual......in relationship to the collective...... was clearly revealed when a leading, "Christian Evangelical" in Colorado was exposed.....here is a man who is held captive by a "conditioned pattern" of rightness and wrongness concerning the gay experience.....while he, himself....was hiding his behavior.....suppressing his feelings with drugs.....living a "double life"
Yes, his was a form of resistance to what he was experiencing inside, I suppose. Isn't that what the "closet" is---just resistance to what is. He was also struggling against this identificaton with the collective form of "gay" as a mind made identity. He was saying, "that is NOT who I am." There is great turmoil in that struggle of "me."

Although he had the opportunity to realize who he truly is beyond the resistance and the identities (gay, straight, Christian etc), it seems instead he simply found a different identity---"cured, straight, Christian, former homosexual." Whatever words you want to put to it. That is not who he is either, of course. But his unconsciousness clouded his ability to see that and step out of the dream. That story is like so many other stories, only the content is different.

The truth to see in all this, for me, is that gay is not a problem, nor is straight a problem, only the mind makes it into one. This huge battle that is going on internally in people (to define themselves in one way or the other, to take on this identity or resist that one) as well as the "external" battle (us v. them, gay v. Christian right), seems like a big waste of energy, to put it mildly. It's much easier to just live in the now and drop all that mental movement no matter what its content is. Anything we resist, we strengthen in ourselves and/or in the other.
"When people ask me who they are or who God is, I smile inside and whisper to the light: there you go again . . . pretending."

Adya

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Post by wwooten » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:06 pm

The truth to see in all this, for me, is that gay is not a problem, nor is straight a problem, only the mind makes it into one. This huge battle that is going on internally in people (to define themselves in one way or the other, to take on this identity or resist that one) as well as the "external" battle (us v. them, gay v. Christian right), seems like a big waste of energy, to put it mildly. It's much easier to just live in the now and drop all that mental movement no matter what its content is.
That say's it all.......thank you for the pointer.........

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Gay so what does that mean for my salvasion

Post by Sharon » Wed Apr 08, 2009 8:32 pm

I am not new to being gay, ever since I remember as a child I was alway attracted to my girlfriends and later at uni I engaged into a relationship with another woman which laster for 6 years. Guilt and pressure from myself and family members who are very religious ended up in me getting married and thought that I things will all just go away. Well after 16 years of marriage which ended and the journey that I went through the past 2 years of rediscovering myself I had to admit that I am still gay. What makes us gay, i di not label or assosiate myself with it, and what happens to people like us die. According to the church which I do not attent any more because after reading Eckhart Tolle and Dr Wayne Dyers books it is not true, Can someone please explain this to me. Thnx any books that I can read or advice from someone

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Re:

Post by karmarider » Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:19 am

heidi wrote:I think any sort of identification with a self image can be applied to this very good discussion. We could replace gay with black, Jewish, female, internet forum moderators...
Good point. A very strong identity trap that many people create is that of being "spiritual." It's a very validating identity, and difficult to get out of.Tolle warns of this, and other teachers do as well.

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Re: Gay so what does that mean for my salvasion

Post by karmarider » Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:25 am

Sharon wrote:...what happens to people like us die...
What will happen to you when you die is the same thing that will happen to six billion other people and trillions of other lives...it won't be better or worse because you're gay. Relax, and enjoy the present.

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Re:

Post by karmarider » Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:30 am

wwooten wrote:.....each body brain organism has been conditioned to function in the totality according to a complex web of....genetic and environmental influences.........it's not personal....
Well said. Where we do seem to have a choice is to be present or not, conscious or not, aware or not. Whether the openness to realize this choice is part of the complex web of influences--that's an interesting, undecidable question.

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