A few uneventful moments

Here you may share how the words Eckhart Tolle have affected your life.
User avatar
Natalie
Posts: 559
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 9:44 am
Location: Florida, USA

A few uneventful moments

Post by Natalie » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:05 am

I was lying next to my 8 year old, on her bed, hoping she would fall asleep fast so I could check this forum and facebook before I went to bed.

I started to observe my thoughts as they appeared and disappeared, especially the ones appearing as vivid images for a few seconds before dissolving. Then I became aware that I was observing my thoughts and ‘something’ asked: “who is aware that you are aware? It didn’t feel as if it was my mind asking this question, it felt kind of mystical, as if something other than me was speaking silent words inside my head. I started to go deeper to see who was aware that I was aware and suddenly felt pulled into this black void, there was no thinking, no wanting, or not wanting, even the thought “who is aware that you are aware” disappeared. I was ‘floating’ there for some moments, immersed in that black and soundless space. It was serene and peaceful, but it wasn’t a blissful or awesome experience. Just a little above average nice.

Then I guess my mind kicked in. I felt bored and impatient. These feelings immediately brought me back from the vast, black, soundless space I was in. Once back I felt disappointment and fear. I thought: Is this all there is? Is this how it will feel like after I die? Is this what being pure consciousness feels like? As the fear grew, I kind of preferred religion’s version of an afterlife to the experience I had just had. I understand where this fear comes from and now I am back where I was before this happened. No fear, no expectations, no nothing. I am back at feeling pretty ‘flat’ at times, content most times, and mildly euphoric some other times. I am back at feeling ‘blessed’ for not being a religious person.

What/who originated the initial ‘who is aware that you are aware’ thought? Was it a thought?

What/who pulled me into the blackness and kept me there for a few uneventful moments?

I would love to hear from you if you have had a similar experience with this void/blackness/space.

Were you initially disappointed that it wasn’t all that is cracked up to be?


Natalie

Ralph
Posts: 596
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:08 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Ralph » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:54 am

Natalie wrote:
Were you initially disappointed that it wasn’t all that is cracked up to be?
How could I be disappointed ? ... there is no 'me or 'other' there to be disappointed ... just like in deep sleep.
Then I guess my mind kicked in.
Yes, this is where the disappointment occurs. Welcome to the dream world. :)

User avatar
Natalie
Posts: 559
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 9:44 am
Location: Florida, USA

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Natalie » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:47 am

Ralph I am aware that the person I thought I was is not real, and I realize that it was the little me/little self who experienced the disappointment; however, at the time I wrote the post, I felt curious as to the reaction of disappointment itself. I mean, is it common for the little self to react with disappointment and fear at the experience described above? I sometimes doubt that the ego is an intelligent entity deathly afraid of awareness and that it plays games to keep awareness at bay. I guess I ascribed to the belief that after experiencing a glimpse of no-mind state, one should feel bliss and elation hence the curiosity since this wasn;t the case. Now that I’ve seen right through that belief, the curiosity has subsided, although it would still be interesting to find out if anyone shared the same egoic reaction to the experience.

Ralph
Posts: 596
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:08 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Ralph » Wed Jul 27, 2011 7:43 am

Natalie wrote:
I felt curious as to the reaction of disappointment itself. I mean, is it common for the little self to react with disappointment and fear at the experience described above?
Yes, I ,too, shared the same experience but this just led me to the realization that there was more work to be done.

xkatex
Posts: 83
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2009 11:29 pm

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by xkatex » Wed Jul 27, 2011 9:21 pm

If you keep going into the feeling, and drop all your expectations that it should be bliss, then it blossoms into the most indescribable bliss. I was disappointed at first too, but then I watched one of Adyashanti's videos called 'feeling good, versus the truth' and decided to just experience what was here, and then it was amazing.

User avatar
Webwanderer
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6810
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 12:03 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Webwanderer » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:51 pm

Natalie, I'm sure you've seen the many suggestions I have made in this forum on the value of investigating near death experiences. There are countless numbers of NDE'rs who have reported this 'black void' as an initial stage of the NDE. But it's only an early stage. Almost all report a vast world of expansive being existing beyond it that far surpasses the clarity available to us in this human-mind experience.

You are correct in that you are not the thought identification that formed in this human experience - not the ego. But that does not mean that that which you truly are is not looking through the experience even though temporarily limiting its perspective for evolutionary purposes. Let go of preconceptions and investigate for yourself. You don't have to believe anything about it, but you might just find it insightful.

