Choosing a spiritual standpoint at finding somebody

[muddy_diamond]

Hello there!

First of all I'd like to emphasise that I'm not a Eckhart Tolle follower in particular, but this forum seemed a nice spot to discuss my dilemma. I'm a 23 years old guy and I've never been in a serious relationship with anyone yet. Once in a while I'm busy with that 'dating' thingy, but so far without the result of finding anyone which I really liked, let alone, fell in love with.

Now the point is, that I'm in conflict between two ways of thinking (and I almost don't dare to use that word ):

1- Just realising that I'm already complete, don't need anybody else to be complete/fulfilled. And following the stream of life and love, trusting that it'll fold out the way it will fold out.

2- The urge to just DO something. I know it may sound pathetic, but with passing of time the "not having a girlfriend" sensation gets more and more pressing. I also realise that this is for a part because of societal expectations, but also for a large part the yearning for that experience from myself (to intimately share life with somebody else). I for instance take meditating on it (in an abstract way) in consideration, but won't do it because I think it's too egoic.

Around me I see people not busy with spirituality, just doing their things. In their case at least some things are happening if you understand.

What it comes down to, is that on the one hand I tend to try to ignore thoughts about getting in a relationship because I believe 'life will work itself out and bring the things on my path that are perfect for me'. On the other hand, I'm leaning more and more to the spectrum of 'law of attraction' and thinking in a certain way to attract certain life situations. Of course this last mentioned thing is mainly driven by an increasing desperateness, to call it that way...

I'm trying to just give to the world around me (with a genuine intention) to give what I'd like the most: love, understanding, fun, self confidence with girls (to a friend) etc. Probably with a deep underlying thought of eventually getting it for myself... But then that seems opportunistic in the foundation... Oh well...

Hopefully this post isn't too vague. I'd like to read your thoughts about this subject and how you would position yourself in my case.


Kind regards!

[dijmart]

I really like your attitude! I think you should combine the 2 ideas. Know you are already complete on your own, but keep your eye out in case you find someone interesting that you'd like to date, then act on that if the situation arises. No harm in putting yourself in situations to more readily meet someone as well. I wouldn't obsess about it though, because then you will no longer feel complete on your own and will feel you "need" a girlfriend to feel whole and complete. Which is not what you want.

[meetjoeblack]

I never have been in a serious relation. I have dated more as I got older and I approached more. Still, you got to sift through nonsense and its time consuming. Most of it a waste unless you hit it off. You might not be ready man. The thought of kids scares me. The older I get, the more baby crazy I find girls so, sex is more disposable and available but, its at a huge risk. I wouldn't be put off by this so much as if the girls I met did not spend their youth as side piece or kids with an idiot.

I am not sure the answer. Everyone is on tinder now a days. What if you swiped right at life?

[muddy_diamond]

Well, it seems we have an update. <-- irony


About half a year ago, I met some girl in a kind of student environment, which had a very close social ambiance. Because of this, we really got to know each other in a very relaxed way. From the beginning, I noticed having some feeling for her which I actually, more or less unconsciously, neglected/repressed. The concept of a relationship was totally unthinkable for me by that time: Some double bind situation: How could a girl ever like me (due to a deep down low self esteem) + How could I ever like a girl? (Due to only being disappointed in the past when having some dates for instance) this locked me up, making me think the best possible situation between the two of us would just being good friends.

Time passed and my feelings for her seemed to become more apparent to me, although I didn’t seem to dare to admit them to myself. Nevertheless, at some point, I formulated the thought to a good friend of us both. In the meantime, the feelings for her I talk about, appeared and disappeared continuously. I still don’t understand why. This went on for weeks, until I decided to ask her out. At that specific moment/period, I didn’t have any feelings for her specifically, but I thought: “If I just go for it, maybe things will get clear”.

She agreed happily and we had a very nice evening after which I told her, straight ahead, that I liked her. She replied she had an eye on me too! From the very first week we met eachother.

But since then, I became even more confused! It fluctuated by day, by hour. This moment I longed for her, the next moment I was indifferent… She asked me why I acted so distantly and I explained my confusion. We nevertheless went on dating and had some innocent/petty intimate moments here and there.

We were in a situation (the study period) in which we saw each other everyday and all the other students stuck their nose in our situation. Maybe that was why it couldn’t start off, we thought. So when the semester would be over, we could find out. That was about 3 months ago. Now what happened: A few days after the course ended, she cut it off. Terminated it. She regretted it very much, but since a week or so, her feelings were totally gone.

I was absolutely devastated. Without being ever really infatuated, I was now lovesick big time…!

