A sort of hell?

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A sort of hell?

Postby jackiegs » Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:22 pm

Well, that's how I've described my current life in my journal. My life seems pretty meaningless and stretches ahead like an eternity. However, I've become more and more frightened of death as I get older so I feel I AM in some sort of hell. By that, I suppose I mean I can't see life or death as holding anything for me. And the moment is as elusive as ever.

Yes, over the past thirty years I've followed what I thought was my path. And yes, I've had my beautiful, inspirational and aha moments. I've followed most of the main philosophies/teachings for a while, but I don't seem to be able to stay with any one of them for very long. On occasion I've known without doubt that nothing is a mistake and that my life is as it was designed to be (not expressing that particularly well, sorry) but the lowness and the fears seem to push these comforts way into the background.

Thirty years ago, I sort of woke up and realised what is real. I foolishly thought that was it! Since then it seems to have been a downward spiral, gradual but definitely downwards. And here I am, thirty years older, feeling as if I'm going backwards as well as downwards.

I know that for years, since the waking up experiences I had in the 80s began to fade, I was desperate to recapture what I'd had. I no longer yearn for these and I feel that's somehow positive. But I suppose that these sort of underpinned my life and so I've lived believing that all was well deep down. Now I'm not at all sure.

I'd really appreciate some input IF you can make sense of my ramblings! I joined this forum in 2011 but didn't post much. Then today I've been back, reading through and finding wisdom in no short measure. So thank you for that.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby karmarider » Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:49 pm

Whatever I say is of course from my point of view. I've gone from an outlook of confusion and depression to one which is creative and enjoyable and not susceptible to emotional pain and confusion. I've relied mostly on techniques and I've read or listened to people like Tolle, Jed Mckenna, John Sherman, Neale Donald Walsch. My world-view has evolved radically in the process. In my experience, it has been a tumultous journey, going back and forth, with periods of exasparation like the one you describe, but in the last five years, I've felt consistently connected, joyful and creative.

I also recommend not to hestitate to seek professional help, medical help. If medication were recommended to me, I would take it. Talk therapy is great. Finding support in family, friends, support groups, social groups, is a good thing.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Onceler » Wed Jan 14, 2015 11:58 pm

I have a similar spiritual memoir, things started out rosy, then 30 years later I'm more depressed and anxious than ever. I found grace when I utterly gave up. Self inquiry John Sherman style did it for me. The unfolding has been gradual,but steady since.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby CaiHong » Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:29 am

Hi Jacklegs

Not much to offer in the way of advice. I listen daily to Eckhart Tolle over and over again and this is certainly keeping the demons at bay. Listening to ET instead of my own negative destructive thoughts is a much better alternative.

He does have suggestions on what you are going through.

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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby jackiegs » Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:13 am

I really appreciate your replies, thank you so much. It's really encouraging that you have an understanding of where I am.

I hadn't heard of John Sherman until you mentioned him. I've downloaded his book as I really liked what I read online just now.

Karmarider, I have been down the meds route, for anxiety. I have a brilliant G.P. who, behind her medical expertise, appears to share a similar view on life as I do. I'm not currently taking anything but I know she's supportive whatever I choose to do.

CaiHong, yes, I'll try listening to rather than reading Tolle. That's a good idea. When you write about his suggestions on what I'm going through, are you able to point me to a particular talk or session? Thank you.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Webwanderer » Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:38 am

Jackiegs, a few questions to consider:

Do you believe in life beyond this physical experience? If so, is it just lip service belief, or is it deeply felt? Do you have any clarity on what it might be like? There are many follow up questions to these depending on your answers.

Do you believe our individual and collective lives as humans has purpose? If so, what might it be? If not, why does human life exist? Again, answers lead to more revealing questions.

You mentioned that life is meaningless to you. How would you suggest does life gain meaning for anyone?

Clear answers can be quite enlightening. Explore.

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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Onceler » Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:55 am

jackiegs wrote:I really appreciate your replies, thank you so much. It's really encouraging that you have an understanding of where I am.

