clarifying ego

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+Jim+
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clarifying ego

Post by +Jim+ » Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:22 pm

Ego is a collection of images you have of yourself which you don't realise are just images.
Many of the images can be contradictory.

Much of the self-help industry is about helping people enhance the positive images and reduce or negate the negative.

When there is an insight into the nature of thought/image making, then the illusion of ego ends.

Many people get caught up in the idea of the ego dying, or killing the ego, or talk about the ego as if it is an entity - it's not, it's just an illusion.

Here's an analogy:
A woman returns home from work at night and goes to the kitchen to prepare supper.
She looks through the window into her dark back garden and see a man lurking in the shadows by the garden shed....... her heartbeat increases and she starts to sweat..... "oh my god" she says to herself, "I'm here all alone and I don't know when my husband will be back". She looks around the kitchen and wonders whether she prefers to hold a knife or whether she should hide them so they can't be used against her. She wonders how fast the police will arrive if she can only remember where she left her mobile.... "Will the glass back door keep him out?"..... She jumps with a fright as she hears a sound behind her.... only to collapse sobbing into the arms of her bemused husband who has just arrived home. He cautiously unlocks the kitchen door and reaches for the outside light. Light suddenly floods the garden and the man lurking by the shed turns out to be a pile of old boxes and bags of rubbish.


The message is probably clear..... but just to clarify.
The lurking man never existed, but before the woman realised this she was acting and believing as if he did. "Will he hurt me? Can I defend myself? What does he want? Will he run if he hears the police coming?" etc. etc.
But when her husband returned home, he didn't have to fight off, or scare or chase the lurking man because he never existed outside of the illusion that he existed.

It was simply an error of perception and all that was necessary to correct it was to bring light to it.
In the same way, the illusion of ego ends when it is investigated...... but it must be seen clearly by oneself..... the words of others in no way can illuminate..... this must be done by each one of us.

Most importantly, until the truth of this is realised, then to say that the ego is an illusion, becomes just a concept to debate and get confused about.
Intellectual understanding is totally inadequate for meeting daily life.
It's like attempting to nourish yourself on the memory of yesterday's lunch!


http://simplyenlightening.wordpress.com/about/

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kiki
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Re: clarifying ego

Post by kiki » Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:33 pm

Great post. One of the most misunderstood ideas is that the "ego must die or be killed". This itself is ego talking, for what else except ego would think such a thing? The ego isn't a real entity - yes, it is present at times, but it isn't you, it isn't what you are, and it will fade away when it is seen through for the illusion that it is and return when it is useful. One must investigate to discover this for oneself otherwise it just turns into another concept to get lost in.

+Jim+'s words are worth repeating:
It was simply an error of perception and all that was necessary to correct it was to bring light to it.
In the same way, the illusion of ego ends when it is investigated...... but it must be seen clearly by oneself..... the words of others in no way can illuminate..... this must be done by each one of us.

Most importantly, until the truth of this is realised, then to say that the ego is an illusion, becomes just a concept to debate and get confused about.
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
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RHRippere
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Ego Wants to Remain Camouflaged

Post by RHRippere » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:28 am

+Jim+'s words bear repeating:
Many people get caught up in the idea of the ego dying, or killing the ego, or talk about the ego as if it is an entity - it's not, it's just an illusion.
______________

The ego is clever and crafty: It does not wish to be observed. It can sustain itself, its unchallenged existance, so long as we all believe it is just an illusion. My ego is its own selfish, separate little animal - a demon. Not an illusion at all. I have looked back over my life and I can see how the ego has been hungry for attention, hungry to be recognized (but not exposed or discovered)!

Observed, the ego is undermined and can be contained - but not destroyed. And, like the mind, the ego can be a tool to navigate this world, to relate and to solve problems we could not otherwise handle without it. By observing the ego, by honoring that it is its own and not an illusion, I can recover some control of it and limit its otherwise destructive effect.

But it is real, it is separate, it is impish - not illusion.

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Sighclone » Sun Jul 13, 2008 8:02 pm

Welcome RHRippere! Great posts, all three - we look forward to more from you!

* * * * *

Ooooo :) ...intelligent, sensitive, alert, articulate people approaching a disagreement about "what is (or is not) the ego." It's all good. My take is this: the ego exists. Eckhart agrees. But I am not my ego. What I am contains my ego, and my painbody, and my mind, and my pancreas and my memories. The next step in defining what I am is a little harder to swallow: I contain that chair over there, I contain the moon, I contain all of mathematics, I contain you...in short, I am that.

Kiki, +Jim+ and Adya are on one side of the "illusory vs. real" ego conundrum; Eckhart, RHRippere, and I are on the other. But ultimately it's all semantics. An illusory ego can still have great impact, power and durability. (How many opinions, unsupported by fact, have led to disastrous personal decisions? 'False' or 'illusory' entities are not powerless.) I think we all agree, though, that however we label the ego, its components, habits, structure and content, do not lead us to Self-realization.

