Jesus's Resurrection

Talk about anything Tolle-related here.
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mistral
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Re: Can't Peddle To Heaven

Post by mistral » Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:58 pm

Here is a quote from mystic I once knew:

"Those who discover the absolute pathway must likewise let go that concept. We pay the utmost farthing. But, prior to that time, if we would have a lasting glimmer of truth at all, we pay for it with whatever we hold dearest. Unpaid for, the Truth proves no more meaningful in our affairs than we have been willing to value it."...William Samuel

and these too: "

".......Knowing the Truth, but is not a lifting up to the Light at all. It is much more a rapid stripping away of the mortal shell, leaving the Real exposed. It is an uncovering of the Light of Identity which has been here as 'us' all the while. It is the return of sensitivity in all its aspects. It is the CHILD uncovered again, stripped of all intellectual veneers. its worldly vestures ripped away. Without doubt this work appears to uncover the Child we are and we stand naked, exposed, defenseless, hypersensitive, our perception extremely acute again."...William Samuel

"Show me a true vision of heaven and I'll show you a
descent into hell wherein that vision was tried, tested and found faithful." .... William Samuel

As far as I know, he is right, something we held as very dear must be sacrificed...

Love, Mistral

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RHRippere
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Abraham and Isaac

Post by RHRippere » Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:13 am

Dear Mistral:

This reminds me of the time Abraham felt God had called on him to give up what was most important, most precious to him: Abraham proceeded up the Mount with his only firstborn son, Isaac, and prepared himself to sacrifice his own son! The Bible even recounts how Isaac was made to carry the kindling on which he would be offered up as a burnt sacrifice (Gen. 22:6) to God.

God watches Abraham prepare to take the life of his own son -- and interrupts what must have been a disastrous misinterpretation, stopping Abraham from slaying Isaac and sending a ram instead for the sacrifice (Gen. 22:13).

Isaac represents Abraham's HOPE for the future, and BITTERNESS for a barren past. When God-Now asks us to give up our devotion to the PAST and FUTURE, he is really asking us to join Him in the Now, in the Present, in Him. I want to give up the ego's STORIES of the past, and its misinterpreted STORIES of the future and, instead, join the Now.

Thanks to you, Mistral!

Royce

Crystalrays
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by Crystalrays » Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:59 am

Awareness and perception caused me to question the egoic implications that a superior intelligence would ask or expect death as a proof of anything. So not only does the expectation that one ought to consider human sacrifice to be a display of presence now fill me with utter confusion, but also the idea that sacrificing animals can do the same.

I do not consider ancient human records to have any inspired 'now' value unless what they speak of resists analysis without effort.

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RHRippere
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by RHRippere » Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:22 pm

It's not that "killing something" demonstrates presence - it's, as William Samuel says, "paying the utmost farthing" to demonstrate the value of what we hold dear.

With this mind, I cannot rationalize how killing an animal helps any kind of situation (other than hunger). I must also humbly admit I do not understand all things, do not comprehend all that Presence does, all that occurs Now, all that God orchestrates - however you wish to put it. If holding something up in surrender (or being willing to), if the act of setting it free or giving it "back" acts to define its value, to define what we hold dear so that we may better move on to the next thing and increase our awareness, then sacrifice we must.

RHRippere

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mistral
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by mistral » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:26 pm

Hasn't it always been the 'worst things' that have taught you the most....It has for me. I would not even have taken this path of searching for 'the Real, or at least some wisdom and understanding' had it not been for the difficulties that happened in the first palce. Life sometimes gives us what we need in a way that 'I would rather not learn from'. Wheather we like it or not we seemed forced to learn 'who we really are'...It just seem so me, at least in my life, that Life Itself does teach us through 'the painful stuff' and not so much through the nice, fun, I got it wired, kind of stuff'.... It is always the harsh lessons that or so called 'bad things' that wake me up, snap me to, put me back in The Light and urge me to Lift my Heart to The Light and Stay with This Living One. Turns out, of course, that the 'bad stuff' is actually 'good' in that it always 'reveals the Truth' to me, if I am willing and open and these 'events' seem to make me humble enough to 'see'.... So, maybe that is the 'surrender' or 'sacrifice' in some way...