I hadn't heard of John Sherman until you mentioned him. I've downloaded his book as I really liked what I read online just now.



The book is extra....and nice, but I would recommend just do the 'act of looking'. It can have profound effects over time.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby jackiegs » Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:00 pm

Webwanderer...I read your post last night and, apart from my head bursting with replies to your questions, I managed a reasonable nights sleep and a fairly positive wake up this morning. Your questions seemed to energise something within me. My response to your first question...

I totally believe in life after death. When I was 25, I had a wonderful experience whilst under anaesthetic. It doesn't lend itself to words but suffice to say it was pure love tumbling, rippling and being. I didn't want to leave and, as I started to come around, I was in tears.

Ten years later I went through my "sort of mini awakening." I won't go into too much detail but basically, after 3 years of feeling meaningless, fearful, and cynical and disbelieving of anything other than the world as I saw it, I entered a period of complete turnaround. I previously had no interest in meditation (mumbo jumbo as far as I was concerned) but now I was drawn to it. It required no practice on my part. As soon as I took myself away my mind would empty of thought and I was, as I told myself, home. I was amazed that I had forgotten what home was! I don't know if this makes sense but it felt like the tip of infinity in that it went on and on and I was merely experiencing the tiniest, tiniest particle.

During these couple of years, my son who was 5 at the time said to me one day, "mum, I knew you before I was born." I thought I'd misheard and asked him what he'd said. He replied, "I knew you before I was born. I was with Jesus and I could see you and everything that was happening." He then went back to the game he was playing. No big deal to him, just a truth.

And yet, 30 years on, I write that post above! I'm now wondering why? Why am I trying to think my way out of something I hold true? For me, the evidence of life after death was indisputable. What has happened?

Thank you, Webwander, you were right. Those questions are quite incredible questions and I haven't yet moved on to the others in your post!
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Webwanderer » Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:40 pm

jackiegs wrote:My response to your first question...

I totally believe in life after death.

Then you likely know that life didn't begin with this particular earth experience. What does that say about this particular life experience, or any other life experience one might have? "Life after death" is a bit of a misnomer. Life beyond death is really more accurate, and one could yet perceive the relationship of life and death in clearer, more inclusive, terms as well. What term feels most right to you?

The reason I suggest such a consideration is that the terms we use set and define our perception of our experience here. The clearer we perceive the relationship of life and 'death' the clearer we perceive life in general. That clearer perception leads to a significantly different (greater?) life experience than might otherwise be had.

...after 3 years of feeling meaningless, fearful, and cynical and disbelieving of anything other than the world as I saw it, I entered a period of complete turnaround...

...As soon as I took myself away my mind would empty of thought and I was, as I told myself, home. I was amazed that I had forgotten what home was! I don't know if this makes sense but it felt like the tip of infinity in that it went on and on and I was merely experiencing the tiniest, tiniest particle.

Curious thing about meaning, whether about this or that, or life itself; who really decides what any thing, any event, or any condition, means? We may be influenced in some way by outside suggestions or conditioning, but when it comes right down to it, each of us applies meaning to what happens in our life and our experience of it responds accordingly. Knowing this is real power.

Life in the human adventure is inherently neutral when it comes to meaning. As we apply meaning as individuals those meanings bring uniqueness of experience. The quality of the meaning we apply is then reflected in the emotions we feel. Those emotions are the gift of guidance in this human form, and it's wise to read them with care.

Everything you need is already within you. It is your alignment with your true nature that brings it out in the form of insight and inspiration. We feel our way to truth and clarity. Sometimes however, an outside pointer can help to remind us of what we already know. Life events and conditions can be distracting and we can forget, for a time, that there is a source of truth and clarity within us. The good news is that it is always there awaiting our remembering.

WW
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby CaiHong » Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:19 am

Hi Jacklegs,

I'm afraid I can't pont you exactly to the parts of ET's books that may be of more help, I listen to him on a loop.