Since then, at unpredictable moments, I get agonised by very, very strong feelings of sorrow, regret, fear, sadness, frustration, longing etc. A huge amount of memories about the two of us keeps passing by and agonises me. A lay awake at night thinking about being alone, having missed a very rare opportunity, ‘her with another guy’ (which is in fact the case. Although a kind of friends with benefits guy, she doesn’t really like) etc. “Why did I make it such a complicated situation?! If I’d just did this, said that, went there etc.” (I know this is a typical mind thing.)

What also has to be said is that the point of never having had sex is pressing more and more on me. I believed that girl would’ve been the one and now the stone in my chest is even heavier.

I feel totally lost right now. Being too much of a romantic to engage in those mundane dating apps like Tinder and Happn, I wait/seek for ‘encounters’ that don’t come.

At the same time I take into consideration:

- I am just heavily involved in a story about myself and relationship
- The longing I feel is actually a longing to my own love
- Desiring something, actually manifests the experience of desiring itself
- A intimate/romantic relationship can’t give final fulfilment, but do I really have to become enlightened first to be allowed (yes, it feels like something is withhold from me) experiencing intimacy?


I’m watching a lot of non-duality video’s (Spira, Mooji, Adyashanti, Foster), and they seem to offer some soothing. At the same time I realise watching those clips may just be a painkiller. I really want to do something. Meet people etc. I do have a modest social life, but those situations of really meeting new people don’t seem to occur.

What does life try to show me? What is my lesson?
I believe that if I just go along not seeking, and leave this situation as it is, nothing will happen because I have done that for the past 6 years anyway!

[meetjoeblack]

Hello there!

First of all I'd like to emphasise that I'm not a Eckhart Tolle follower in particular, but this forum seemed a nice spot to discuss my dilemma. I'm a 23 years old guy and I've never been in a serious relationship with anyone yet. Once in a while I'm busy with that 'dating' thingy, but so far without the result of finding anyone which I really liked, let alone, fell in love with.

Now the point is, that I'm in conflict between two ways of thinking (and I almost don't dare to use that word ):

1- Just realising that I'm already complete, don't need anybody else to be complete/fulfilled. And following the stream of life and love, trusting that it'll fold out the way it will fold out.

2- The urge to just DO something. I know it may sound pathetic, but with passing of time the "not having a girlfriend" sensation gets more and more pressing. I also realise that this is for a part because of societal expectations, but also for a large part the yearning for that experience from myself (to intimately share life with somebody else). I for instance take meditating on it (in an abstract way) in consideration, but won't do it because I think it's too egoic.

Around me I see people not busy with spirituality, just doing their things. In their case at least some things are happening if you understand.

What it comes down to, is that on the one hand I tend to try to ignore thoughts about getting in a relationship because I believe 'life will work itself out and bring the things on my path that are perfect for me'. On the other hand, I'm leaning more and more to the spectrum of 'law of attraction' and thinking in a certain way to attract certain life situations. Of course this last mentioned thing is mainly driven by an increasing desperateness, to call it that way...

I'm trying to just give to the world around me (with a genuine intention) to give what I'd like the most: love, understanding, fun, self confidence with girls (to a friend) etc. Probably with a deep underlying thought of eventually getting it for myself... But then that seems opportunistic in the foundation... Oh well...

Hopefully this post isn't too vague. I'd like to read your thoughts about this subject and how you would position yourself in my case.


Kind regards!

I know the feeling. I spent most of my life single. I had few or virtually no dating experiences. Weirdly enough, I was liked by girls but, i was terrible at picking up on their cues. I was lonely. I tried meeting girls through my social circle. I had terrible luck. I wasn't comfortable in my own skin.

I never could understand how I could like a girl, treat her great, and she would sleep with some guy that would not care about her? I then watched how my crush got pregnant by a idiot and he didn't care to stick around. It was then I decided to change my life.

To my embarrassment, a buddy told me about a book that helped change his success with dating. I never understood how he always had beautiful girls. That was then when he told me about this book called "the game." I then went out and read it. I started to see an entirely different world. I got new insights. I understood that by being needy, by being desperate, lonely, attached, and praising a woman like her shit doesn't stink was not the answer.

To my great shame, I started to approach lots of girls, and I suffered so many rejections, I lost count. How was it that so many other guys had it easy to date or get laid? I kept approaching, reading books like Tony robbins NLP or books on humor. I never tried magic or routines. I just talked. I started to exercise. I began to eat healthy. I lost weight. I started dressing better. Slowly, I would get more numbers, I would go on more dates, and I began to see when a girl liked me. Like, I intuitively could understand when she wanted to kiss or she just did not like me. I stopped wearing my heart on my sleeve. I dated more and I began to have a sex life.