WW

runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 2216
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by runstrails » Thu Jul 28, 2011 1:21 am

Great insight, WW.
A lot of the NDE narratives that you have posted have involved awakening-like experiences (Nanci Danison, Anita come to mind). Do you think that there is a deeper connection between a Tolle-like spiritual awakening and an NDE? Or is the NDE simply another (out of the ordinary) dream-state experience like a siddhi? Would love your take.

User avatar
Webwanderer
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6810
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 12:03 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Webwanderer » Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:44 am

runstrails wrote:? Or is the NDE simply another (out of the ordinary) dream-state experience like a siddhi?
I see is as quite the opposite. If anything this human experience is a dream like state as viewed from the life beyond as described by NDE'rs. Not having an NDE myself however it's just my best guess, but that guess is as informed as I can make it.
Do you think that there is a deeper connection between a Tolle-like spiritual awakening and an NDE?
I do indeed. In the same way Tolle's spiritual awakening transformed his perspective, so too is the perspective of most NDE'rs transformed. Ask Smiileyjen our resident NDE'r, or read her personal account. I get the same sense of increased clarity when I read ET, or Adya, or many other fine writers as I do when I read or listen to near death experiencers. In fact that is one of my guides in forming perspective: does the material I investigate increase my sense of clarity? Does it bring me greater understanding of the human experience? To the degree that it does I look deeper until it takes me no further. I sense I have yet a long way to go in that understanding.

I know some here may not like to hear it, but Abraham-Hicks has also been quite helpful in opening some new insights - especially as related to application of spiritual principles.

Thanks for your interest RT.

WW

runstrails
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 2216
Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:33 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by runstrails » Thu Jul 28, 2011 4:59 am

Yes, I see the connection more clearly now, WW. Thanks.

An NDE allows one to deeply realize the ‘dream state’ that is waking life. As does awakening (via becoming present, residing in/as awareness.) Both, therefore, also result in living everyday life with greater freedom, joy and clarity.

The NDE ‘pointer’(if you will), is much more dramatic and therefore can be more life altering, perhaps similar to the dramatic awakenings like Byron Katie’s and Tolle’s.

For those of us who have never had an NDE, nor an instantaneous Tolle-like awakening, the process [of realizing the dream state) is more gradual and fraught with the kind of mental obstacles that Natalie is describing here. Mind can’t co-opt an NDE or a dramatic awakening—(since they just bypass mind), but it can complicate more gradual realizations of one’s true nature. Still, all paths are pointing to the same place, whichever pointer you follow.

randomguy
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 1:00 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by randomguy » Thu Jul 28, 2011 6:31 am

Thanks for sharing this experience.
What/who originated the initial ‘who is aware that you are aware’ thought? Was it a thought?
I think we could say this is the inner guide, the inner "guru", the intuitive link to the intelligence of what is.
Were you initially disappointed that it wasn’t all that is cracked up to be?
Not really. I had a sense of touching on annihilation, which was perhaps oddly a somewhat happy and exciting set of experiences.
Do the yellow-rose petals
tremble and fall
at the rapid's roar?
- Basho

User avatar
Natalie
Posts: 559
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 9:44 am
Location: Florida, USA

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Natalie » Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:02 am

Thanks xkatex. I will search youtube tonight for the Adya video you suggest, or perhaps his Dharma Cafe site. I really like him.

WW, I am glad you shared that about NDE’s.....the part about the black void at the beginning of the experience. Knowing this has helped demystify them some. I enjoyed reading Anita’s and didn’t get the strange feeling I usually get whenever I hear people discuss heaven or hell or angels or things of that nature. I first heard of Nanci Danison from Andy and have watched some of her youtube videos. They are very good and I find her story very credible or perhaps it is her who I find credible. Perhaps this is because her story is sprinkled with non-duality or because she is an attorney and really, how many attorneys are willing to risk being ridiculed by their peers? (Aware that I am judging here) I find Danison courageous and sincere.

Is not that I have totally closed up myself to the idea of NDE’s or OBE’s, it’s just that I can’t shake off the feeling that we are attracted to these experiences because of the emotional comfort they provide.

You wrote: “Let go of preconceptions and investigate for yourself. You don't have to believe anything about it, but you might just find it insightful.”

