Vegetarian

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Vegetarian

Postby Trev » Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:43 pm

Hi All,
Just out of curiosity does anyone know if eckhart is vegetarian/vegan?. Also what is his attitude towards material things/money etc --- ie) does he live a materially simple life?
Thanks, Trev
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Onceler » Wed Mar 05, 2008 3:07 am

I believe he avoids making pronouncements about his lifestyle in order to keep people from imitating him and not finding their own truth. I think he suggests that we look inside ourselves, to the wisdom/intelligence of the body to discover what we should eat.

And how we should live materially. Everyone follows a different ____________________(fill in your favorite cliche)
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby entelechy » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:19 pm

Yes I read someone asked him specifically about his diet. This question was posted to him via the "Dear Eckhart" service on his website. ET responded by saying the body is intelligent enough to intuitively know what is harmful and not harmful, so ET said something like, "before ingesting any food, be still and feel how the body is responding to the food you are about to eat, and you will know the answer."

In my own experience this is very true. Whilst I have a very strong gut and immune system, I often feel bad/uncomfortable before, during and after eating foods like sweets, cakes, or any sugar-rich foods; meats; dairy products; fizzy drinks; alcoholic drinks; and any nuked (microwaved) foods. The feeling I get whenever I ingest these foods can actually be described almost like a feeling of guilt. This is because I often have a knowing sensation that they are not ideal for my body.
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby joeyayoub » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:01 pm

His answer was :
"I recommend listening to the body. When you look at a food item (or imagine ingesting it) become still and alert. You will then feel the body either opening up (saying “yes”) or you may notice a slight contraction, which means the body is saying “no”. The body knows more about food than your mind ever will."

So I honestly believe he is a vegetarian. I can't stand being in the presence of meat because I think about the innocent animal that was needlessly killed for me. I don't need that, I can live perfectly well without depending on another sentient being's life. I believe that Tolle feels the same way. It is my body as well as my inner soul that told me not to eat meat anymore. I can't imagine an enlightened person eating meat because he/she is more conscious than anyone that this meat is the result of needless pain and suffering and we can perfectly live without it. Choosing to have animals die for you is therefore a choice and not an obligation.
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby happns » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:52 pm

joeyayoub wrote:So I honestly believe he is a vegetarian. I can't stand being in the presence of meat because I think about the innocent animal that was needlessly killed for me. I don't need that, I can live perfectly well without depending on another sentient being's life. I believe that Tolle feels the same way. It is my body as well as my inner soul that told me not to eat meat anymore. I can't imagine an enlightened person eating meat because he/she is more conscious than anyone that this meat is the result of needless pain and suffering and we can perfectly live without it. Choosing to have animals die for you is therefore a choice and not an obligation.


Wow thanks joeyayoub for judging the rest of us on your beliefs - how about you change the food chain and make all creatures herbivores whilst you are at it... poses the question of whether plants suffer to huh... next thing you know we'll be PCing breathing LOL Sorry having you on :D
Here is a new spiritual practice for you... don't take your thoughts too seriously - Eckhart from Stillness Speaks
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby James » Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:19 am

I don't want to fan the flames of an egoic firestorm here :D , but If not mistaken, rumor has it that Tolle does eat meat, (as well as do many other awakened people). Eckhart speaks about how in nature animals eat one another and he refers to it as an act of love, the predator in a sense is honoring the prey, and absorbing it into its own being. There is a great book called Mutant Message Down Under, the author writes about her experiences with aborigines in the outback. When they hunt an animal for food, which is the primary source of nutrition for the aborigines in a barren place like the outback, they describe it as honoring the prey. Eating meat is a sacred experience for them as it is for other cultures.

There is only one life, so there is no loss of life, only changes in the forms of expression. Meat eating is just one more thing to be accepted about life on planet earth. If someone prefers a vegetarian diet, than so be it, enjoy.

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Re: Vegetarian

Postby joeyayoub » Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:09 pm

Sorry if I sounded weird or anything. I perfectly find it ok that anyone eats meat, that's not what I meant. There is, first of all, a difference between eating meat today than in a couple of hundred years ago. There is also a difference between having a control over our diet and eating anything in order to survive. I'm not talking about that and I'm sorry that I didn't express myself correctly. I don't know if he's a Veggie, and it doesn't make it anymore good if he was than meat eating is bad. I never judge
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Plorel » Sat Dec 13, 2008 6:43 pm

I don't know if Eckhart is Vegetarian. But I seem to think having read that Yoga masters who proceed on the journey to enlightment until total dileverance quit eating meal very soon because it contradicts one of the most important path of a Yogi, which is "Ahimsa". That means trying not to harm any living creature..
neither physically nor psychically. NOt by hand, thought or word. That is supposed to be excluding eating animals as well because as long as you keep hurting other beings directly or indirectly, you can never reach total liberation.
On another occasion I read that eating flesh from industrial livestock farming makes it difficult to experience stillness, due to all the things that happened to the flesh (adrenalin, medicaments, fear and panic of the animal) that are in it.

Thats only what I recall reading in some books. If it is true I don't know. But I like the idea that one should listen to his/her body to feel what is right,
though for me it is sometimes difficult to differentiate between what my mind needs and what my body needs.

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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Glycine » Sun Dec 14, 2008 8:58 pm

Before the food is ingested, the body needs the brain and the mind to analyze what's in front of it.
The brain and the mind are part of the body, they are not separate...
As ET says, we should try to listen to the body regarding the appropriateness of the food, but let's not forget that the body includes the brain.
Unfortunately, not all of us can be vegans.
Some people have to perform a lot of physical work, which is difficult if you only eat veggies.
On the other hand, we should honor the food that we eat, be it plant or animal, and we should not eat more than the body needs....
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Trev » Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:06 pm

Hi,
Just to add a few comments.

