No going back, but is it worth it?

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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Enlightened2B » Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:04 pm

Thanks Di, Appreciate it. And thanks Rob for your contribution as well.

I've always had a very analytical mind, so while theory and an understanding has been incredibly helpful to some extent, too much information has never been good for my mind, as it over stimulates my nervous system. A lot of people I know are information junkies. I've been trying to shift away from 'trying to figure things out' with my mind, and instead surrender and allow the answers to come. It's a very difficult process, because my mind has never felt safe enough to truly let go. And letting go of the wheel in a sense, is (I find) what brings 'real' control to our lives. Complete surrender is an absolute trust that it IS safe to truly let go. Hard to explain in words. Been dabbling into some of the ACIM teachings lately. Finding resonance there with a lot of it. I've even been coming back to listen to some Tolle on youtube. My only issue with Eckhart is his demonization of the ego. We'll see where it goes from here.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby DavidB » Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:55 am

Onceler wrote:There's not much to say, many times I begin to formulate replies here and then just say, aw screw it, and delete the post......I agree with DavidB, things are very much simpler now. I'm not looking for spiritual solutions, just living life. With most psychological suffering at an end, or taking a break, I just try to be a better human. I accept who I am with all my flaws and try to be better. I too don't really mind what happens and would never want to go back to my previous, intensely neurotic, life. Never.


I do the same, I start a reply... think aw screw it, and delete the post.

I'm not looking for spiritual solutions, just living life.


I've been noticing this more and more recently, people expressing this very thing, people that were previously very much immersed in "spiritual" matters. It appears synchronistic.
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby DavidB » Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:58 am

turiya wrote:
Onceler wrote:There's not much to say, many times I begin to formulate replies here and then just say, aw screw it, and delete the post...


I do this a lot on forums... and in my life, too (thinking of something to say while another person is talking... then just "deleting" the thought and sitting there listening to the other person.) :wink:


Yeah, same.
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Onceler » Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:22 pm

Ha! Thanks, I'm glad I'm not the only one. Yeah, sometimes I feel like I could care less. Which is weird. As I used to care more.

Long (boring) story short, I simply no longer seek a spiritual solution. Not sure there is one, but something shifted, slipped deep in the mind and I no longer care and no longer suffer. I'm living proof there is another way, outside of Tolle's enlightenment perspective, outside of the 'classic' spiritual paradigm (Buddhist, Advaita, neo-advaita, new age, etc all) that is accessible to all. Perhaps there is something synchronistic going on DavidB, which I can appreciate since I no longer look for magic.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Enlightened2B » Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:35 pm

I've gotten so intuitive these days, by using my body, that I can no longer gravitate towards spiritual material that doesn't feel 'hell yes!' to me. My nervous system gets so insanely stimulated when I encounter material that contradicts what my heart knows to be true. When there is ease and peace, I know I've hit on something that is 'right'. And I'll be honest, a lot of the material I have encountered over the last 5 years in my spiritual search no longer resonates with me on any level. But, I needed to explore that stuff as it was essential to my journey, to really come to a point where 'coming back home' in a sense is all that matters. Even with things like near death experiences, there are only a select many these days that I will even look at, because there are just too many that are based in 'human/ego' belief systems. I think we all to some extent go through this process.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Testigo » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:52 am

Attracting people to me because being present as much as possible? No.
More than 13 years with Eckhart on daily basis: rereading his best quotes, meditating, watching his videos, attending meetings of group meditation and discussions of his books...
No changes in me. Not a single one, whatsoever. At least, not a single one that others have noticed.
Besides, I have not got peace in my spirit. I continue to feel the same unrest I used to have in 2004.
Why then continue? Because I am convinced that his teachings are among the best of other masters I know. This could be considered as a very foolish one. But I have another reason: eight years ago I got a wonderful experience, a revelationa, a fantastic vision of "the other side". That was enough to show me that at least in general terms, the path I am walking on is a good one.
Next september I am attending a retreat in Oslo where I hope I will have the opportunity to talk personally to him and clarify some things.
Last edited by Testigo on Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Webwanderer » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:46 pm

Testigo wrote:More than 13 years with Eckhart on daily basis: rereading his best quotes, meditating, watching his videos, attending meetings of group meditation and discussions of his books...
No changes in me. Not a single one, whatsoever.