I did begin to lose myself to some extent. I always wanted to just find love. After these experiences, I began to see the world differently, and I felt pain. I felt like there was this party of dating, sex, and love that I was never part of. I felt like the world left me behind. I felt forever alone. When I seen myself with nothing to lose, I started to approach, and left it all on the line. I want love, a family, a wife, and children one day. What I found was a lot of suffering.

Many girls who never gave me the time a day come around later on. Some have kids. Some just slept around and now want to get married. I am still getting over my past or the way i was manipulated or emasculated by girls in my teens.


It has been a long journey. I wish I could tell you there was a happy ending. I am still on this journey. I want love so, in order to get love, I must give it first. Its the law of attraction. Its the law of state transference. Learn to cultivate good feelings yourself. Learn to love yourself. Talk to lots of women everywhere. Let go. If you want love, you must give it first. You must open yourself up to rejection, to failures, to heart break, and loss. If it is truly what you desire, what do you have to lose if you are forever alone?

I like the Fight Club approach; "I don't want to die without any scars." We wont get out of this journey alive. DJM reminds me to enjoy the freedom while I have it. I advise you the same but, if you want something more, you must go out, and take your chances. I spoke to a girl just buying coffee. The previous customer was rude to her. I made her laugh. She gave her number to a mutual friend and text me. She ended up buying me a coffee and inviting me to watch a movie. We ended up hooking up but, we never dated. We went our separate ways. This will happen but, eventually, I feel like I will meet someone right for me or not.

I am not sad it wasn't forever. I am happy I got to experience something for however long it is or whatever it was. I wish for you to do the same. Maybe you can do the same.

I met some new girls and who knows what the future holds for me. What I do know is to have faith and what will be will be. Good luck on your journey.

[muddy_diamond]

@meetjoeblack

Hi! I don't seem to be able (not allowed by the website) to reply to you PM, so I'll answer here.

I really appreciate your message and I indeed recognize your sketch. Indeed I may be too much of a romantic, clinging to the serendipity, and should adopt a more indifferent/go-with-the-flow attitude.

It's not that I'm uncomfortable in going along with girls by the way. That al goes fine. It may just be that I'm judging too quick or something. That I'm not open enough. Finding myself drawing future images immediately after having just a minor (not even sure) flirt with someone, makes me realise how active my mind is in making me to believe "another one is going to make me happy".

Being in the moment, not making too much of a hassle out of things. I'll try!

[meetjoeblack]

@meetjoeblack

Hi! I don't seem to be able (not allowed by the website) to reply to you PM, so I'll answer here.

I really appreciate your message and I indeed recognize your sketch. Indeed I may be too much of a romantic, clinging to the serendipity, and should adopt a more indifferent/go-with-the-flow attitude.

It's not that I'm uncomfortable in going along with girls by the way. That al goes fine. It may just be that I'm judging too quick or something. That I'm not open enough. Finding myself drawing future images immediately after having just a minor (not even sure) flirt with someone, makes me realise how active my mind is in making me to believe "another one is going to make me happy".

Being in the moment, not making too much of a hassle out of things. I'll try!

YouTube "Freedom from outcome" and you come across a lot of answers there. Living it is an entirely different story.

I feel a sense of thrill with interacting with girls. For whatever it is be it a date, a convo, sex, my future wife and mother of my children, I am just happy. Yes, I catch myself wanting or wishing for more but, I meditate on it and I let go. Maybe I let go too much now because I am still single despite the options that are now present. Part of me feels resentful or even bitter at times that it took this sort of journey to truly experience.

Today, I felt my ego flare up. I felt some pain body and go figure, I ran into a girl from a previous fling who I did not want to see or talk with. This will happen a lot.

You are still young and there are tons of men and women that feel what we feel. So, love is clearly the answer but, it starts with self. You must give it to yourself and accept it first before you can truly give it to someone else. I have seen a lot of guys build their life on the affections of a woman and when it ends, they literally give up on life. The LTR was a bandaid. They were in co-dependence and concept.

I notice, a great deal of male behavior now a days has a lot to do with what society says. I have always been fascinated, mothers raise their boys to be the "good boys," betas rather than the men they craved in their youth, the alphas. Interesting?

[painBody]

Appearances are very deceptive, so don't go by what other people appear to be doing. If you dug deep into another person's life you may find hell on a level you didn't dream possible ! Furthermore, think about it for a minute ... in an insane world, what kinds of examples are out there for you to follow ? Good ones ?