How could I begin my investigation? Part of me is afraid you’ll say by reading lots and lots of them on the internet and in books. I guess my fear is based on my belief that this is how some people start to believe in religion, by being exposed to it, by reading books about it, etc. WW, I mean no disrespect, I treasure your contributions to this forum, but for some reason, I am dealing with some major resistance to this issue at this time. I don’t know exactly why. But then, had anyone told me a couple of years ago that they astral travelled, I would have laughed by butt off, but I think my reply of earlier today to Hanss’ post about inner body energy can be pretty much construed as a description of an astral trip. I now ‘know’ that these ‘trips’ are possible because of my direct experience with them. I am learning here to never say never.

Thanks for your words WW.

Randomguy wrote:
I think we could say this is the inner guide, the inner "guru", the intuitive link to the intelligence of what is.
COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Natalie

User avatar
Webwanderer
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6810
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 12:03 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by Webwanderer » Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:19 am

Natalie wrote:How could I begin my investigation? Part of me is afraid you’ll say by reading lots and lots of them on the internet and in books. I guess my fear is based on my belief that this is how some people start to believe in religion, by being exposed to it, by reading books about it, etc.
Natalie, consider what an investigation is. It's a fact finding expedition. By all means keep an honest skepticism. It's certainly not about adopting beliefs or a new kind of faith. It's about enhancing understanding. To the degree that it does so it's worthwhile.

My research into NDE's has revealed a much clearer understanding of the nature of non-duality and how it relates to the human experience. I see nothing in the reports of NDE'ers that contradicts Tolle's basic message. If anything it adds greater clarity. While Tolle's offerings have brought understanding to the nature of ego as related to our essential being, the NDE reports have brought awareness to the purpose of this human experience. That understanding is a paradigm shift from the ingrained concepts standard to most belief structures.

NDE's are either valid experiences or they or not. If they are valid, they offer a window into a greater reality of being than that normally perceived through the limitations of the human mind. The expansion of awareness reported by everyday people is striking. The consistency of experience by diverse people, in diverse times, under diverse conditions, is likewise striking. While advocates of philosophies and religions, and even those within those philosophies and religions, debate the merits of their beliefs, NDE'rs seem to have a common bond based in a spiritual love that transcends the problems of the world - at least those who have the deeper experience that goes beyond a simple nearby OBE.

As in all teachings that can result in a shift in consciousness, let the buyer beware. No doubt there are many who would say this entire forum is filled with nut-cases doomed for hell and eternal damnation, while many others would say we are just another type of religious fanatics that one day will disappear into the nothingness of non-existence. Yet here we are exploring possibilities of the nature of our being. We didn't listen to the nay sayers, but chose to follow our instincts toward our own greater understanding. What I find unique about NDE's is that they are reports on experience, an experience that was not sought after or even understood to exist. They happen completely spontaneously corresponding to the 'apparent' death of the body.

I'm not trying to make a religious believer out of you or anyone else. I'm simply pointing to a door of wondrous possibility based on a genuine, wide ranging and growing phenomena. Should you be interested in pursuing further studies click on the following link. It is a huge resource for NDE information. NDE's are not going away. One report by a research doctor suggests that there are about 600 NDE's happening in the USA alone nearly every day. One can only wonder if a deep NDE by the right person at the right time might just change the world, or that the growing influence of unconditional love being expressed naturally by large numbers of NDE'rs might have a similar effect. I know it's had an effect on me.

http://www.near-death.com/

WW

User avatar
forgotaboutbre
Posts: 236
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by forgotaboutbre » Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:14 pm

To Natalie:

It's not about this belief or that belief, its about disbelief. Not his belief, that guy over there, or her belief, over there, or my beliefs or your own most treasured beliefs. Suspend all belief. Idea structures are not necessary to decode the gates to heaven. All beliefs are PERSPECTIVES through which an incarnate entity has viewed creation or a segment of creation and has then encoded into a set of thought patterns. Why are these primitive attempts to describe the indescribable so treasured? No doubt an overactive Heart center that has feasted excessively off of negative emotion tends to cling to the past. It's a dangerous circle of death when one's misery leads one to indulge in old patterns that induced said misery. Those previous two sentences are how I describe some of my own personal past experience. The point of the game here is to sever all negativity that has accumulated in your form with your focus and your attention . Eckhart Tolle was lucky because in an instant his light burst through and shattered all of the plaque in a dramatic instant. Evidently that is not the road for me as my awakening has unfolded in a much slower fashion. I picked up ET for the first time about 18 months ago. The year and a half before that and the year and a half since have been a time of dramatic shifts in comprehension and personal power. Every day I wake up and I force myself to get back into the thick of it. It is important to set a good mindset at the start of the day, otherwise the dominant subconscious densities you experienced in your sleep will set the tone for your day and your conditioning will run rampant. Take control of your life and slice away the negativity as soon as you see it. Hold that intention. Notice what is happening. Make a conscious decision about what you want in your life. Do it every moment of every day. Do not reflect on the last moment, where you were "unconscious". Do it Now. Always now. Its more than a cute sentiment, its about PRACTICE. Keep doing it! As you notice the benefits you will become more rigorous about your practice and the pace will build.