I don't see how that is possible. Your own words suggest otherwise. Could these be connected?

eight years ago I got a wonderful experience, a revelationaa fantastic vision of "the other side". That was enough to show me that at least in general terms, the path I am walking on is a good one.

And where might you be consciousness wise absent your years with Tolle?

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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby painBody » Tue Aug 01, 2017 11:19 am

One sentence grabbed my attention like none other.

"sometimes I just wonder if I could just go back in my life and pretend none of that ever happened"

Could you stay here and now and pretend none of that ever happened ?

:D

I'm at that point in my life right now ... I don't know what the fuck happened, and I'm very comfortable not knowing ... if it was all a dream, if/whether it happened is about as important to me as knowing what day of the week it is or what time ... i.e., not that important.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby rachMiel » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:32 pm

painBody wrote:One sentence grabbed my attention like none other.

"sometimes I just wonder if I could just go back in my life and pretend none of that ever happened"

Could you stay here and now and pretend none of that ever happened ?

Nice! How about this variant:

The "pretend" part is thinking something (real, concrete) actually DID happen. So could you drop it, could we drop it ... and realize that, apart from our memory/imagination/projection, *none* of our previous lives, our personal history ever really happened.

" ... there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so." — Shakespeare
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Enlightened2B » Tue Aug 01, 2017 5:06 pm

Consider that when you don't realize you're dreaming, you don't question anything. You think you are only the dream character. Sure, life is difficult at times, only because you repeat the same patterns unconsciously.

Then, when you have even a glimpse that you are dreaming, you can never go 'back' to being ONLY that dream character anymore. When that happened for me, at first it was blissful for months, but then anxiety surfaced big time about a year later, as the sense of responsibility increased for me and questions arose of who are we, why are we here, what is all of this.....none of which I had questioned prior to my awakening, including the integration of my experience which is hard to explain in words. It was a very difficult transition/awakening process for me, plus dealing with chronic health issues did guide me into working with therapy and looking at my childhood (which was incredibly beneficial). So, while yes, the past did not happen in an objective sense, and no, we should not all be going around and digging up our past, ......sometimes, that can be a point of denial for certain people who are too afraid to embrace their own pain. Moving into pain, fear and darkness for me has been/is the pathway home. Not saying....."it never happened". But,how could I embrace the darkness if I am completely unaware of 'what the darkness is'? Darkness has been the contrast/gateway/catalyst into moving me into the light.

So, I don't really look so much at it, as though the past never happened, because the past IS stored in your body. All of your beliefs are stored in your body and they will surface and manifest outwardly until you integrate them, and too many people approach that perspective from a sense of suppressing the stuff they don't want to bring into the light. However, instead, I see it more so that the past stories are what are no longer present. If you're continually living in those stories, then you're not living in the present. It's the stories we keep believing in our minds which keep that past alive. However, there is a way to integrate those old memories in your body without buying into the stories anymore.

Of course, even THIS is moving off topic from the initial point which was simply more or less "Hey, remember when we were young and didn't know shit.......how cool would it be if we could all just 'go back' (metaphorically) to that place and just say fuck all of this spiritual stuff". :D
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Enlightened2B » Tue Aug 01, 2017 5:26 pm

One other quick point here. One of the reasons why looking at pain was so hard for myself personally, for so long, was because I actually developed a spiritual ego. In other words, the ego (in my definition of it) is simply a protective mechanism; a survival mechanism that we have identified as who we really are. I know Runstrails is a brain person, so she'll probably grasp the whole neuroplasticity aspect of this.