While you (and others) can chant "I am enough/whole/complete" all night long ... when you wake up in the morning, you'll find that you're still human, you're still a social animal. Which means this - while it is true on one level that you are complete by yourself, you still need to honor your human form. You still eat, drink water, and use the bathroom - no one denies the need for all that. So, why should anyone deny the need for a partner ?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting an intimate romantic/sexual partner ... that's clear. Now, how to go about it ? Not so clear to me, given my success, I mean failure, rate.

Personally, I have found that going about dating indirectly is the most effective way ... I used to be very active with meetup (social networking site, but you actually meet people in person) ... I joined groups with different themes - hiking/fitness, dancing, drinking, bowling, etc. And, meeting people without the forced pressure of dating was, in fact, a great way to find out who I would like to know more intimately. It led to a few dates.

I also tried my hand at online dating, with very little success. I suggest both approaches - direct and indirect, why not ?

Just saying ... don't deny yourself one of your most basic needs. Don't listen to this hip-hop bull$#!t culture telling you it's "cool" to be alone or beat yourself with the spiritual mantra "I am complete". Honor your human form ... you are a social animal, no matter what anyone tells you. Loneliness kills more people than smoking and obesity combined.

Now, you don't have to set yourself a deadline for meeting someone. Some people feel pressure as they age ... "I'm 35 and all alone !" You can, as they say, "let life take its course". But, you don't have to pretend to be ok alone, just to show the world that you are "complete" on your own while you are really miserable and lonely on the inside (I've made this mistake). Putting on appearances for the world is a futile and self-defeating endeavor.

On the one hand, take an active role in satisfying your needs, but on the other, give it time to work out. You don't have to *make* it happen (in fact, you can't), but *allow* it to happen by making yourself visible/known. Hope I've made some sense. Oh, and umm ... self-help/dating books are worthless ... you gotta figure this one out by getting out there and doing.

[meetjoeblack]

Appearances are very deceptive, so don't go by what other people appear to be doing. If you dug deep into another person's life you may find hell on a level you didn't dream possible ! Furthermore, think about it for a minute ... in an insane world, what kinds of examples are out there for you to follow ? Good ones ?

Ironic isn't it given, we are here because of what other people are doing (ecky, Jesus, Zen, Buddha, etc).

While you (and others) can chant "I am enough/whole/complete" all night long ... when you wake up in the morning, you'll find that you're still human, you're still a social animal. Which means this - while it is true on one level that you are complete by yourself, you still need to honor your human form. You still eat, drink water, and use the bathroom - no one denies the need for all that. So, why should anyone deny the need for a partner ?

I think it is even more important then to reach out to other people, to learn, to explore, to overcome fears, challenges, and failures. Otherwise, you go through life as though you are experiencing a solipsism.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting an intimate romantic/sexual partner ... that's clear. Now, how to go about it ? Not so clear to me, given my success, I mean failure, rate.

I feel the same thing but, I would experience nothing if I did not go on the journey I have taken on. I learned of Ecky because of that journey. How interesting?

Personally, I have found that going about dating indirectly is the most effective way ... I used to be very active with meetup (social networking site, but you actually meet people in person) ... I joined groups with different themes - hiking/fitness, dancing, drinking, bowling, etc. And, meeting people without the forced pressure of dating was, in fact, a great way to find out who I would like to know more intimately. It led to a few dates.

It plays into serendipity which I like better then lets say, tinder or online dating.

I also tried my hand at online dating, with very little success. I suggest both approaches - direct and indirect, why not ?

I seen a link online showing women on okcupid rated 80% of men below average. Interesting stat given the promos on how men objectify women. Interesting.

Just saying ... don't deny yourself one of your most basic needs. Don't listen to this hip-hop bull$#!t culture telling you it's "cool" to be alone or beat yourself with the spiritual mantra "I am complete". Honor your human form ... you are a social animal, no matter what anyone tells you. Loneliness kills more people than smoking and obesity combined.

Now, you don't have to set yourself a deadline for meeting someone. Some people feel pressure as they age ... "I'm 35 and all alone !" You can, as they say, "let life take its course". But, you don't have to pretend to be ok alone, just to show the world that you are "complete" on your own while you are really miserable and lonely on the inside (I've made this mistake). Putting on appearances for the world is a futile and self-defeating endeavor.

On the one hand, take an active role in satisfying your needs, but on the other, give it time to work out. You don't have to *make* it happen (in fact, you can't), but *allow* it to happen by making yourself visible/known. Hope I've made some sense. Oh, and umm ... self-help/dating books are worthless ... you gotta figure this one out by getting out there and doing.

I use to think settling down was part of my path but, I am not so sure anymore and I okay with it. In the meantime, I am exploring self knowledge and my consciousness. I am doing everything humanly possible to better my life and meet more people but, I am okay with not settling down. So I am told, that's usually when you meet someone. Not looking lol