Cant believe that anyone still actually believes that veggies are somehow weaker than meat eaters!!! There are bodybuilders, weight lifters, tri athletes etc etc who are vegetarian or vegan yet compete at very high levels in their sports. Any nutrient that comes from meat can be gained from a vegetable source. From personal experience as a veggie for 19 yrs I competed in thai boxing and have climbed Mont Blanc -- not the actions of a weakling!!

As for it being a 'judgement' We must all make judgements on what is right or wrong. Should we accept war, muggings , rape , murder because it would be 'judging others' if we oppose it/them and say it is undoubtedly wrong. To condone the undoubted pain involved in battery farming , transportation and slaughter of other living things that feel pain and fear comes under that same category.

Its nothing to do with being PC. Its all about extending the circle of compassion to include beings that are not human.

Trev
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Glycine » Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:34 pm

I agree - we should reduce the consumption of meat as much as possible.
The main difference between meat and veggies is the amount (%) of essential amino acids.
Unfortunately, veggies contain low amounts of essential amino acids. I order to obtain the necessary amount, a lot more veggies have to be eaten (compared to meat).
Of course, metabolism varies widely from person to person - some people can go a long way on veggies alone.
Another issue - are plants so much different from animals just because they are quiet and don't move around a lot?

I am looking forward to the day when we can afford to synthesize our food in the lab from air and water! The technology already exists.
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Trev » Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:10 pm

My friend it just simply isnt true to say that you have to eat huge quantites of veggies to get enough protein. You seem to have swallowed whole (pardon the pun :) ) the myth that its difficult for a vegetarian to get enough protein in their diet. As a long standing vegetarian I can assure you this is not the case with lots of balanced high protein foods around eg) tempeh,tofu,quorn,quinoa to name a few and if not vegan eggs, milk cheese etc etc -- it really isnt difficult!

Regarding the comment about plants -- yes there is a huge difference. First is common sense -- do you REALLY think a turnip has the same amount of sentience as a pig. Also what would be the point in a plant having a nervous system if it cannot move to escape a painful stimulus.

Can I ask you what is the huge difference you see between animals and humans that allows use such dominance/tyranny over them to the extent that it gives us the right to keep them in un-natural surroundings/often very restricted surroundings then transport them for slaughter for the totally unnessesary purpose of using them for food. The ONLY reason anyone eats meat is that they like the taste and texture of flesh (and habit) -- I feel to seek another reason is no more than self justification as it is a totally unnessesary thing to do -- I and millions of other healthy vigorous individuals around the world who dont eat meat are proof of that fact.

Imagine if another alien species landed on earth which was more intelligent and powerful than humans and that this species decided it liked the taste of our flesh and herded us into farms to raise us for the purpose. (maybe with a bit of vivisection to cure their ills and hunting as they liked to see us run for our lives before they catch and kill us - thrown in). Remember all this just for THEIR own pleasure and benefits(no doubt justifiable to them) We would see them as the devil incarnate yet seem to totally fail to see that we have this same relationship with our fellow creatures.

I do despair slightly when such an absolutely unnessesary practice is defended on a website where its readers(I think!) are trying consciously to live a caring compassionate lifestyle!!

Trev
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Plorel » Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:44 pm

I agree with Trev. Being a vegetarian I don't see any difficulty in getting sufficient protein's etc. from any other thing. The only reason I can imagine for eating meet is the comsumption while eating it. But with all the negative aspects, economically, ecologically and health-wise (with all the suffering, factory farming create)s, it seems like nothing.

On the other hand, if one feels he really needs it I dont think he/she should force herself to do without meet, which would probably be worse.
There maybe a bit of selfrighoutness in my saying from the point of a vegetarian, so dont take it personal please (which you wont anyway, I know ;).

I would be really interested if someone of you, who has started living a consicous life has felt (the urge) to abandon eating meat after some time?
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby domokato » Tue Dec 16, 2008 12:13 am

Somehow I don't think vegetarianism has anything to do with Tolle. Tolle doesn't seem to touch the subject either.

From my point of view, I just look at the original relationship between animals and humans. We hunted them. They hunted each other. And they hunted us as well, although I assume we figured out how not to get eaten pretty early on. Anyway, I won't judge by saying that eating animals is wrong, but I do feel the new technology we have has been used to increase efficiency (for us) at the cost of suffering (for the animal), and I think there probably is a better way. Vegetarianism is one answer, but I wouldn't say it's the only one. I think killing animals and eating them is part of our human nature. We did it in the past and we have evolved the anatomy for it. Free range chicken and beef sounds like another good answer - the animals are happier throughout their lives.... I think one of the main reasons we need efficiency is to support the world population, given how much land we have. I suppose a decrease in the growth of civilization would help make things more sustainable. But that's a tall order :)
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Re: Vegetarian

Postby Trev » Tue Dec 16, 2008 4:49 pm

Just because we have always done it (eaten meat) doesnt mean that we should always carry on doing it.

Humans have probably always engaged in war but it doesnt mean to say we should accept that and carry on butchering each other in the same old way.

We have the capacity to reason and make decisions based on that -- is it right or wrong. To inflict suffering/death unnessesarily is always wrong. It would certainly be seen that way if it were humans on the wrong end --and i'm sure Tolle would agree with that!

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