When those old patterns would be triggered or surface for me, initially, I could not look at it, because I took it as though those were a representation of something wrong with ME. Often times in the past when I would argue or debate with people here on this very forum, I would get defensive because I took it as though these people were pointing out something dark within myself that I, was too afraid to look at, because I could not accept that there was something 'wrong with ME'. My own insecurity was too high to accept that "I did not know all of the answers". Uncertainty was death for me, because that would indicate a loss of control. When in actuality, none of it had anything to really do with 'who I really am". Who I really am, is complete and utter perfection, but that old darkness was simply old childhood survival patterns that I had identified with for so long and then taken it as my true identity, and then my nervous system was simply trying to protect that sense of identity by being on extra high alert for anything that could penetrate through the armor of resistance (ego).

And yet at the same time, all of this was incredibly necessary for me to be able to shift into the next stage of my life.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby rachMiel » Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:02 pm

Enlightened2B wrote:So, I don't really look so much at it, as though the past never happened, because the past IS stored in your body. All of your beliefs are stored in your body and they will surface and manifest outwardly until you integrate them, and too many people approach that perspective from a sense of suppressing the stuff they don't want to bring into the light. However, instead, I see it more so that the past stories are what are no longer present. If you're continually living in those stories, then you're not living in the present. It's the stories we keep believing in our minds which keep that past alive. However, there is a way to integrate those old memories in your body without buying into the stories anymore.

Gotcha. If the mind-body believes something really happened*, ignoring the effects of this belief (i.e. pretending the past doesn't matter) could create emotional knots that haunt the present moment. This is imo where a good understanding of psychology and possibly working with a good therapist can really help.

* Which happens often ... even to the "spiritually accomplished."
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby Enlightened2B » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:56 pm

I agree rachMiel. Yet, to take it to the other extreme which could be even more 'detrimental' (I use that word very lightly), you can start to look for things within yourself to fix and heal and this just re-enforces that there is a problem there in the first place.

I think there is immense value in choosing to look at a dis-ease or a problem as though it is 'no longer a problem' and therefore 'You are no longer the person who was abused, sick, etc etc'. These kinds of studies are proven immensely effective in the placebo effect. I've used it myself with neural re-wiring to my illness into remission at one point. Dr. Bruce Lipton has some wonderful research in this area. The cells of our bodies are reacting to the beliefs we hold. It's utterly fascinating stuff which goes to show that our bodies are simply reacting to our own state of consciousness. If you keep identifying yourself with those parts of yourself (the shameful one, the guilty one, the sick one, the victim, etc, etc) you are limiting 'who you are' (restricting the flow of energy) to merely THIS or THIS. This is why we all suffer so much, because we believe those things are only what we are and another reason why so many of us are so afraid of acknowledging 'what's there'. We think it's a blemish on our actual identity. It's not safe for us to actually open up into fear or so our ego's believe.

So, I think it's more so just like being honest with yourself radically about what's there. The old stuff will indeed arise. It's like reality is a mirror and is always reflecting to us what our own inner state is. We don't even have to do the 'work' to bring it out. It's just a matter of being willing to acknowledge what's there, and be open to what's there. Abraham Hicks always says that denying what's there is like putting a happy face sticker over your empty gas gauge.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby rachMiel » Tue Aug 01, 2017 11:22 pm

> ... being honest with yourself radically about what's there.

Yes! Though sometimes easier said than done, right? Especially when what's there is emotional pain.
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Re: No going back, but is it worth it?

Postby DavidB » Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:07 am

painBody wrote:One sentence grabbed my attention like none other.

"sometimes I just wonder if I could just go back in my life and pretend none of that ever happened"

Could you stay here and now and pretend none of that ever happened ?

:D

I'm at that point in my life right now ... I don't know what the fuck happened, and I'm very comfortable not knowing ... if it was all a dream, if/whether it happened is about as important to me as knowing what day of the week it is or what time ... i.e., not that important.


When we come to realize (so to speak) that the ground of being is emptiness, meaningless, thoughtless, there's nothing left to think about.
“Wisdom is knowing I am nothing, Love is knowing I am everything, and between the two my life moves.” ― Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj
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