You mentioned in your post that meditation seemed to have worked for you when you emptied your mind. I think you may have answered your own enquiry. I don't formally meditate but endevour throughout the day to bring consciousness into what I am doing, this is extremely important when my mind starts to wander off into a negative stream of unconscious thoughts spiraling out of control. I bring my mind back to my breath, my task at hand.

For me ET's teaching are simple and clear, it's for me to implement the teaching moment to moment.

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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby dijmart » Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:34 pm

Webwanderer wrote: Life events and conditions can be distracting and we can forget, for a time, that there is a source of truth and clarity within us. The good news is that it is always there awaiting our remembering.


Ha, ha, ha...Oye e' yae! It's been a rough couple of weeks? months? Don't recall...but I'm back as of very recently (like day before yesterday!!!). Funny thing is I don't remember what woke me back up again? Now the test...where's Phil? :lol:
Take what you like and leave the rest.
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby jackiegs » Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:59 pm

Thank you so much, WW, for your wise response. I really appreciate it.

Meaning...yes, I've thought a lot about what you said. I'm thinking about the difficult times within myself (yesterday was particularly difficult) and how I define them. And wondering if my definitions make these times even harder. This then takes me back to wondering if I could accept them without the meaning I apply. And, if I could, would they be easier. My logic says they would. (Wry smile to myself as I know that saying that is easy when there's some distance from those times)
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Webwanderer » Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:55 pm

jackiegs wrote:Meaning...yes, I've thought a lot about what you said. I'm thinking about the difficult times within myself (yesterday was particularly difficult) and how I define them. And wondering if my definitions make these times even harder.

How you define them certainly can, and probably do, make them harder. It only depends on the definition/meaning you give them. You decide on your meaning and definitions. Much of it you decided long ago and is now internal conditioning that is on auto pilot. You don't have to continue with your automatic responses however. You can become more of an observer to those responses and begin to consider new alternatives - alternatives that work more in your greater and experiential best interest. You decide - either by accepting your conditioning, or by conscious preference.

In all events there is the appearance as suggested by our conditioning, and there is a greater underlying truth. Of course there are infinite shades of both one can consider and apply. So how does one find clarity on any matter at hand? First, we recognize and acknowledge that there is more than one way to perceive what is. Then we follow what feels to be the greater truth. Greater truths release us from our judgment. They feel freeing to the angst and contraction of negative perspectives. They just feel better than the more limiting condemnations.

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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby Webwanderer » Sun Jan 18, 2015 6:29 pm

dijmart wrote:
Webwanderer wrote: Life events and conditions can be distracting and we can forget, for a time, that there is a source of truth and clarity within us. The good news is that it is always there awaiting our remembering.


Ha, ha, ha...Oye e' yae! It's been a rough couple of weeks? months? Don't recall...but I'm back as of very recently (like day before yesterday!!!). Funny thing is I don't remember what woke me back up again?

Yes, it tends to work that way. Two steps forward and one back, sometimes two back. The thing is, if we are paying attention those back steps get fewer over time. We gain clarity a little at a time until, occasionally, we have a larger step forward and for a while bask in a greater understanding. Then the process starts over where we think we lose it. But again, if we are attentive, we begin moving toward more clarity.

WW
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Re: A sort of hell?

Postby jackiegs » Sat Jan 24, 2015 5:21 pm

Again, thank you WW.

"What feels to be the greater truth" is what I think I'm trying to follow. For me, it's sitting with the feelings of anxiety and any other uncomfortable feeling that shows itself. It seems to be the right direction but, my golly, it's hard to do. It's almost as if there is no other option. I can distract and redirect and, over the years this has worked, to a degree. But I find that ultimately the anxiety or the discomfort is always just below the surface. I feel the time has come for me to stop running away from it. Following on from what you've said, I'm thinking it might help if I try to view it as a gift as opposed to a foe.

I'm also rereading two of the Emmanuel books I bought some years ago. I quite like their simplicity.
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