With love and blessings from the core of my being to yours,

Mike

snowheight
Posts: 1962
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:56 pm

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by snowheight » Sat Jul 30, 2011 1:47 am

Natalie wrote:Then I became aware that I was observing my thoughts and ‘something’ asked: “who is aware that you are aware? It didn’t feel as if it was my mind asking this question, it felt kind of mystical, as if something other than me was speaking silent words inside my head.
I can relate to what you've written here. I've had similar experiences when "chasing the high".

Sometimes, with eyes closed, in a state of no-mind, this will happen, often associated with what is "learned" from something like this (from Ananda, here):
Ananda wrote:Recognise that by the very fact of the vivid awareness of all forms, noises and happenings, that awareness itself is still present. That there are subjective experiences is because you are there to experience them. Your nature never changes, it does not come and go, only experiences do, and you are the sole experiencer, the unchanging seer of a sea of changing things seen. You know your name, so you don't need to keep saying 'alex' in order to know it, you don't need to keep your name on your tongue all of the time. In the same way, you know you are the Self, you do not need to keep staying in self-awareness for you to know it. After abiding in the Self it becomes as familiar to you as your name- even more familiar, this is when knowledge breaks in, and knowledge permanently removes the ignorance which created the false impression of being anything but the Self in the first place.
or this (from kiki, here):
kiki wrote:At some point a realization will arise, "There is an alertness, a stillness, a peacefulness here that is seeing thoughts come and go, and that alertness is constant." This is a wordless realization, and this realization is the initial shift away from identification with ego/mind/thoughts when it's realized that "You" are the alertness itself, You are the stillness itself, You are the peacefulness itself.
The words from these posts don't pop into my head when this happens. Its not even really a memory. There are no concepts involved. No real thoughts. I don't want to bring the "state police" down on me so I won't say it is a state, but if I were to it would be the closest possible explanation...

But I know what you're talking about. The "answer" to this "question" is "known" "at these times". Yes, these "quotes" are "ridiculous" but so are words. All of them. So, in this extreme, is every belief or concept. Every single one. Even the one being conveyed by that sentence. All of them. Just laughable. Wisps. Inconsequential phantoms. Gossamer threads leading back to the physical world of noise and necessity. To say that a belief is a great sturm and drang signifying nothing would be to do an injustice to the Void.

Afterlife? ... who knows. Who really knows? Do you have any control over this? What difference could it possibly make?
Stop talking. Hear every sound as background. Look straight ahead and focus. Take one deep breath. This is you. This is Now.

alex
Posts: 557
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:28 am

Re: A few uneventful moments

Post by alex » Sat Jul 30, 2011 12:32 pm

I mean, is it common for the little self to react with disappointment and fear at the experience described above?
Ooo yes! Fear is a very good indicator that the truth is being realized. When the journey switches from the 'I'm getting more and more conscious and I'm having heaps of happy, peacful moments' to 'wow, I see that the truth and actually living that truth means the annihilation of who I thought I was' it gets kind of scary. Maybe some people have a smooth transition, I don't know - but really I think that if you haven't experienced some serious confusion, doubt and fear then you haven't really gotten anywhere in regards to actual awakening yet.
Keep going with your self enquiry Nat it's such a powerful and essential tool. If you practice honestly asking yourself that question - Who is experiencing these thoughts, your attention will naturally fall back onto that soundless nothingness that you describe. You will be able to keep your attention directly on it for longer and longer. It's such a blessing to know this place, to know that you always always carry peacfull stillness within you. Just right there inside! You can go there anytime you want and all of the world drops away. How liberating! Eventually you will see that you are that fluid peace, it all gets pretty easy after that. :)

Post Reply