Ramana encourages us to continue to ask "Who am I?" What is impressive to me about that question is not so much the discovery that I am not my ego, but that the act of asking that question validates the power and perception of the asker. There is a kind of solipsistic Self-discovery that occurs when we ask that ultimate question.

Namaste, Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by GlowingFaceMan » Mon Jul 14, 2008 3:21 am

One of the ego's most insidious masks is the "egoless mask". If someone says, "I have no ego, I destroyed it", that's their ego talking. Ironic...

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by opt » Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:46 am

....EGO is a part of all human interaction, thought and action in verying degrees. I find ET's ideas/ views on EGO the most valuable and interesting.

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RHRippere
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Caffeine & Ego

Post by RHRippere » Sat Aug 16, 2008 7:39 am

On days when I have ego-action-packed meetings to attend, I notice my ego, and others', get more air-time the more coffee we have.

I had been thinking that I and my ego are separate and when I step back from it to observe it, I am better able to keep it quiet and well-behaved.

Perhaps at the same time caffeine is exciting my ego, it also impairs my ability to be present and just observe - Ego takes advantage and starts making all kinds of attention and entertainment for itself.

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Onceler » Sat Aug 16, 2008 1:15 pm

RHRippere,

I agree about caffiene. It seems to be jet fuel for my ego, and emotions at times. It excites my thinking and emotional state, sometimes creating anxiety. I tend to cut people off when talking in meetings, etc. I am trying to keep coffee to a minimum and it seems to help with entering presence as you suggested.

Interestingly, I attended a conference on psychotropic medications and the presenter talked a lot about the link between caffeine and depression. It seems that more than 250 mg. a day (and caffeine consumption after noon) interferes with the ability to get into the deep sleep states--stage four and five. This in turn affects mood over time...he has treated some people's depression simply by reducing their caffeine intake, thereby helping them enter restorative sleep states.

These are the sleep states where ET says we merge with source and our ego's dissolve, and where we recieve much of our life force....so, caffeine the anti-spirit drink?

(But I love coffee so much!)
Be present, be pleasant.

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Sighclone » Mon Aug 18, 2008 1:16 am

Eckhart drinks coffee - how much? Who knows... I like one cup in the AM, sometimes one more later in the day.

Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Remorse and Present Living?

Post by RHRippere » Thu Aug 28, 2008 5:40 am

Not wanting to pollute or allow my ego to leave a messy wake in relationships, I am sometimes remorseful for the unconscious manifestations I leave behind.

Is that ego? Living in the past, wanting to drag my free eternal nature backwards into an historic delusion? Or, not allowing the past to control the present, is it taking wise counsel from experience and so endeavoring to keep the present "clean"?

What is remorse? If it does not control me, it is wise counsel for the present. If it would control me, is it ego?

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Sighclone » Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:54 am

When there is a disconnect between intention and result, we can feel remorse. Often, though we can go back apologize, clarify our intention (first to ourself, then to the "other"), ask for forgiveness and try again. If love is at the center of our intention, and authentic service is our intention, it's not egoic.

(In my opinion...)

Namaste, Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by andy » Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:31 pm

Ego is the shadow, and presence is the ego pretending not to be the shadow.

Beware, the delusion is always in play.

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Sighclone » Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:38 pm

Here are some words by Dhyan Dewyea expanding (or contracting) on this:

The End of Longing

This self realization is not just another nice, powerful, or intriguing state like some of the ones which can happen on the inner journey. It does not go away. This is why it is not a state, because a state can change into some other state. Being at source is the precondition for all states. States belong to the manifest person. The source precedes all manifestation and is the same undivided One that underlies everyone and everything, whether it is known or not.

All this amounts to a qualitative and distinct leap in perception; as if the perception is moved from the head to the feet for the first time. But the body and its operating systems, its personality features, may not change — awakening is not about change.

There are people who might say ‘you had a spiritual experience, good for you.’ No, this is not another experience in a long succession of life experiences. An experience implies that there is an experiencer and something that is experienced — it belongs to the level of duality. There is no experiencer and nothing experienced in this. The experiencing, the observing, the watching subject, all fall back into pure subjectivity (another term for source). There is no one there anymore to have an experience.

Her website is beyond-the-i.com.

Namaste, Andy
A person is not a thing or a process, but an opening through which the universe manifests. - Martin Heidegger
There is not past, no future; everything flows in an eternal present. - James Joyce

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Re: clarifying ego

Post by Adahy » Sun Oct 19, 2008 4:54 pm

(~.~)
Last edited by Adahy on Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:36 am, edited 2 times in total.

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kiki
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Re: clarifying ego

Post by kiki » Sun Oct 19, 2008 5:08 pm

Habitually thoughts may turn to past or future but each time all I ever have to do is focus on that thought as it happens now. Then the reality of this moment then becomes restored and I'm at peace. So I would say that to me, when I believe in time, the ego appears real and when I enter this moment the ego is seen as an illusion.
Nice post, and great observation - you are right on the money.
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
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