I have always loved this following poem:


The Simple Words of a Confederate Soldier

I asked God for strength that I might achieve
I was made weak that I might learn humbly to obey

I asked for help that I might do greater things
I was given infirmity that I might do better things

I asked for riches that I might be happy
I was given poverty that I might be wise

I asked for all things that I might enjoy life
I was given life that I might enjoy all things

I got nothing that I asked for
Oh, but I got everything I had hoped for

Despite myself, my prayers were answered
I am, among all men, most richly blessed.

Anonymous---Confederate Soldier



Much Love, Misral

My Friend William Samuel has some really good 'papers' about all this: You can read some here:
http://www.williamsamuel.com/12-08-2001-jn.htm

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kiki
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by kiki » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:30 pm

I agree with your post, Mistral. Those who are having a "happy dream" have no incentive to awaken. Those whose dream world is filled with "suffering" have a clear motivation to find something else, and so will look for a deeper reality.
"Miss Kelly, perhaps you'd like this flower. I seem to have misplaced my buttonhole ... Miss Kelly, you know, when you wear my flower you make it look beautiful." Elwood P. Dowd
---

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boogeyman
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by boogeyman » Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:44 am

Joy wrote:So far Jesus's resurrection is the only thing in the Bible that I can think of that doesn't appear to be compatible with Tolle's books (at least not the audio books that I've listened to). Does anyone know what he says about this? Or does anyone have any ideas on how they could be compatible?

I ask because I know a few Christians who I think might be open to considering this philosophy, but if I can't make Jesus's resurrection make sense with it then they're not going to be open to considering it.
I've always seen it as the return of "Christ consciousness"

When Jesus said: "I will return", it makes sense when you look at it in the context of Tolles techings.
The "I" is not the physical body of Jesus, but consciousness itself, and Jesus embodied a "deeper" presence / consciousness

IMO, it simply means a "deeper" consciousness is going to return, but it is through us that it will manifest.

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NoordZee
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by NoordZee » Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:31 am

Kiki wrote:
I find it strangely ironic that so many "Christians" will accept on faith ideas that are more than two thousand years old (and which are seldom questioned) and rely on a future event for "redemption", yet they will resist the notion of experiencing what it is to be fully present in this moment (where "wholeness" is found), to experience the reality of what is actually here dancing before their senses without the distorting influence of mind and ego. Nearly everyone does this, but when one's religious background enters the picture suddenly a huge fear arises. Without realizing it most people are walking around completely hypnotized by their beliefs, especially religious/spiritual ones.
This resonates very much with me. I have wrestled with the concept of Christianity all my life. I have never liked the idea that you have to accept a set of beliefs in order to go to heaven. Nobody can be made to believe anything unless this person genuinely believes what he hears or learns. I think that a personal relationship with God constitutes a more viable proposition. I totally agree that fear is a weapon that has been and still is being used in the Christian religion and probably in other religions as well.
"Veritas vos liberabit"

opt
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by opt » Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:31 am

....there wouldn't necessarily be a conection to specifics in the Bible, unless for reference or example. He is quite careful to be politically correct. People that follow the Christian faith shouldn't have fear of finding anything anti-Christian.

Crystalrays
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Re: Jesus's Resurrection

Post by Crystalrays » Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:33 am

The operating of oneself completely from the mind is what they are doing, without ever realising their mind was imprinted with what it holds long before it was provided with the choice they are now faced with - to accpt or reject what is before them.It is immaterial whether they accept it or not. If they do they do - simple really!

Being present is unconditional on previous events. If they wish to confine themselves by past commentaries from certain pockest of humanity then that is their ego/pain bodies surfacing to posit conditions on the now they are in. Worldwide, such a mindset spurns conflicts repeatedly throughout human existence.

Becoming aware of the present dissolves the need for absolute attachment to concrete beliefs about past lives. And it leaves one open to the sacredness of all life and the beauty it instills in this very moment.

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